My ENTIRE ARMY was destroyed by only 2 stupid enemies!!!

[moro101]

Yeah...we've ALL done that. The city that will not be conquered is a pain in the rear end...

Ditto. My first 4-5 noble games were a horrible experience. Horrors upon horrors seeing my army got butchered by well-defended cities.

Lessons learned:

(1) NEVER use the stack attack option. Save your veterans. Let the newbies die first (Isn't this CivFanatics' motto also? )
(2) If you can't win, you can't win. Retreat, live to fight another day
(3) Cities on hills are a big pain in the neck. Unless you have an OVERWHELMING advantage, just pillage and move on

 

[Lord of Civ]

hehehee!

Anyway, i was the biggest empire and i don't mind if i lose 2 cities.

And.. i got my revenge, I razed all of his cities at the end!!

buahahahheheheee!!

 

[Lord of Civ]

However, thanks for many advices people. Some of the advices were too elementary for me and i already knew that and also they were off topic.

The point is: I lost an entire army on that battle against Chuck Norris which was a pain in the neck. Invading a city without at least 1 or 2 or 3 catapults was almost impossible for good quality big army(without catapults).

Anyway, that was a pain in the neck and funny at the same time. hehehee!!!

 

[Lord of Civ]

AIs do have magic eyes. it's quite easy to test

during war leave a fish resource unguarded, AI war ships will move toward it to pillage. reload game and this time guard the resource with good ships, AI ships will no longer head for it. in fact, if you have a unit that can observe AI ships, you will see them change direction as you move ships onto or off of your fish resource.

another way to see it. if you map has a good choke point, such as the 1 tile hill connecting africa with euroasia on a world map (suez canal), fortify units on that choke point. i was playing cathage and had taken over north africa, and fortified suez canal. i had also captured madrid from spain. china declared war on me, and started marching toward madrid. i was able to see their movement because i had a holy city. once their stacks had moved into turkey, i moved the suez canal defenders off the choke point. immediately their stacks turned around and came south to cross the suez canal. i then moved the suez defenders back into position, and they turned around and went back into turkey. i was able to bounce around their huge stacks for many turns before i sued for peace. again keep in mind, i had a holy city enabling me to see them, but the chinese had no holy city and no unit close to suez to observe me. they just know when a choke point is open and when it's closed. you can also confirm this on special maps like spiral, etc.

That was very true Romelus and thanks for posting. Thats exactly what happened to me on the other match. Germans brought their Panzers down to my capital city but after defending my capital city very well, they suddenly turned back into the border of Roman Empire. Then they came back to a weak defended city so i moved my infantries and cavalries back to that city which was a target for stacked German Panzers. After that, they turned back again!!! And they headed to their old target (my capital city). This had repeated for 4 times until peace treaty was made! Their strong Army almost never attack me which was amazing! Another thing, the Germans were on the same continent so there was no Suez Canal that connects 2 continents and they were 5 blocks away from my capital city so I assumed that they could not see how many soldiers i got inside my capital city but they actually do. The AI Players do have Magic Eyes!

PS: SORRY FOR THE DOUBLE POSTING....

 

[Mango]

I just went to World Builder to test this out.

I gave myself 6 Swordmen, all with Combat I and Cover I and 3 with City Raider I as well. 2 Axemen with Combat I and Cover I joined them.

Their opponent was one Longbowman with City Garrison I, II and III on a plain hill with walls and 60% cultural border. I tossed in an Axeman, but as you'll see, it was unneccesary:



The first of 3 Swordmen with Combat I, Cover I and City Raider I attack. The odds are 0.2%! That's a 1 in 500 chance of winning! Must be the uh, walls, 60% culture defense, hills and the extra bonus associated with it for Longbowmen. After all he is a 15.9 strength! Also, let's not forget that this guy received no fortify bonus (because I didn't think about it before attacking).




Second Swordman attacks and actually does damage this time!




Third triple-promoted Swordman dies, leaving the Longbowman with 3.7 health. Now for the Swordmen and Axemen without CR to attack. I have a feeling they won't fare much better.



Just to save my upload space I'll go ahead and tell you that the city was eventually captured, however all 6 swordmen died. The first non-city raider swordman actually took on the axeman and managed to get him down to 1.5 health. This was extremely lucky as the axeman should have slaughtered him at the odds. The longbowman took out the other two swordmen before dying to the first axeman. A longbowman took out the weakened axeman, leaving me with 3 axemen and two longbowmen left. In most scenerios I think more axemen would have died before the city was taken, but considering the sheer number of troops I had compared to the opponent (6 times!) I'd have to hand the victory to the defender. One longbowman took out 5 promoted swordmen and weakened an axeman. The axeman defender put up a poor fight, but thems the breaks.

The conclusion is one longbowman is enough to wipe out an entire army if heavily promoted enough and facing a human opponent too stupid to bring cats.

 

[ThomasHardy]

I never attack a city without a good stack of catapults. It's really a waste unless your swords are attacking spears or archers. Swords attacking longbowmen without cats is a waste.

 

[sebastien]

it had happened for me too but not an entire army
very strange
are you sure you don't have change Longbowmen attack value??
try too attack with Longbowmen too!!

 

[Xenocrates]

To the OP:

At first I thought you were a Lord amongst Civ players, but now I see that you're only a Civ player amongst Lords.

Thanks for the laugh; next time my ENTIRE ARMY consisting of half a dozen semi-obsolete units gets pwned, I'll remember you.

 

[Pantastic]

The point is: I lost an entire army on that battle against Chuck Norris which was a pain in the neck. Invading a city without at least 1 or 2 or 3 catapults was almost impossible for good quality big army(without catapults).

You didn't have a good quality or big army; you had a mob of obsolete units. Axes are ancient units, swords are classical, while longbowmen are medieval, so your troops were an era or two behind the defenders. Less than a dozen units is not a big amry in medieval times, around a dozen units is what I'd consider average-sized. Definately once longbows show up, and really a bit earlier than that, an army doesn't really qualify as an 'army' in my book unless it has several siege units to remove city defenses. Invading a city with a stack of obsolete units who don't have any way of reducing the city defense is like hitting the disband button but giving your opponent free xp.

 

[weasel77066]

AIs do have magic eyes. it's quite easy to test

during war leave a fish resource unguarded, AI war ships will move toward it to pillage. reload game and this time guard the resource with good ships, AI ships will no longer head for it. in fact, if you have a unit that can observe AI ships, you will see them change direction as you move ships onto or off of your fish resource.

another way to see it. if you map has a good choke point, such as the 1 tile hill connecting africa with euroasia on a world map (suez canal), fortify units on that choke point. i was playing cathage and had taken over north africa, and fortified suez canal. i had also captured madrid from spain. china declared war on me, and started marching toward madrid. i was able to see their movement because i had a holy city. once their stacks had moved into turkey, i moved the suez canal defenders off the choke point. immediately their stacks turned around and came south to cross the suez canal. i then moved the suez defenders back into position, and they turned around and went back into turkey. i was able to bounce around their huge stacks for many turns before i sued for peace. again keep in mind, i had a holy city enabling me to see them, but the chinese had no holy city and no unit close to suez to observe me. they just know when a choke point is open and when it's closed. you can also confirm this on special maps like spiral, etc.

This is true. Ive tested it with choke points in civ3 and civ4. If you dont believe it then load up a transport out in the middle of the ocean and leave him sit for a while. Watch what happens. It doesnt really bother me. AI needs some advantage, I just always play as though they know, and it never gets the better of me.

PS- lord of civ has been demoted to "Lord of the Flies"

 

[DaviddesJ]

My ENTIRE ARMY was destroyed by only 2 stupid enemies!!!

Your army had only two enemies. Unfortunately, you were one of them.

 

[GIO888]

Dude! Calm your gestures!

Take catapaults and Swordsmen - preferably swordsmen with at least city attack I, although beefing them up still more on some Barbs beforehand is good.

And check out the defenses of the city you're attacking - if it's 50%+ or on a hill - well, I've lost full strength Redcoats/Riflemen to Bowmen fortified like that!

 

[Antilogic]

I admit I really can't add anything to this thread, but I have to say something--this was a great laugh.

The only time I ever consider not sending siege equipment (emphasis in bold for a reason) is if I am fighting a really primitive opponent who got left behind (e.g. the two cities left over that the AI did not capture for whatever reason, guarded by longbows and attacked by CR grenadiers, or something of the like). Even then, I may send a cannon or two along for the ride.

This just goes to show what everyone in the thread already beat me to posting: don't try to do something with the wrong equipment and just hope to get lucky.

Seriously, the moment I see any cultural defense bonus, I think to send siege equipment (unless it's the ancient era, but if you blitz for swords, archers can be defeated with 2:1 numbers or greater). If you don't, you deserve the casualties you receive from the battle.

 

[Mango]

Ancient era I will suicide with Axes and Swords just because I tend to have overwhelming numbers. Plus the XP from fighting those kind of battles prettym uch guaruntees an early Great General. Stick them in the production city with barracks and you now have a city producing Level 2 attackers early. If you have an aggresive leader then even better. You can give them cover and city raider I making them pretty much unstoppable until Longbowmen show up.

 

[Xenocrates]

Your army had only two enemies. Unfortunately, you were one of them.

Classic post-age! This should be added to the forum highlights thread, if only there was one.

Russia's two best generals: January and February. The Civ AI's two best generals - Lord of Civ and Lord of Civ's PC!

PS I'm not posting anything from my early games. Not brave enough, no Sir!

 

[Lord of Civ]

Look up the seige of Belgrade, or any one of a number of other seiges.

Belgrade was attacked in 1456 by Mehmed II with 70,000 troops. It was defended by 5,000-7,000 men.

It was not taken.

And they even had seige equipment!

hmmmmmm...... Interesting......

Ive made the same mistake as Mehmed II, one of the greatest, famous leader. I should be called Mehmed III perhaps.....

Anyway, many people are jealous of me because i got a nice name "Lord of Civ" and they all wanted me to change my name so that they could steal it. heheeeheheeeeee!!! JUST KIDDING...

Oh! Actually, i should have been known as "Mehmed III" heeheheee!!!

I am also happy that this thread has many viewers! At least, i am a good thread creator... This is funny!!!

 

[Rexflex]

Bombards are important for attacking cities.

With a stack of 12 elements consisting of swordmen and axemen, I would choose 4 of them to be catapults instead.

Don't be afraid to seige the city for a few turns with the catapults in your stack bombarding the city defences. You want the city walls down for your actual attack.

Once the defences are down, send at least a couple of your catapults in first. Even if they all die, the collateral damage should be enough to weaken all of the defending units. Now the rest should be fairly easy to take. This tactic can cause an even strength army to be brought to its knees.

This is no different from history. In few historic occasions has a huge army with no bombards taken a stronghold with a small army. The damage is too great. The beauty of Civ IV is how close this winning tactic in the game is to how cities historically fell.

It is all about fighting smarter rather than rellying on superior numbers.

 

[Stylesjl]

Your blunder has inspired me to make a comic about it! I'll post in the Draw your own story thread as well as here

 

[Stylesjl]

DRAW your own story! http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=176432&page=33

 

[Dominico]

lmao classic!