Monarch Student^ II - Augustus Caesar

Meatbuster

formerly Robo Kai
Joined
Dec 6, 2005
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Philippines
Let's continue with the fun maps. What could be "easier" than Praetorians on a Pangaea?


Augustus Caesar of the Romans is all about building... that is, building fast wonders and forges with IND, and building more cities and better troops with IMP.

Like the English before them, Rome starts with knowledge of Fishing and Mining.

MS2-1.jpg



The famous Praetorians are the Roman unique units. They are much stronger than a regular swordie, but are more pricey. Such is the power they wield, it's worth the extra hammers.

MS2-2.jpg



Rome's unique building is the Forum, a market that increases great person points by 25%. This jives in quite well with Augustus' Industrious trait.
MS2-3.jpg



Map Settings...
Map: Standard Pangaea
Oppnents: 6
Sealevel: Medium
Climate: Temperate
Shoreline: Natural


Spoiler map hints and comments :
Welcome to Pangaea. Watch out for your worst neighbor, who will screw you up. Take care of your iron deposit. Don't get cocky. Prepare well for war.

Hint: You will learn a lot by reading Rome's entry in the Civilopedia. How that relates to playing this map, it's up to you to find out.
 
According to legend, Romulus and Remus were born and raised at this location:
MS2-4.jpg



The Worldbuilder save is below. It is good for Monarch or Emperor starts. Nobles and Princes may need to remove archery from the computer players. Immortals and Deities may need to give the computer some more free techs.
Playing on Prince or lower difficulty is highly discouraged. Please please please don't! It sure beats the point of Praets if you can do a better job with Warriors.

To play, unzip the worldbuilder file and place it in your Documents/BTS/Saves/WorldBuilder folder. Start the game by choosing Single Player -> Play a Scenario, where you may adjust the speed and difficulty to your liking. Or Custom Scenario, if you wish to turn off huts, barbs or events and adjust other settings.

The point of these threads is to compare strategies and progress with other players as well as learn to play. Win or lose, for better or worse, feel free to report on your glorious exploits. Perhaps other players can give you advice on your game.

Please keep your reports in spoiler tags to ensure and safeguard the richness of others' playing experience.

Recommended Checkpoints:
*1000BC or 1AD or 100AD
*500AD or Liberalism
*1200AD
*Victory!

EDIT: Fixed save. Please re-download. :D
 

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Just some musings...

Spoiler :

I haven't opened the save yet. It looks like a good starting spot.

I would move the warrior 1 NE before settling.

Settle in place unless something really good shows up.

Tech: ag>ah>wheel>bw>
Build: worker, warrior, etc.

 
Checking in Monarch/Epic. Just to warn you, I can't get this laptop to take pictures any more (I think it's the BAT Mod) so I'll just have to paint a picture with my words.

It's been a long time since I played a Pangea map (which I don't like) and even longer since I've taken the Romans out for a spin, so this should be interesting.

Through 3000 BC:
Spoiler :
Settled in place, because I'm that kind of guy. Should be a wonder-full capital at some point, as long as I can quickly deal with the neighbors.

Two turns in, I pop masonry from a hut, which was pretty sweet. Two turns later, I lose out on the other really close hut to a scout from the creative pain-in-the-ass Russian chick to the north. Not cool, as she popped a second scout from it. Circled around a bit and found the aggressive Greek fairly close to my west and a bunch of tundra to my south, but with a couple of happy resources down there. Not exactly sure where city two and three are going to go before I set the empire on Praetorian spam, but I'll need to figure that out soon, as I don't want either one of these two neighbors hanging around very long.

Research is agriculture (for the wheat), bronze working (to let my worker help chop out worker two and settler 1) and then I started the wheel. I'll need to do a dot map before I figure out exactly when I slot in Iron Working. In order to effectively build my first set of Praets, I think I'll want three cities, and at the very least I'll need to know mysticism, animal husbandry and IW.

It seems like a shame not to use Augustus's traits to build the Oracle and pop metal casting for early cheap forges, but I really can't see farting around building wonders with this starting location. Maybe once my empire consists of three different capital city sites, I'll be able to start putting the industrious trait to some sort of good use.

Early build was worker (who farmed the wheat while waiting for BW to finish), warrior (to replace the starting one who popped a hut for hostile natives, obviously pay-back for masonry), and then worker #2 who will be finished with a chop and the overflow will go into a settler. I guess I'll probably build another warrior or two after that.

Oh, I almost forgot, right after my warrior got bludgeoned to death by barb warriors, I got the herbal medicine event and did in fact get the extra health for all cities for the rest of the game. So, on the huts/random events scoreboard I'm winning 2-1.

 
Are huts and events on?
 
Hints:

Spoiler :

Industrious: Might do an Oracle->MC Slingshot or go for Mids
Imperialistic: Add 50% :hammers: to settler production (chopping included)

For the Oracle->MC you just need to get to priesthood for the oracle and pottery/IW for MC.

You could go Agr->BW then chop first settler.
 
Hi

Tried TWICE and couldnt do it I couldnt even get out of the BC's :(

Spoiler :
First time I was dumb and teched through staright to IW after ag, ah and wheel. That meant I skipped pottery. But I figure I can make money from taking and razing cities so I dow Cathy. I took Cathy's capitol and got her down to one city and I and was BARELY keeping ahead of going on strike. I am bleeding gold at 0 slider and was ONLY staying out of strike by gold from raising her cities. Then I got bogged down in her last city which was like whipping archers like no tomorrow. There where like 9 of them there by time my stack got there. My STack does kill most of the ARchers but there still 3 left but gold running out fast I DONT have time to just sit and heal in cathys borders while gold keeps dropping.

THEN Alex Dow's on me. I get peace with cathy and TRY to attack alex. I hold off his invasion but gold still running out. By time I make it to his cities my Prats start poofing and when I get to his first city half my stack is gone and I cant even take the city cuz ONE lousy wouldned defender lives so if I had gotten there ONE turn sooner I could have taken his city for more gold and MIGHT have made it to pottery I was at like 7 turns away from it at 10% but 59 at 0 and this has been with like over 80 plus turns already TRYING to get pottery. I get peace with alex but at zero tech and 59 turns away and going on strike I just said heck with it and tried again. Stupid Alex. IF he hadnt of DoW'ed JUST then my xtra prats that had to go and hold off his invasion COULD have gone and taken cathy's last city and gold from that might have let me stay at 10% for the 7 turns for pottery isntead of dropping back to 0 bpt and 59 turns.

Second time SHOULD have been better. I get BW from a hut and 400 gold. The first game I go to just ONE hut for like 60 gold and the bear kills my warrior. Stupid cathy even beat me to hut that SHOULD have been mine but go ti b4 my city could borderpop. But This time though isntead she beats me to city site I manged to grab the first time. But still I should be better off I tech pottery and writing and THEN IW and settled the floodplains area to the west so things look better. I even know I should target Alex first and save Cathy for later.

But JUST as I get my first Prat whipped Alex DoW's on me about 800 years earlier than he did the first game with a big stack of phalanxes and since of course except for that ONE prat all I have are warriors so I lose cities lose my Iron and game over.

Second try I get BW from a hut I KNOW the map this time, I even Know Alex should be the first target and NOT cathy but I end up doing WORSE than I did the first time :(. I think Im going back to noble now where I should be
.

Kaytie
 
@dirtyparrot:
You may turn off huts and events if you want. I kept no options because they're "normal".

@Silu and everyone else:
Save fixed! For those already playing on Epic, I hope you can beat the computer in 500 turns. :lol:

Sorry about missing that detail. I also updated the save in the second post.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=226740&d=1251932939

@Kaytie:
Spoiler :
Try building 5 warriors. No, not for warrior rush. For spawnbust the barbs and somehow Alex never attacked me in any of my test games. He keeps going for Joao... sometimes, even if they're both buddhist!

My tech path in this map is usually Pottery first (because I aggressively settle the flood plains site), IW, Priesthood, AG, AH, Writing - ya, i put off writing that long. I didn't even pop my borders until I had mysticism.
 
Have only played a few turns but right away the start is intriguing -

Spoiler :

Moving the warrior 1NE exposes hill pigs for another strong food tile. Crossing the river will gain the pig and more grassland river tiles. A VERY nice capital. The only question is where oh where did you hide the Iron... ;)
 
Playing on Prince or lower difficulty is highly discouraged. Please please please don't! It sure beats the point of Praets if you can do a better job with Warriors.

Barring the fact that you can of course warrior rush above prince successfully. Assuming you actually meet someone and you didn't pull the isolation nonsense I suggested, that is ;).
 
Played until 5BC and I think I am in pretty good spot.

Spoiler :

Moved warrior 1NE and found piggies. Moved settler 1SE and settled Rome.

Here are my first few builds in Rome.
War->Worker->Warriors until size 4 (happened to be enough to spawnbust and didn't have a single problem)->settler->settler->Stone Henge->worker->settler->settler.

Improvement Order around Rome.
Wheat->Plains Hill->Plains Hill->Cows->Piggies

Founding order at date.
Rome 4000 BC
Antium 2375 BC (at Flood Plains)
Cumae 2225 BC (at silver/cow/fur)
Neapolis 1700 BC (banana/banana/silk)
Rayenna 1500 BC (gems/elephant/corn)
Arretium 1150 BC (silk/silk/iron)(backfill)

Tech Path
AG->AH->BW->Myst->IW(Not Completed)->Wheel->Pottery->IW->Hunting->Archery->Writing

Declared War with Cathy at 200BC.
Took Moscow in 155 BC.
Took Novgrod in 80 BC.
Took St. Petersberg in 5 BC and she is gone.

Here is my empire, completely in the tank.

RomanEmpire.jpg

 

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Barring the fact that you can of course warrior rush above prince successfully. Assuming you actually meet someone and you didn't pull the isolation nonsense I suggested, that is ;).

Hehe TMIT, no isolation in this map. We can warrior rush on Monarch, but I don't expect to have 4 warriors knocking at their gates by the time AI only has 1 archer. And even then, 4 warriors vs 1 archer fortified isn't good odds without reloads. :lol:

BTW I assume we aren't talking about parking units at their cities, but taking them.
 
Played way past the check point to 970 AD but that is how long it took me to somewhat recover my economy.

Spoiler :

Keys to my recovery were teching Aes & Lit with help of scientists from libraries then trading it for everything and it mother, including currency, abc, math, monarcy, calendar. Had to 1 or 2 turn research those last ones but well worth it.

Then I noticed the biggy. Alex build mids in an exterior city. So, I declared war on him. I know, bad move with his phalanx but but my CRII Praets had them running home to mamma. Razed one other city. His capital is on a hill so that will wait until putls. Being able to run Represenation and having 2 scientists in about 5 cities really turned it around. As did laying down more cottages and having them grow but more importantly getting the calendar & monarchy resources up for happy, food, & commerce.

Researched COL and whipped courthouses in any city that could afford the whip. Almost done with CS to chain irrigate farms for growth in a couple of cities and bureaucracy in capital.

Not doing too bad tech wise. Lots of war between the nations so the crash didn't hurt me that bad.

Now that I have catapults I am going to wipe our Alex. He just went to war on the other side of the world so hopefully I can get him. He has been wonder spamming a little.
 

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Barring the fact that you can of course warrior rush above prince successfully. Assuming you actually meet someone and you didn't pull the isolation nonsense I suggested, that is ;).
The map is clearly stated as pangea. Isolation in a pangea map would be beyond cruel.
 
Hehe TMIT, no isolation in this map. We can warrior rush on Monarch, but I don't expect to have 4 warriors knocking at their gates by the time AI only has 1 archer. And even then, 4 warriors vs 1 archer fortified isn't good odds without reloads. :lol:

BTW I assume we aren't talking about parking units at their cities, but taking them.

We aren't. Actually the prince and below variant of the warrior rush is: warriors x 5 ASAP then attack BEFORE they AI even gets a single archer. As you point out, that won't work monarch+, even though it is indeed possible to catch the AI with 1 archer in some of its cities if you time it right.

The monarch through possibly immortal variant looks more like a real/traditional rush: worker 1st, barracks, warriors. Having hills to mine or good hammer specials is a plus because you can get more warriors out quickly (1/turn on normal for quite a while). You hit with about 16-20 warriors ASAP, probably 2200-1800 BC (faster on epic, way faster on marathon).

Slider management is a must there. After getting the techs you need, turn the slider off. The warriors cost money directly and will burn you for unit supply too. If you don't bank enough gold, you'll strike en route and lose utterly :p. If you have a reserve, you'll lose money at 0% but WILL lose warriors and improve GPT. City capture gold should help recoup some of your lost time if needed, but the real draw here is that you have a reasonably fast rush that requires 0 resources.

16 warriors will tend to beat 3 or less archers, and then you can turn the new city into another factor immediately (AGG helps a lot for this).

Enemies of the monarch-immortal warrior rush:

1. Protective civs. Don't do it. Any PRO will screw you, but obviously if you want to lose on purpose rush sitting bull with warriors. Other than SB, if you want to warrior rush PRO civs, use inca.
2. Malinese, for the same reason as above. The extra first strike chance and 4 base str will murder you.
3. Hills: you can overcome them, but be sure to bring extra warriors, their impact is severe on this rush.
4. Taking the wrong promo. In some situations, combat is more effective than city raider (!). If you're going up against 120%+ total defensive bonuses, use combat I instead of CR I. If you're AGG, you'll either take cover or combat II probably. Given that archers have 50% implicit and the capitol will probably hand them another 40%, fortify + CG I brings you to 125% ----> take combat I if they have CG I or are on hills!). I've had test games where using CR I instead of combat I meant the difference between losing and winning (same RNG seed rolls and everything!).
5. If the enemy is too far. If you're not meeting them by like turn 5-8, they're probably too far (there are some exceptions with erratic scouting etc but as a rule).
6. Target has BFC copper and hooked it up. Probably only an immortal+ thing in this timeframe, but still bad. Horses aren't as bad...you'd rather see a chariot in the city than another archer...

Notice that numb nuts like shaka, monty, etc are perfectly fine targets for this, ironically. Their AGG bonus doesn't apply very much and they're still in the early expansion phase.

Not always viable as you can see but another good tool to have. Targets that are killed by this are usually gone by 1500-1200 BC. That gives you time to settle elsewhere, use leftovers to finish off the spawn bust, and delete warriors that are straining you too much. Use banked gold to unlock whatever tech helps you the most. You won't bankrupt too badly after you lose most of the warriors...after all you'll probably only have 2-4 cities.

Choking is completely different. You have to manage tech while holding 3-5 units in enemy territory, expanding before others can take your land, and still deal with barbs. It can be done but it is yet another skill set to practice.
 
@Kaytie,

Spoiler :

The key to keeping Alex from declaring is keeping his odds of taking a nearby city low. You want copper or iron hooked up and an Axeman built by about 1400-1200 BC. I ran some test to confirm this. If his stack sees a weakly defended city and he's not at war he probably will attack.
 
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