Maps are poorly made

[CrazyHeaven]

Some civs depend on the map to work. I just picked Venice with rings to play on a MP map. It said each civ would get it's own island. I started out next to an ocean and happily plopped down my only city. The ocean was surrounded by land. It was fairly large but still only land with no outlets. No city states near me even though I put 55 in game, didn't see any. I did however find AI on my land, not near the ocean but he was on my land even though the map said we would each get our own.

 

[joncnunn]

The Ring map is limited to at most 5 city states; all of which are in the islands in the middle of the map; if it runs out of eligible spots (which is likely on all map sizes smaller than Large), it kills the surplus ones in 4000 BC.

Not really the best map script for either Venice or Austria.

But actually I think fixing city state placement (on all map types) is a much higher priority. It's all too often the case that the city state is one or two hexes away from where it should have been located.

 

[CrazyHeaven]

So what is the best map for venice? I'm trying out difference ones without much success. I think the entire point of making Venice be near the coast was so it could have access to other civs via ships.

Just found another post talking about this. But I'm sure Venice isn't the only civ with this problem. It seems like all the game needs is a little more rules when making an ocean in the sense that oceans have to be somehow connected with the open world or it isn't really an ocean?

 

[Bobert13]

But actually I think fixing city state placement (on all map types) is a much higher priority. It's all too often the case that the city state is one or two hexes away from where it should have been located.

What makes you say this? From my experience with map scripts, I'd say City State placement is working as intended. When generating the map, it first breaks everything down into regions and subregions, categorizes them (river/desert/ocean/etc.), then determines the viability of each by seeing what Resources, Bonus Tiles, and Natural Wonders randomly spawned in each. From here it places players first, and adds a few extra tiles to the start locations if needed (A second Luxury Resource for example). Then, it places City States; improving them with Strategics and Bonus tiles if needed (but not a Luxury).

@OP, I don't think you really understood what the Ring Map Script did, which is understandable, as the Tool Tips can only infer so much information. Also, it states that you'll be placed on your own "subcontinent"; all the subcontinents are connected by isthmuses with a center continent specifically for City States. Rings is generally a bad map type for any Leader relying on or benefiting from city states. And the larger you make the Ring Map, the worse the effect is.

Venice would definitely benefit from any of the water maps (Small Continents, Large Islands, and Archipelago) with the latter two possibly being the best for it's UU as the Great Galleas is limited to coastal water and it's not uncommon for huge island strings to be connected via coastal water on them. That being said, Venice can do well on almost any map if played to the best of their UA and UUs capabilities. You could even completely forgo puppeting City States with MoVs and still do quite well between purchasing and conquest.

 

[Tyrvos]

So what is the best map for venice? I'm trying out difference ones without much success. I think the entire point of making Venice be near the coast was so it could have access to other civs via ships.

Just found another post talking about this. But I'm sure Venice isn't the only civ with this problem. It seems like all the game needs is a little more rules when making an ocean in the sense that oceans have to be somehow connected with the open world or it isn't really an ocean?

Continents is always a safe choice. The only time coastal bias messed up was in a Carthage game I played. It turned out the coast I had was to a 12 tile lake. Luckily I wasn't Venice. That was a very rare occasion but there should be a way to prevent that.

 

[Bobert13]

Continents is always a safe choice. The only time coastal bias messed up was in a Carthage game I played. It turned out the coast I had was to a 12 tile lake. Luckily I wasn't Venice. That was a very rare occasion but there should be a way to prevent that.

I believe lake determination was improved in BNW (to go along with Crabs and Oil no longer spawning in Lakes where they're unimprovable). I could be wrong though.

 

[CrazyHeaven]

Continents is always a safe choice. The only time coastal bias messed up was in a Carthage game I played. It turned out the coast I had was to a 12 tile lake. Luckily I wasn't Venice. That was a very rare occasion but there should be a way to prevent that.

It has happened to me more times than I can count. Maybe I have really bad luck but I seem to be landing on a lot of lakes with like 3 ocean tiles in the middle. I guess when that happens I have to go conquest. But if I'm on a large island(this has happened to me more than once), and happen to settle my first city on said island with what I thought was the ocean but in fact it turned out to be a lake. What should I do with no coastal cities around me? To me, this would be game breaking. On emperor or harder I'd have to use my one city to go to war with the AI's, assuming I have one near me and no city states and be forced to wait until it settled a city on a coast before taking anything.

Looks like I should probably stick with Small Continents or similar maps. I want to play on maps where everyone has a good chance of winning and not have a total bias for my chosen civ.