Thrust123
Prince
- Joined
- Apr 21, 2004
- Messages
- 383
COPYING THIS conversation from the Quick Answers Newbie Question forum where I originally posted, as I think it can benefit others here:
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Thrust123 said:
Hi,
Working on a mod/scenario for C3C
Is there any way I can limit the amount of one specific unit that can be built ? For example, if I have a unit called the 34th Scots Regiment, can I set the scenario so that this unit can only be built once in the whole game?
I was also going to ask how to disable advance into the modern era, but I guess that's something I can do in the Edit Rules section of the Editor.
Thanks
====
Agonistes replied:
No. I am fairly sure you CANNOT limit it to being built only once.
You can add one in at the beginning of the game, if you want, of course.
Something I have seen done to limit construction of units: Make an improvement that builds the unit every 90 turns or so, then make the improvement obsolete upon discovering a certain tech.
It won't be perfect, but it will be passable I think.
If you only want the player to be able to build it, you can even stack the limits by having the improvement that builds the unit require ANOTHER improvement to be in the city to build it, and have THAT improvement (the first one) become obsolete too, thereby making it even more unlikely that the AI will build the unit.
But if you are considering have a multitude of unique units, you are creating quite a headache for yourself.
====
Takhisis replied:
See the EFZI scenarios for unique units and upgrades
====
Vudacon replied:
You can pre-place the 34th Scots Regiment in a City for a particular CIV. Flag the Unit as available to all Civs with 0 Attack and 0 Defense so any Civ can capture it if the City is captured. Also set Cannot be disbanded. You then set the 34th Scots Regiment to Upgrade, only for the CIV you intend it for, with the settings you want it to have when that CIV Gains a required Resource. The Upgrade would be a King Unit unless you look into the King Unit "work around" as Civinator has posted about. The Reason to flag the Unit available to all CIVs is to prevent it from being Killed if the City is captured. Then the Civ You intended it for can Recapture the City with the Unit and continue to Upgrade it.
Another way would be to Pre-place a Wonder that will Auto-produce the 34th Scots Regiment. The Pre-placed Wonder is set to Require a Luxury or Strategic Resource that will be gained later. If you set up the timing for the Resource appearance and the number of turns required to Auto-produce the 34th Scots Regiment correctly, you may be able to have Only one produced in the game. The number of turns required to Auto-produce the 34th Scots Regiment starts from the 1st game turn because the Wonder that Auto-produces it has been Pre-placed. The Wonder would otherwise require the Resource to be able to directly Build it. The Wonder exists and all setting for it will be in effect other than the ability to Auto-produce the Unit until the required resource is gained. Example: Let say your game has a total of 200 Turns. You could set the number of turns required to Auto-produce the 34th Scots Regiment to 101. You then set the required Resource to appear on Turn 101 by using a Tech that will be discovered then. The 34th Scots Regiment would be "Built" on turn 101 when the Required resource is gained because at least 101 turns will have taken place from the start of the game and the Resource that is required has been gained... another 101 turns will be required to Auto-produce again... this would be on turn 202, 2 turns after the game ends so you could only have one in the game.
Naturally, You need control of when Techs are gained and Resources appear to control the timing of when you want the 34th Scots Regiment to be "Built" =Auto-produced.
note: When a Wonder is Pre-placed, the Advisor will state that the Wonder is being Built at the start of the Game. This is because Wonders are Built, Not Pre-placed and the Programing does not understand. I set the Pre-placed Wonder to also require 10 Armies to be built to prevent the Advisor statement. There are No Armies in EFZI2 Complete.
When you Pre-place the 34th Scots Regiment in a Town or City for the CIV you want to have it, Name it 34th Scots Regiment. In the Editor, you can name it by a different name such as Scots Regiment and the Upgraded Unit to 34th Scots Regiment. The point being that when you name the Unit on the Map, the Upgraded Unit will keep that same Name. Now when you Upgrade the Unit, the Advisor will ask if you want to Upgrade the Scots Regiment to the 34th Scots Regiment but the Unit on the map will be named 34th Scots Regiment. Use your imagination and judgement for the Name of the Pre-placed Unit that will upgrade. Players will only see what you named the Units in the editor when the Avisor asks if you want to Upgrade it.
...An example of this is Jake Stranded and Jake Recovered in EFZI2 Complete. Those are the Names for the Unit and Upgrade Unit in the editor. On the Map when I pre-placed Jake Stranded, I renamed him Jake. Then when he is Upgraded the advisor will ask if I want to Upgrade Jake Stranded to Jake Recovered... and the Name of the Unit on the map will be just Jake. I explain how Jake is Stranded an wants to be rescued.
...sometimes it is not easy or fast but give it all some thought and I am sure you will find a good solution for your Game.
====
Thrust123 replied:
Thanks for all the good ideas.
Regarding the Wonder pre-placing idea, if I make it require a SR that will be gained later, once that SR resource appears it coould appear anywhere on the map though, making it random if I can have that resource available for the interested civilization, as it can be far away from any of the cities of that civilization. Couldn't I just pre-place a wonder making it auto-produce the unit at a given time (say on turn 50) without needing any resource to do that?
====
Thrust123... To answer your question, YES. Because you are making a Scenario, you can place the Resources where you want them on the map.
You can set the Wonder where it has No Required Resource and it will Auto-produce the Unit according to the number of turns you set in the editor.
I mentioned the Resource because it adds another aspect for more control IF needed.
I cannot know when you want the Unit to be produced or the number of turns you have in your game.
IF you do not require a Resource to help set up when you want the unit to be "Built" for timing... then simply place the Wonder and set the number of turns it will Auto-produce the unit you want.
I am certain you understand the timing factor so if you only want one Unit in your game just do the math and have it Auto-produced when you want and without enough time in the game to produce another one. A resource can allow you to be more specific IF needed because the number of turns and when the Resource becomes available dictate exactly when the Unit will be "Built". You could set a unit to be produced every turn but the unit will not be produced until you gain the Resource.
It can be confusing... Units can require a Resource to be Directly Built but IF a Unit is Auto-produced by a Wonder or Improvement, it is the Wonder or Improvement that requires the Resource to be Functional or able to Produce the Unit.
That said, you could have the same Unit in a Game where it is Both Auto-produced by an Improvement or Wonder as well as able to be directly Built. I have this in EFZI2 Complete. The difference is if the Unit requires a Resource to be directly Built, you must have the Resource flagged as a Requirement for the Unit. IF an Improvement or Wonder is set up to produce a Unit they can with No Resources but IF the Pre-placed Improvement or Wonder are set up to Require a Resource to be able to Build them Directly and you Pre-place them... You have the Improvement or Wonder Before the Required Resource is available. This is what prevents the Improvement or Wonder from being able to Produce the Unit because the Improvement or Wonder could Not have been built without the Required Resource to Built it. This, by the way, is also the reason why the Advisor will state that the Pre-placed Wonder is being Built when you start the game... it is programed to Build Only... Not understand Pre-placed Wonders.
It is the Resource that is set as a Requirement for the Improvement or Wonder that will dictate when the Pre-placed Improvement or Wonder actually exists and can produce Units. But remember all flagged settings will be in affect other than producing Units... This is all simply taking advantage of the programming. It exists yet cannot
It is as if the Improvement or Wonder is there, yet cannot be there because it required a Resource to be Built in the first place. The programming allow us to take advantage of the Flags that will work from the start for Pre-placed Improvements or Wonders but the the same programming does not allow the production of Units from an Improvement or Wonder that could not be Built because the Required Resource had Not been gained.
Hope I am explaining this where it makes any sense.
Cheers,
Vuldacon
====
Thrust12 replied:
Thanks Vudacon, I think I understand what you mean. The game will have roughly 120 turns so I would probably use the resource idea with the auto-produce.
I hope you and others that replied don't mind but I am copying all this conversation to the Creation and Customization forum because I think it can benefit others looking specifically for this subject.
CONTINUE THIS CONVERSATION IN THE CREATION AND CUSTOMIZATION FORUM PLS.
====
=====
Thrust123 said:
Hi,
Working on a mod/scenario for C3C
Is there any way I can limit the amount of one specific unit that can be built ? For example, if I have a unit called the 34th Scots Regiment, can I set the scenario so that this unit can only be built once in the whole game?
I was also going to ask how to disable advance into the modern era, but I guess that's something I can do in the Edit Rules section of the Editor.
Thanks
====
Agonistes replied:
No. I am fairly sure you CANNOT limit it to being built only once.
You can add one in at the beginning of the game, if you want, of course.
Something I have seen done to limit construction of units: Make an improvement that builds the unit every 90 turns or so, then make the improvement obsolete upon discovering a certain tech.
It won't be perfect, but it will be passable I think.
If you only want the player to be able to build it, you can even stack the limits by having the improvement that builds the unit require ANOTHER improvement to be in the city to build it, and have THAT improvement (the first one) become obsolete too, thereby making it even more unlikely that the AI will build the unit.
But if you are considering have a multitude of unique units, you are creating quite a headache for yourself.
====
Takhisis replied:
See the EFZI scenarios for unique units and upgrades
====
Vudacon replied:
You can pre-place the 34th Scots Regiment in a City for a particular CIV. Flag the Unit as available to all Civs with 0 Attack and 0 Defense so any Civ can capture it if the City is captured. Also set Cannot be disbanded. You then set the 34th Scots Regiment to Upgrade, only for the CIV you intend it for, with the settings you want it to have when that CIV Gains a required Resource. The Upgrade would be a King Unit unless you look into the King Unit "work around" as Civinator has posted about. The Reason to flag the Unit available to all CIVs is to prevent it from being Killed if the City is captured. Then the Civ You intended it for can Recapture the City with the Unit and continue to Upgrade it.
Another way would be to Pre-place a Wonder that will Auto-produce the 34th Scots Regiment. The Pre-placed Wonder is set to Require a Luxury or Strategic Resource that will be gained later. If you set up the timing for the Resource appearance and the number of turns required to Auto-produce the 34th Scots Regiment correctly, you may be able to have Only one produced in the game. The number of turns required to Auto-produce the 34th Scots Regiment starts from the 1st game turn because the Wonder that Auto-produces it has been Pre-placed. The Wonder would otherwise require the Resource to be able to directly Build it. The Wonder exists and all setting for it will be in effect other than the ability to Auto-produce the Unit until the required resource is gained. Example: Let say your game has a total of 200 Turns. You could set the number of turns required to Auto-produce the 34th Scots Regiment to 101. You then set the required Resource to appear on Turn 101 by using a Tech that will be discovered then. The 34th Scots Regiment would be "Built" on turn 101 when the Required resource is gained because at least 101 turns will have taken place from the start of the game and the Resource that is required has been gained... another 101 turns will be required to Auto-produce again... this would be on turn 202, 2 turns after the game ends so you could only have one in the game.
Naturally, You need control of when Techs are gained and Resources appear to control the timing of when you want the 34th Scots Regiment to be "Built" =Auto-produced.
note: When a Wonder is Pre-placed, the Advisor will state that the Wonder is being Built at the start of the Game. This is because Wonders are Built, Not Pre-placed and the Programing does not understand. I set the Pre-placed Wonder to also require 10 Armies to be built to prevent the Advisor statement. There are No Armies in EFZI2 Complete.
When you Pre-place the 34th Scots Regiment in a Town or City for the CIV you want to have it, Name it 34th Scots Regiment. In the Editor, you can name it by a different name such as Scots Regiment and the Upgraded Unit to 34th Scots Regiment. The point being that when you name the Unit on the Map, the Upgraded Unit will keep that same Name. Now when you Upgrade the Unit, the Advisor will ask if you want to Upgrade the Scots Regiment to the 34th Scots Regiment but the Unit on the map will be named 34th Scots Regiment. Use your imagination and judgement for the Name of the Pre-placed Unit that will upgrade. Players will only see what you named the Units in the editor when the Avisor asks if you want to Upgrade it.
...An example of this is Jake Stranded and Jake Recovered in EFZI2 Complete. Those are the Names for the Unit and Upgrade Unit in the editor. On the Map when I pre-placed Jake Stranded, I renamed him Jake. Then when he is Upgraded the advisor will ask if I want to Upgrade Jake Stranded to Jake Recovered... and the Name of the Unit on the map will be just Jake. I explain how Jake is Stranded an wants to be rescued.
...sometimes it is not easy or fast but give it all some thought and I am sure you will find a good solution for your Game.
====
Thrust123 replied:
Thanks for all the good ideas.
Regarding the Wonder pre-placing idea, if I make it require a SR that will be gained later, once that SR resource appears it coould appear anywhere on the map though, making it random if I can have that resource available for the interested civilization, as it can be far away from any of the cities of that civilization. Couldn't I just pre-place a wonder making it auto-produce the unit at a given time (say on turn 50) without needing any resource to do that?
====
Thrust123... To answer your question, YES. Because you are making a Scenario, you can place the Resources where you want them on the map.
You can set the Wonder where it has No Required Resource and it will Auto-produce the Unit according to the number of turns you set in the editor.
I mentioned the Resource because it adds another aspect for more control IF needed.
I cannot know when you want the Unit to be produced or the number of turns you have in your game.
IF you do not require a Resource to help set up when you want the unit to be "Built" for timing... then simply place the Wonder and set the number of turns it will Auto-produce the unit you want.
I am certain you understand the timing factor so if you only want one Unit in your game just do the math and have it Auto-produced when you want and without enough time in the game to produce another one. A resource can allow you to be more specific IF needed because the number of turns and when the Resource becomes available dictate exactly when the Unit will be "Built". You could set a unit to be produced every turn but the unit will not be produced until you gain the Resource.
It can be confusing... Units can require a Resource to be Directly Built but IF a Unit is Auto-produced by a Wonder or Improvement, it is the Wonder or Improvement that requires the Resource to be Functional or able to Produce the Unit.
That said, you could have the same Unit in a Game where it is Both Auto-produced by an Improvement or Wonder as well as able to be directly Built. I have this in EFZI2 Complete. The difference is if the Unit requires a Resource to be directly Built, you must have the Resource flagged as a Requirement for the Unit. IF an Improvement or Wonder is set up to produce a Unit they can with No Resources but IF the Pre-placed Improvement or Wonder are set up to Require a Resource to be able to Build them Directly and you Pre-place them... You have the Improvement or Wonder Before the Required Resource is available. This is what prevents the Improvement or Wonder from being able to Produce the Unit because the Improvement or Wonder could Not have been built without the Required Resource to Built it. This, by the way, is also the reason why the Advisor will state that the Pre-placed Wonder is being Built when you start the game... it is programed to Build Only... Not understand Pre-placed Wonders.
It is the Resource that is set as a Requirement for the Improvement or Wonder that will dictate when the Pre-placed Improvement or Wonder actually exists and can produce Units. But remember all flagged settings will be in affect other than producing Units... This is all simply taking advantage of the programming. It exists yet cannot
It is as if the Improvement or Wonder is there, yet cannot be there because it required a Resource to be Built in the first place. The programming allow us to take advantage of the Flags that will work from the start for Pre-placed Improvements or Wonders but the the same programming does not allow the production of Units from an Improvement or Wonder that could not be Built because the Required Resource had Not been gained.
Hope I am explaining this where it makes any sense.
Cheers,
Vuldacon
====
Thrust12 replied:
Thanks Vudacon, I think I understand what you mean. The game will have roughly 120 turns so I would probably use the resource idea with the auto-produce.
I hope you and others that replied don't mind but I am copying all this conversation to the Creation and Customization forum because I think it can benefit others looking specifically for this subject.
CONTINUE THIS CONVERSATION IN THE CREATION AND CUSTOMIZATION FORUM PLS.
====
