Is Orthus too easy?

[brainpan]

Maybe Orthus can have an ability like Barnaxus, where some of his promotions are passed on to barbians (while he is alive). Or, perhaps his combat promotions can work like empowerment--like summons.

Brilliant! I don't know if that fits with the story line, but I like that idea a lot. Many a multi-player game I have attended, some poor noob gets owned by Orthus while the rest of us laugh. We would laugh less if we were suddenly beset by +5 barbarians invading from every corner!

 

[Grey Fox]

Somebody take out Orthus!

Actually, now that every unit got +1 STR, Orthus is even easier to kill than he used to be.

Start him with march I'd say, and test it out. Maybe we should make a modmod with just an Orthus change and see how it is?

 

[Spearthrower]

I voted that he was easy.

In my most recent game he spawned within my capital's cultural borders (not the fat cross, but still within). I had 2 Blood Pets 2 tiles from him, 1 was 0xp, the other had a couple of promotions. I sent the unpromoted one in, naturally he died, but he took Orthus down to less than half life giving my second warrior 100% chance to win.

In earlier versions, I remember being afraid of him spawning..... with his difficulty at present, he's barely worth the notification! He's described as a destroyer of nations, so I think that's what he should be.... perhaps he can be forced to spawn far from everyone and also gain experience per turn, thereby making it a bit more of a race to get to him before he becomes too powerful. Whatever happens, I vote for making him *considerably* stronger!

 

[carn]

Start him with march I'd say, and test it out. Maybe we should make a modmod with just an Orthus change and see how it is?

I think march will have the greatest effect. As i described somewhere else, Orthus will never rest and heal, therefore whatever his str, he will die soon.

 

[KingOfLands]

In the last game I played, Orthus managed to do me a huge favor: he knocked down a Svartalfar town which they'd founded right up against my borders. Then he rushed the warriors I'd had escorting a settler to that spot before it got stolen, and got himself killed. I came out of that with Combat 5, the Axe, and March. The axe-toting warrior in question then did nearly all the work in the ensuing war with the Svartalfar.

If Orthus had been the one with March instead of my warrior, I think he'd have managed to wreak a lot more havoc. It'd be nice to see him get it.

 

[Nikis-Knight]

Maybe the axe should give march instead of blitz? Orthus doesn't get two moves anyway, so he doesn't benefit from that. And getting the Axe as is on Rosier or Valin is a bit overwhelming.

 

[KingOfLands]

Maybe the axe should give march instead of blitz? Orthus doesn't get two moves anyway, so he doesn't benefit from that. And getting the Axe as is on Rosier or Valin is a bit overwhelming.

It's pretty bad on infantry with mobility, too. Especially Brujah.

I'd kind of like to see it give both, honestly - it's a lot more desirable for Blitz, given how far down the tech-tree it is otherwise.

 

[Greeneyedzombie]

orthus only once managed to take out a civ. He ussually dies within ten turns of his appearance. giving him march would definatly help him.

 

[Micky Onimusha]

Well, I've just had a NASTY Orthus Experience. After he spawned, south of my Neighbour (who was between me and him), he wiped them out. It was over several turns and to be honest, I completely forgot he was around. My nearest city wasn't too lightly defended, I had 1 well promoted Warrior (Def/Combat 2/+40% vs. Melee), a second Warrior and a Wood Golem. The moment I saw Orthus I also sent two other Warriors (Def/Combat 2 and Combat 1/+40% vs. Melee/+40% vs. Orcs) to reinforce the city.

All the while the barbs had been slinging at me constantly. I had set it to Raging Barbs but the numbers I was facing astounded me, I had never seen so many before, but that's off topic.

Anyway, Orthus shows up by my city gates with Commando and Combat 5, at full health (it seems my neighbour put up a fight and or thus benefited from it). Because my roads were pillaged, my reinforcements didn't arrive until he'd taken out my Wood Golem and my Def/Combat 2 Warrior. He then proceeded to pick off my guys one by one. I'm not sure if he got a promotion in between but my units only got him down to half health by the end of it. That's one city raised.

Then, Orthus turned his eye to my other (non-capital) city, which was lightly defended because my reinforcements from that city had abandoned it to protect the (now raised) other city. Obviously, I couldn't put up much of a fight, and it got taken with ease.

I'm still actually in the game right now, and I'm not sure what his next move will be. He's between me and the Clan of Embers. If he's still allied with the Clan of Embers, then I guess my Capital will be his next destination, if not, then he'll probably go visit the Clan (who'll probably beat him now that he's a little weakened). Either way, he's done enough to cripple me completely and on all sides, except for the Clan of Embers, I'm surrounded by Barb cities and the subsequent barbs pouring out of them (I assume he has at least 4 cities, my one, two of my neighbours and another one that appears to be natural [and holds the dragon, urgh]).

The difficulty is (only) Prince and on Raging Barbs (with 0.23A installed), and whilst I certainly believe a better player in my position could’ve handled him, I was, in all honesty just not prepared to deal with him. Until he showed up at my borders I had forgotten about him. My defensive forces were enough for the constant stream of barbs but they couldn't stand up to the might of Orthus.

So, all in all, Orthus has eliminated one civ and crippled my own to the point of no return, which is basically two civs fallen to the might of Orthus

I admit, this is the first time this has ever happened to me with Orthus (although I have seen him eliminate civs before), but it's enough to make me respect him. I don't think I'll ever doubt his power from now on. He's king of the barbs for a reason

/goes off to pick up the bloodied leftovers of his dwarf army.

 

[Grey Fox]

Sounds like a fun game. I wouldn't give up on it if I were you

 

[Jono]

There are a lot of solutions to Orthus' weakness here, my personal favourite was Goblin summoning. My suggestion would be to simply make Orthus spawn earlier with an additional movement point and the goblin summoning ability.

 

[Micky Onimusha]

Sounds like a fun game. I wouldn't give up on it if I were you

Heh I didn't, but I got defeated in the end.

I continued further. To my surprise, Orthus headed South-West, to Ethne's civ, and took one of her cities (I sent a scout to check it out and he was still full health). His rampage stopped after that though, he didn't take any more cities but I didn't hear of his axe changing hands either. Clan of Embers were still buddy-buddy with the Barbs to, and they declared war on me. Orthus didn’t finish me off, but they decided they would. My Golems and Warriors put up a valiant fight, but numbers overwhelmed and eventually the orange orcs took me down.

All in all, I learnt and important lesson from that game. All hail King Orthus! All hail King Orthus!

Edit: Ironically, on the next game: Orthus appears > A few turns > Orthus's Axe has changed hands. King Orthus is very inconsistent

 

[marioflag]

IMO Orthus should have at least another Strenght point, in 0.22 was weak he died after a few turns, now it's even more weaker with the +1 strenght to all units.
I would also see the Orthus Axe giving an higher bonus to Orthus or whoever bring it.

 

[BeefontheBone]

King Orthus is very inconsistent

He's kinda supposed to be. As I said somewhere, I expect to see him get a boost on BtS and be generated by a random event, so that the fact that he won't always appear means he can be noticeably nastier without upsetting overall balance. Also, disabling events (or a few lines of commenting to just affect Orthy) would then remove him if you don't want axe temptation in your games

 

[dscarron]

My 2 cents: There should not be a pointer for when he appears.

After all, he's not nearly as fearful as the Unknown:

When he's on top of me I build up and counter attack
When he's in medium range I make a head hunting party (after he mops up an empire or two).

If he could be ANYWHERE... I would have to try to defend everything... and thus be more likely to defend and lose a city or two... or worse.

 

[Sarisin]

My 2 cents: There should not be a pointer for when he appears.

After all, he's not nearly as fearful as the Unknown:

When he's on top of me I build up and counter attack
When he's in medium range I make a head hunting party (after he mops up an empire or two).

If he could be ANYWHERE... I would have to try to defend everything... and thus be more likely to defend and lose a city or two... or worse.

Good point! Maybe the same thing for when Acheron spawns - although lately it appears to be near the same spot where Orthus appeared.

I like your strategy for dealing with him as he is revealed on the map now.

 

[Jono]

The AI doesn't use the pointer to kill him, and really, there's no point in preparing for him — 2 warriors and he's dead.

 

[Homunculus]

3/3 he was an easy kill in my experience.. Twice he was mine to a couple of unupgraded hunters (okay, I do play on a fairly low difficulty ) third time he got himself killed in no time attacking some AI civ (without doing any noticable damage)

 

[Gabriel21]

Orthus makes sometimes the mistake not to heal before attacking. So then he is quite easily killed. Otherwise he is tougher. The bonus of the axe now (in .23) is too less IMO, some more benefits such as MagisterCultum listed would be more interesting. It is good to have him quite near.

 

[Thonnas]

He should probably start out w/ a respectable amount of experience so that he isn't promoting every time he wins a battle, but really the part about him that is too easy is the AI. He should be leading an army or at the very least a band of marauders, not wandering aimlessly about the country side. He shouldn't be a super difficult unit to kill by himself, but he shouldn't BE by himself. Perhaps the AI in BtS will improve this, or can be improved to affect this.