New to Civ IV (and the civ series)

[Raven-sb]

Sorry if I created a debate, it wasn't my intention. The reason I'm playing through all of the games, is this, to have fun. Yes I could jump straight to BTS and from what I've read it makes sense. But personally I'd rather play through the scenarios in WL and BTS. I'd also like to play Vanilla Civ IV and gain some understanding of the game (and I'm learning more and more) before I move onto the expansion packs so I can appreciate the additions and improvements the expansion packs bring. In the end it comes down to taking my time and having fun with the game.

Thanks to everyone who offered up their advice, it was greatly appreciated.

 

[G-Max]

I'd also like to play Vanilla Civ IV and gain some understanding of the game (and I'm learning more and more) before I move onto the expansion packs so I can appreciate the additions and improvements the expansion packs bring.

And because it's a shallower learning curve.

 

[raxid]

Honestly its a bad idea to play vanilla or WL first as BTS is the superior game for many many reasons and its added "complexity" can be completely ignored until the highest levels. Espionage, Corporations, AP, and Vassals all can be ignored by the human player (and turn off vassals if they're addind complexity) and still be very successful. Thus you don't need to learn those initially. Going back to play scenarios in vanilla and WL makes much more sense.

Even if you stick with playing vanilla first there is 0 reason to play regular games in WL after, you definitely should just jump to BTS for regular games. Again scenarios are a different story.

 

[G-Max]

Honestly its a bad idea to play vanilla or WL first

Nonsense. You have to learn to walk before you can run.

 

[Ghpstage]

Nonsense. You have to learn to walk before you can run.

Its arguably a lot easier to learn BTS, the interface is improved a bit (and tremendously so with BUG mod), you don't have to worry about as many losses due to rounding and a lot of the learning done in Vanilla will need to be unlearnt in BTS. Also as most forum goers either play only BTS or started with it theres a lot more people willing and able to help out.

 

[May Day 10]

I just recently moved up to BtS after many games on Vanilla.

I gotta say its been a tougher adjustment than I expected.

The AI is much more willing to call me out when I shamelessly build instead of building my military into a strong one. In Vanilla, for the most part they would leave me alone, unless I would rediculously neglect my military.

 

[G-Max]

Its arguably a lot easier to learn BTS, the interface is improved a bit

The interface stayed exactly the same.

a lot of the learning done in Vanilla will need to be unlearnt in BTS.

The only thing that I had to "unlearn" was that Grenadiers no longer come with Chemistry.

 

[DNK]

How bout starting with BtS and turning off vassals, espionage, and random events? Corporations you can usually ignore since you'll be running state property in most games when those come into effect (nullifies them).

Basically, that's vanilla with some added content, artwork, etc.

I would also really suggest getting BUG/BULL once you've got the basic UI and game down, it helps a lot with appreciating the underlying mechanics.

Check out the strat forum and the war academy. Lots of good reads in there to help you through the game.

 

[Farm Boy]

The availability of an updated BUG(Beyondthesword Unaltered Gameplay) mod is reason enough to play Beyond the Sword instead of Vanilla.

 

[ManiaMuse]

Another good reason to start with BTS instead of vanilla are some of the subtle adjustments to the tech tree/bulbing requirements and units. If you read some of the older guides for Vanilla and then get used to doing a civil service slingshot or raping with strength 18 cossacks or using the Great Wall for a great engineer to rush the pyramids, you might then be disappointed to find that these strategies were nerfed in later patches/expansions.

Personally I would just start off with BTS and ignore the more complex additions. Use custom game to turn off vassals and random events maybe? Although vassals aren't that much of an issue at lower difficulties generally. I would leave espionage on though as it alters the culture mechanics to compensate. As noted above, corporations can pretty much be ignored.

 

[Skwink]

Play BTS first. I used to play Vanilla, and when I went to BTS, I could not play at the same difficulty level. Easier to learn the harder one first.

 

[Abegweit]

BTS is a better game. If you use BUG (and you should) the UI is actually easier to get used to. As other folks have pointed out, you can ignore the new features - and I would definitely do that.

As for bugginess, cIV had some severe teething pains but it was pretty solid by the final patch of Vanilla. I wouldn't worry about that.

The only reason not to use BTS is because you want to try out the Warlords scenario. Honestly, they aren't all that good although Barbarians is fun for a whirl. If it's scenarios you want, I'd definitely take a look at some of the content on this site instead of going to the lame ones that Firaxis supplied. Almost all of the good ones have moved to BTS and most are BTS-only.

If you ignore the additional features of BTS, the only real differences between the versions is:

1. BTS has a better AI.
2. The tech tree is slightly different
3. BTS has some additional wonders.

So this "learning curve" thing is pretty much bullcrap. BTS with BUG is easier to learn than the UI Firaxis gave it.

 

[icemanfan]

I'd say pick one version of the game and stick with that one. I'm playing Vanilla and having fun with it so I see no need to jump in to BtS.

 

[Farm Boy]

I'd say pick one version of the game and stick with that one. I'm playing Vanilla and having fun with it so I see no need to jump in to BtS.

No! We know the road the fun and if you do not listen to us then you will never learn where fun is!

 

[icemanfan]

No! We know the road the fun and if you do not listen to us then you will never learn where fun is!

Nice try, but I'm immune to Borg tech. Oh well. I like Vanilla, and I don't feel like spending more money on the game. I'm just happy to play it in one of its forms.

 

[Hollow Man]

I have vanilla Civ4 and never played as much as I should've (I'm playing Civ5 and CivRev on my iPhone now, so gawd knows I don't NEED the Civ4 expansions). But now that I'm on a Civ kick, I looked and found Civ4 Complete for $12 online. A no brainer: I ordered it.

-HM