Markets & Banks OR Library & Uni??

[Sucha_Soorma]

Wondering if someone here can help,

I usually build both the Science building and Money buildings.
But it has just dawned on me that the buildings don't adjust the base rate of gold.

So building a Bank makes no differece to the Science output- or very little.

Leading on from this I guess there is little point in building Wall Street & Oxford Uni in same city?

Could someone who knows more about the game give me a quick overview of how these buildings impact the science & gold. I usually have sci very high all throughout my game. I'm trying to improve my city specialisation.

Thanks

 

[madscientist]

You may be confusing commerce and gold

Commerce is what you get from working certain tiles in the city screen and from trade routes. You palace also gives you a base of 8 commerce.

Gold is what you get to pay the bills. This comes from certain buildings, religion shrines, certain wonders, and specialists. I also comes from the slider as a percentage of commerce. Example if you slider is at 20% and you are getting 100 commerce, you civilization gets 20 base gold.

Beakers are what you use for research. Similar to gold it comes from buildings, specialists, and the slider. Say you research is 80%, with 100 commerce that's 80 beakers from commerce.

A library multiplies the net beakers, so your 80 beakers get and extra 20 if you have a library, another 20 with a university, and 40 if you have an academy. Oxford get's you an extra 80 beakers. Works on all beakers too (exception, if you build beakers rather than building units or buildings).

Markets/banks work the same way. a bank with you 20 gold from the commerce slider gets you an extra 10 gold. Markets/grocers/banks work on shrine incomes also, a shrine with 10 gold output get's an extra 5 from a bank.

All said and done, if you capital has alot of commerce and you are running the Bureacracy civic (+50% to commerce BEFORE slider conversion) Oxford will definitely help the science output of the capital. On the other hand if you got an early relifgion that's shrined and well spread Wall Street would definitely help.

Hope this helps.

 

[Sucha_Soorma]

Thanks that makes a lot of sense.
Sounds like I've been overbuilding in a lot of cities.
So the Shrine doesn't impact the commerce but the gold. Also I assume that a city that contains a lot of parked Great Merchants should concentrate on the Markets/banks.... as they don't affect the base commerece and thus the Science.

 

[Ray Patterson]

Indeed. What to build also depends on your tech/tax rates, or what you're anticipating. If you are at 80% research/20% tax, libraries always take priority over markets, even though on the long run this may mean your tax rate increases. That's a fine balance. I think there are few issues I spend more time debating with myself than whether to build a market, library or courthouse first in a certain city.

If there is a shrine city it's always the one that gets my Wall Street indeed, while Oxford tends to go to the most efficient cottage spam city (I suppose some people would have a scientist city, but that's not my style). Rarely are they the same city. But the Wall Street city is obviously always the one where corporations are founded...

 

[CivCorpse]

It can depend on a copule of other factors as well. What is your produciton in the city you are trying to decide on? If it is pretty pathetic. I would library/uni it. If you're creative or philosophical then a hammer poor commerce rich city should definately be library/uni.

If you have fair production available i would build both. The libraries/uni because science is king. And the market/bank allow you to make more of the commerce you are using to pay the bills which in turn frees up more commerce for science.
Examaple. market/grocer/bank double your commerce designated for gold. If you have 100 commerce and need 40 to pay the bills. without the cash buildings. you run 40% cash 60% science. So if you have a library/uni/observatory as well. You net 120 beakers
With all the cash buildings you can get your 40 gold at 20% cash 80% scince...for a net of 180beakers.
I usually look at where my slider is. if i am below50% i definately build markets. If above I build libraries. I try and build the one that will affect the largest amount of commerce.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Virtually every non-military city I make winds up with at least a library, market, and grocer. The latter two can double up the effectiveness of certain happiness and health resources, and as such have more contribution than just their gold multipliers. Library is the cheapest 25% modifier in the game, allows you to run early scientists if you need to, and is required for university anyway.

After that, make what impacts the slider the most. If you're at 20% science 80% gold thanks to warmonger expansion, banks and the aforementioned markets/grocers would be the priority. If you're at 70% or more, favor the science buildings, they'll help you more. Around 50% it's a judgment call, but the rule of thumb is to favor science buildings there also, unless you plan to war more or go for a rush-buy approach.

 

[pangu]

I used to build NE and Oxford in my capital, and put up a WS in one of the shrine cities. I always ran representation as soon as I could get it (either with Mids or when I get constitution). I settled GPs in capital.

However, last week, I have figured out that it may be better to get both Oxford and WS in the shrine city. So, the capital will be spamming wonders to get the GP points and all the GPs are settled in the shrine city. That way, the +3 beakers from any GPs due to representation are also increased due to Oxford. The 1st Academy obviously also goes to the shrine city. The capital now usually gets NE and then either Heroic Epic (if I went for early wars and settled 2-3 generals in the capital) or Ironworks (to help with spamming late wonders). A third food rich city (GP farm) will probably get GT and NP.

 

[Aardan]

I used to build every building under the sun, and it might be the way to go if you have a limited number of cities as you need to maximize the output from those cities.
Recently, I have taken a more aggressive approach and have decided to take out one or two AIs. I found out quickly that a little research and money from many cities was better than a lot of reseach and money from a few cities. In fact I recently played a game where I did not build any library, university grocer... and was running at 50% research, yet, I still out-researched all the other AI by a long shot.
Whatever, you choose, do not neglect your military whether for attacking or defending at the cost of getting those buildings.
I do find that grocers and markets are better than the research buildings because they add health and happiness.
Hope this helps.