Is it a Exploit ? I have more than 100,000 gold with it.

[reversal]

Now I am playing c3c v1.15beta,stardard map with 31 civs,sid level. When you are technology advanced than a few civs,then attack a week civ ,Before you capture his last city,make all your city produce more gold,zero science and luxury invested,Try to sign MA with all civs to that week civ,pay them what they want,and MUST pay them much gpt,so most of them declare war on that one,then sell tech to them,Before the MA,they were all poor guy,But now,they have so much income from me per turn,So they would like buy tech from we.Then you destroy that week civ,The treaty of MA and others(incude you pay them much per turn) will over,and reputation not hurt.But they still pay you much for tech per turn,I'm rich,their treasury were crashed.

DO it again and agian,Now I have more than 12,0000g and from other civs +above 7000 per turn.

I think it's dirty trick,But SID AI too crazy.

 

[Chieftess]

Not quite sure what you're trying to say. You mean, give them your gpt for their tech and declare war on them? That's a known exploit actually, and is frowned upon.

 

[reversal]

It means that sign military alliance with other civs to another civ,
In this MA treaty,I pay my allies gpt for MA,so my allies declare war on "public enemy",then trade with my allies ,sell them techs for gpt,becuase they are rich now.Once I destroy the "public enemy",The MA treaty with my allies were expired,So I'll not pay my allies gpt for expired MA treaty, But they still pay me gpt for techs in next 20 turns.

NOT as you said "give them your gpt for their tech and declare war on them", if you do that ,Reputation will be hurted,and no one will deal with you.

 

[microbe]

Interesting.

 

[Chieftess]

As long as you're not throwing in a peace deal, any alliances and trades are seen as seperate.

 

[reversal]

For Instance

4 civs A,B,C and Me.
I'm fighting with C.
A has no money buy my techs.

With civ A:

********************************
Treaty T1(A <--> Me)
Alliance VS C: Alliance VS C
----------------:2000 gpt
----------------: Gem
----------------: Wine
********************************
Treaty T2(A <--> Me)
1000 gpt : Nationalism,...
********************************

OR

********************************
Treaty T1(A <--> Me)
Trade Embargo VS C : Trade Embargo VS C VS C
---------------------------: 2000 gpt
********************************
Treaty T2(A <--> Me)
1000 gpt: Nationalism,...
********************************

I wipe C off the map immediately after signed T1 and T2,T1 was expired automatically(Civ C not exist).I'll no longer pay A 2000gpt.

But T2 was not broken, A should pay me 1000 gpt.

 

[TheNiceOne]

I'd like to congratulate you for coming up with a creative way to outsmart the AI. I haven't heard of (or though of myself) this trick.

Unfortunately, I think it passes the borders of exploitation. As a rule: If you are unsure whether something is an exploit, it probably is.

Every human player would see that the MA and thus their gpt will be lost within a turn. Using the fact that the AI doesn't understand such a thing is IMHO an exploit.

Now, there's nothing wrong with using exploits in itself, but it makes your victories a bit less satisfying. But if you think its more fun with this exploit, go ahead and use it.

 

[steviejay]

so, am I right in thinking you're giving someone 1000gpt for an alliance against someone, then youn trade a tech with the other civ for 500gpt (your money), they then kill off the weak civ you had the alliance against, so that means you don't have to pay them 1kgpt but they still need to pay you 500gpt??

if thats the case then they'd probably declare war on you to get out of it, I've had that happen before

Steviejay

 

[Gen]

Maybe they will, maybe won't... They might be afraid of your army and even if they pay more than they earn, it costs them only one building and one unit disbanded per turn (deficit penalty). And you don't lose your gold anyway so it's worth trying, especially with as many civs as possible.
Nice trick reversal!

 

[Psyon Ra]

i have had the ai buy tech from me for much gpt, then declare war on me the next turn, so if the ai does it, is it an exploit ?

 

[al_thor]

To me, this is fair trade. It's all part of Diplomacy/War/Foriegn Relations. If you can swindle the AI out of it's cash flow, more power to ya. I find this hilarious, as they are probably Gracious towards you and yet going bankrupt at the same time.
I will definitely keep this in mind and use it at my first opportunity. Not an exploit. More like creative bartering or dog eat dog business.

 

[marioh]

I'd figure the AI would end up declaring war on you since it wouldn't have the money to pay, but apparently not !

Just in my last game, the Inca's declared war on me soon after I signed a ROP with them for 10GPT. I guess they couldn't afford the 10GPT, and then turned around and declared war on me. Not a very smart move as my military is around 20 times stronger than theirs, and they're way behind in technology. Needless to say, their riflemen didn't stand much of a chance against my tanks, artillery, and bombers.

 

[lbhhh]

It's a good trick . IMO I wouldn't really call it an exploit cause you can only do it a limited number of times, and each time you use it it becomes less powerful, as there are less civs left.

 

[Dr Elmer Jiggle]

Suppose you use this trick to create a deal where Civilization A owes you 400 gold per turn. Unfortunately for them, however, they can't afford that, because they're broke and only producing 200 gold per turn. In this hypothetical situation, do you get only 200 gold per turn, or do you still get the full 400 gold per turn?

If you're still actually getting the full 400 gold per turn, then I would say that makes this an exploit (and a bug). If you're getting 400 gold per turn, then you're using this trick to create commerce that doesn't really exist in the global economy.

On the other hand, if you suffer the penalty and only get 200 gold per turn, then good for you. Take the AI for all you can.

 

[microbe]

Originally posted by al_thor
To me, this is fair trade. It's all part of Diplomacy/War/Foriegn Relations. If you can swindle the AI out of it's cash flow, more power to ya.

I agree. There are two trades involved, and either one is fair. It effectively just forces AI to turn the gpt cash from spending in researching a tech to buying a tech from you. It's a trick, but a very nice one, and I see no reason it should be called an exploit.

And also as other people pointed out, there are limits in using it. If you make AI actually bankrupt this way, then yes this is kinda exploitative.

I'd suggest reversal write something formal up and put it into War Academy.

 

[sabo]

I don't think it's an exploit, I'm sure there are some unconcience human players playing MP that would look at the GPT and fall for that trick too. Especially if they are unaware that civ only has one city left and was about to be pounced upon.

Besides when you play deity or sid you need to play a "no holds barred" type of game, (well I do anyway)

Good call Reversal! I like it!!

 

[reversal]

Originally posted by Psyon Ra
i have had the ai buy tech from me for much gpt, then declare war on me the next turn, so if the ai does it, is it an exploit ?

Guard every city with above 8 best defenders,The borderland near the strong rivals guard with army,Guard your resources ,Guard mountain near citys.
Even in SID,the AI seldom attack. Once you find AI move a stack of troops toward one of your city,reinforce that city with more defender.

 

[steviejay]

erm...... reversal, yeah, they do. I'm playing my first Emperor game and its a slugfest, I can only assume in thehigher levels ts worse, but the AI is always fighting

Steviejay

 

[ironmikie]

hey reversal!just wanted to say tat i tried it last nite and it works!nice call there!

not only am i leading the tech race, i'm also enjoying the part where i offer them a tech and they can only pay me the world map!(of course i didn't let them have the tech)

edit: I think you should really write this and post it on the war academy

edit2: really good job!

 

[TerraHero]

Another good way is by getting cities, then selling em for 20gold per turn or sumthing...thhis will never expire and they will always pay you

capture the city with war and sell it again and get more money

totaly exploit..but fun..