Nudity at CFC

Loaf Warden

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The forum rules explicitly state:

You agree, through your use of this service, that you will not use this forum to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise violative of any law. You agree not to post any copyrighted material unless the copyright is owned by you or by this forum.

I'll be the first to admit that definitions of many of these terms vary from person to person. But ever since I can remember, it's been the policy of this forum that sexually-oriented material, such as photographs of naked women, were not allowed. Such photographs were always removed, and the posters punished.

The rules seem to have changed, without the Forum Rules section being updated. I've mostly stayed out of the Babe threads (I stay out of all picture threads because they take too long to load), but just out of curiosity, I recently peeked inside pages 12 and 13 of Babe Thread XII.

Most of the pictures there were acceptable even by the old rules. But there were also pictures in there which are very much sexually oriented. I saw a naked woman in a bathtub (in a field, naturally), the bare buttocks of a woman whose thong was so invisible you could swear she didn't have one on, and a woman whose copious breasts were very poorly covered by her hands (though admittedly her nipples were entirely concealed).

Now, I'm certainly no prude. If I were, my response would simply be to never go into those threads and not think about it again. I like naked babes as much as any heterosexual guy does, I think. So I'm not making a complaint about nudity. Actually, I'm not making a complaint at all. It's more of an inquiry. And the inquiry is about consistency.

Of course nudity is not inherently sexual, but I'd say a naked woman in a bathtub (in a field!) and a woman bearing her breasts with a suggestive look on her face are sexually oriented. Theoretically, these pics are in direct violation of the explicitly stated rules of the forum, yet clearly those in charge have deemed these pictures acceptable and no action has been taken. If the old rules no longer apply, please explain to me what the new rules are.

No female nipples and no genitals, I assume. A full view of butt cheecks is obviously okay, judging from the pictures I saw. But suppose I posted a picture of a woman in a full top, with full-length jeans on, but the jeans are riding a little low, and a little bit of her butt crack is peeking out. Would that be okay? Or how about a frontal view of a nude woman whose nipples and genitals were covered? And if these are not okay, then why exactly are the pictures I described above okay?

Again I want to stress that I'm not complaining about the nudity. I'm asking for more explicit rules, posted clearly, so we all know how much nudity we are allowed to put here. Of course the rules are always subject to change as Thunderfall changes his mind about something, but I'd prefer to know precisely what I will and won't get in trouble for. I don't want to post a picture that I judge more mild than one that's already in there, only to get busted because I've violated some obscure sub-rule that can't even be found in the Forum Rules section. So I'm not asking that indecent pictures be removed. Screw decency. :D I'm just asking for clarity, that's all.
 
Well, personally I'd prefer the babe thread to be closed. You can go look at crap like that somewhere else if you really want to. The internet's a big place.

About the rules, the rules are not clearly defined at all, and pretty much what the mod says goes. Which does happen to get several people banned for doing something they didn't even know was wrong, but overall it's worked so far, but more clearly defined rules would be great.
 
If you don't like it you can not look at it. Although I have to agree that the babe thread is having a slut overload.
 
Originally posted by Loaf Warden
But suppose I posted a picture of a woman in a full top, with full-length jeans on, but the jeans are riding a little low, and a little bit of her butt crack is peeking out. Would that be okay? Or how about a frontal view of a nude woman whose nipples and genitals were covered?

Post them so we can decide if they are ok or not. :)
 
In a boundless forum environment like the OT, there can never be enough 'clearly defined rules'. I think the present system works ok; with the rules in general put in place, while interpretation is left to the discretion of mods and staff discussion.

Remember also, you always have TF as the highest court of appeal.

As for the Babe thread... you can always report those pix you find unsuitable...
 
Originally posted by h4ppy
If you don't like it you can not look at it.

I already addressed that, many times. It's not the nudity I don't like; it's the apparent inconsistency in the rules.

Originally posted by XIII
As for the Babe thread... you can always report those pix you find unsuitable...

I could. But that would imply that the pictures actually bothered me. I understand the principle of keeping it clean, since this isn't an over-18 site, and a lot of youngsters come here. That's the theory behind prohibiting sexually oriented material in the first place. But realistically, no one is going to be corrupted by the pictures in the Babe threads. Actual pornography is certainly still not permitted; at worst we get pictures of some women with dubious amounts of skin showing. I'm not offended by the pictures in and of themselves, and I have no interest in making a report to a moderator to get someone in trouble for something I'm not even offended by.

The only thing that bothers me about it is the seeming arbitrariness in the rules. We have these general guidelines, and how far they go depends entirely upon the mood of the moderators at the time they happen to see the pictures. That seems dangerous to me. The pictures I mentioned before have all obviously been allowed to remain. But suppose I decided to post that 'butt crack' picture I described after all, and one of the mods decided it was unsuitable and took it down. Okay, I can accept that a butt crack pic can be considered unsuitable--but there's a lot less skin showing than in the pictures I mentioned, and the picture itself is much less inherently sexual than some of the ones that are there. If I posted my pic and it was removed, then justice would demand I complain about the more sexual pics that are in there, and like I said, I frankly don't care to do that.

I see your point about not being able to have enough clearly-defined rules, and for the most part, I agree. It may seem like I'm asking for more rules, and I don't want it to seem that way. Heaven knows nobody wants OT to become a police state where the most casual joke can be grounds for punishment because "Article 8, Section XVI, Paragraph 10, Sub-Paragraphs 3-5 inclusive of the Forum Rules clearly states that. . . ." God forbid! But isn't there some middle ground? Is that the extent of Forum policy on nudity? Post what you want, and the mods will decide for themselves whether or not to let it slide? We'll never know ahead of time if we have permission, so just do it and pray for forgiveness?
 
Are you people out of your mind? Babe threads are a deeply ingrained tradition of CFC. Banning it would be like forcing Muslims to eat dog. Now, take back that blasphemous post or face the...um...very nasty :satan:...well, not that nasty... consequences
 
that's not what Loaf sees as the problem. He's talking about consistancy of the rules. The babe thread is just used as an example in his post, it's not the main complaint.
 
Some of us had to fight long and hard to get the Babe and Hunk Threads.

"a woman whose thong was so invisible you could swear she didn't have one on, and a woman whose copious breasts were very poorly covered by her hands (though admittedly her nipples were entirely concealed)."

You can see these two criteria spelled out in the babe thread more than once in the threads.

No Nipples. Butt crack must be thonged.
along with
No pubic areas/hair. No shots of just isolated body areas. Nothing suggestive of sexual activity (eg. like two scantily clad models hugging each other, or milk dripping from the face).
and
The vauge nothing overall too raunchy or purient rule. (like being posed for 'action')
 
Originally posted by Lefty Scaevola
Some of us had to fight long and hard to get the Babe and Hunk Threads.

:lol:

I say if the Babe Threads are up to 9, or 10, or whatever it is, we should let them stay.

I doubt anything in there is something that people can't get elsewhere or haven't seen before...
 
Originally posted by Aphex_Twin
Are you people out of your mind? Babe threads are a deeply ingrained tradition of CFC. Banning it would be like forcing Muslims to eat dog. Now, take back that blasphemous post or face the...um...very nasty :satan:...well, not that nasty... consequences

Just be glad I don't moderate the OT forums, then. ;)
 
Originally posted by Lefty Scaevola
Some of us had to fight long and hard to get the Babe and Hunk Threads.

"a woman whose thong was so invisible you could swear she didn't have one on, and a woman whose copious breasts were very poorly covered by her hands (though admittedly her nipples were entirely concealed)."

You can see these two criteria spelled out in the babe thread more than once in the threads.

No Nipples. Butt crack must be thonged.
along with
No pubic areas/hair. No shots of just isolated body areas. Nothing suggestive of sexual activity (eg. like two scantily clad models hugging each other, or milk dripping from the face).
and
The vauge nothing overall too raunchy or purient rule. (like being posed for 'action')

This guy is a lawyer? Nah, get away :p

Rules along the lines of: butt cracks must be thonged :lol:
 
Originally posted by Lefty Scaevola
No Nipples. Butt crack must be thonged.
along with
No pubic areas/hair. No shots of just isolated body areas. Nothing suggestive of sexual activity (eg. like two scantily clad models hugging each other, or milk dripping from the face).

Fair enough.

The vauge nothing overall too raunchy or purient rule. (like being posed for 'action')

Just so I'm clear, then, the pics in this post, and the second pic in this post are neither raunchy nor prurient?
 
Originally posted by Loaf Warden


Fair enough.



Just so I'm clear, then, the pics in this post, and the second pic in this post are neither raunchy nor prurient?

Depends on how you define raunchy and what sort of response that would cause :p
 
Originally posted by Loaf Warden
Just so I'm clear, then, the pics in this post, and the second pic in this post are neither raunchy nor prurient?
That one falls under the inadequately concealed nipple rule, but other than that would barely survived the "too raunchy or purient" rule. It was also skirting close to the "isolated body part" rule.
 
Note that some standards are partialy determined by workability.
A % of butt coverage rule was not workable, even though we wanted more than the minimal thong standard we settled on.
Whereas the overall effect rules give some lattitude to deal with a minmally thongs butt when is is shoved into the foreground compared to the rest of the model, or when the focus of the shot is the crotch even is minmally covered.
 
Originally posted by Loaf Warden
I could. But that would imply that the pictures actually bothered me.
We always have people reporting problem posts that they're not personally offended by, in the spirit of public-mindedness and helping the mods. ;)

and I have no interest in making a report to a moderator to get someone in trouble for something I'm not even offended by.
More likely, we'll just take down the pix in question and issue a simple warning. ;)

The only thing that bothers me about it is the seeming arbitrariness in the rules. We have these general guidelines, and how far they go depends entirely upon the mood of the moderators at the time they happen to see the pictures.
Actually, I don't even look at the Babe thread. :p I've better things to do.

We'll never know ahead of time if we have permission, so just do it and pray for forgiveness?
Or ask the mods first. ;)

But I think after awhile, you'll generally get the drift of what's acceptable and what's not. And finally at least CT is not moderating the OT... ;) :p
 
Originally posted by ainwood
Deeply ingrained tradition! :lol:

They've been allowed for about a year and a bit! :crazyeye:

Well, um... a year IS a long time.
 
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