Open letter to Firaxis

[pdathert]

Dear Firaxis,

Can I just say that the ongoing debacle that has been Civilization 4 has made me extremely sad. Be aware that I have been a massive Civilization fan ever since I played the first glorious instalment on my 386-sx.

However like any great Empire yours has expanded and has now fallen foul to many failings - the worst of these being: (in no particular order)

1. Forgetting your roots. Civilization has always been for the vast majority of it’s fans, almost 100% about gameplay. So why do we have this new game that is so intensive on our systems (for no real gameplay gains), and thus it is in no way accessible to all who want to play it. The gameplay is not drastically different to Civ I and rightly so, you had a winning formula then and you still do now. I just don’t understand why over 15 years the game is getting much much more system intensive when the gameplay has moved on at nothing like the same level. This is a TBS! It should not be killing our computers to play. Anyone who wouldn’t sacrifice a bit of zoom-ability for a bit more playability/accessibility is a fool.

2. All this ties in to point 2, the specifications on the box are nothing short of a lie. People are reading the box and thinking “yep, got all that” and buying the game and it is disappointing them horribly.

3. Also why release the demo AFTER the game? I know why, so people would buy the game and find that they cannot run it properly, instead of getting a free demo and coming to the same conclusion, it’s seems like it is all about £££’s in the bank!

4. Again to tie in with 3. The game is not finished. Sure it is just about playable for some people but it is not really acceptable IMO. December should have been the release date and November the demo release. Again money driven.

5. Testing, a disgrace.

6. You haven’t learnt any of your mistakes from the Civ 3 release. Or at least you haven’t cared about them.

7. Too complacent. People are going to buy anything you produce with the “Civ” tag because of the brand name, that basically means your quality doesn’t have to be as high, you know it, I know it.

8. Bug-ivilization

9. Patch-ivilization

10. Patch Patch Patch-ivilization.

11. Bin-ivilization


I have spent HUNDREDS of hours trying to get this game to work. I have friends who have similar but different issues, not one of us is satisfied with your efforts.

EARN YOUR MONEY, or don’t bother in future.

There shan’t be peace in our time,

P Atherton.

 

[Dragonlor]

1. Game makers like movie producers nowadays like to cave in to the special effects gimmick as if true civers cared about the graphics.

2. Game ran fine out of the box for me and my computer just meets the recommended requirements.

3-7. I suppose they could have released a demo, found a lot of people couldn't run it, then fixed the game before release.

8-11. Ran out of things to say?

 

[pdathert]

re: 2.

I'd like to add that the requirements on the box (UK), are different to the requirements on the website (re: RAM). Cheers for that, not sure if thats fraudulent, but it's definately not good.

 

[Red Threat]

My notebook doesn't meet the recommended requirements but the game works just fine.

 

[X sheehan C]

i agree with u on all of those pdathert... my game didnt work out of the box either, thats wat made me the most upset cus i wanted 2 play badly... then when the patch came out and it didnt work i got even more upset. im not sure wat 2 do with this game excpet for take it back 2 the seller...

sheehan

 

[kuldiin]

You missed out a few forums whilst posting this btw. I see at least three you missed!

 

[pdathert]

You missed out a few forums whilst posting this btw. I see at least three you missed!

a little unfair

I only put it here and the tech forum, where firaxis might actually see it.

Then again, probably the tech forum is the last place they'd look.

firaxis
civ
testing

 

[weasel77066]

An open letter is a good opportunity. I'd like to thank you and the crew. Although I didnt like it at first, Ive fallen for this game. Its a step above the rest and I can't wait to see what comes next.
In the mean-time I'll be assimilating all my neighboring civs.

 

[Chayton]

That with the demo is peoples own fault. Dont blame the developers/publisher if you cant wait for a demo and so go ahead and buy it in hope it will work on your pc. Thats the general problem people simple cant wait these days anymore, once a game is in developing they push for the release, then they complain about unfinished product and push for patches, and then they complain about the unfinished patches and so on. Its sad that people simple have no time anymore that the majority basicly dies if something is delayed even just 1 day.

 

[Bast]

It didn't work on my old computer, so I got a new computer. It works perfect now. This is the best Civ by far in looks AND gameplay.

 

[Nigel Stutt]

Im feel I must post my response. I feel for the original poster and others like him. There are too many games coming out these days that are not thoroughly tested. Obviously this one was released to meet the Xmas market.

But to add to the above I have only a reasonable computer P4 2.4GHz, 1 Mb Ram, Radeon X800XT, Audigy Soundcard - so its not that fast or cutting edge except for the graphics card which is a good one. I always keep to standard components and find that I get few problems with them. Civilisation 4 worked for me right out of the box, it has always been smooth and more than playable. The patch has not changed much for me other that the gameplay tweaks which are gratefully received. Im happy with the game and have been enjoying it. I would like to thank the developers for a great game.

Nats

 

[Kid_icoris]

Really i can understand some of the angst you hold against this game but really i have played alot of PC games when first released and alot of them have the same issues. Not enough testing because of pressures to release on time. It sucks that they couldnt fix all of the issues before they released the game but Civ IV is a good game, and im sure that it'll become even greater over the next little while, civ III had issues when i first got it but it didnt bother me cause they did fix them. I do realize that i am rambling cause its like 5 am and i havent slept yet but just be patient with the game. I know the developers want to create a fun and addicting expeirience for everyone to kill hours of our free time. I dont think the devs were just sitting around saying "screw the core fan base! put the game out!"

 

[Paalikles]

Regarding 1-11:

1: There seems to be a tendency for games to need more hardware resources. Strangely enough - you can do more in civ4 than in civ1. Might be because the AI is smarter...
Specifically regarding your complaint about graphics being prioritized over gameplay: Well, some people like it, others dont. An interesting fact is that civ3 was under critisism for having resources that was hard to spot. So the extent of focus on graphics may have been influenced to some extent by
that

2: I beg to differ. Firstly, such a generalisation is typical for people who burst out with complaints (read: rants) rather than trying a rational, calm approach.
I found that I had the sufficient specs, I prepared by upgrading some drivers. Result: minor problems, and so far it seems my only true problem (choppy wondermovies) was fixed by better drivers for my nvidia card.
So, in short: Do not ever claim to be speaking for a community, when you cannot conclude that your generalization is 100% correct.
The system specs are correct imo. But there are hardware of varying quality out there, and not all people want to upgrade drivers and such (Ginger Ale I am looking in your direction).

3: The availability of the game vs the availability of the demo may or may not have to do with publishing dates of gaming magazines. This is a possible explanation of why game comes out prior to demo. It is not necessarily a true one.

2+3 => In economics, we tend to argue that consumers are to some extent rational. Here rationality ought to mean something in the lines of:
a) check that system specs of your machine is sufficient for game play.
b) find the retailer that offers the object at a price below your reservation price (preferably) - although time required to find the lowest price is also a cost for you.
c) if possible, do not buy the game in "the heat of the moment". If you are unsure about whether the game works or not, then check online resources for feedback (i.e this forum)
d) if you actually buy the game, you have conducted a voluntary exchange, thus you implicitly agree that the benefit of owning the game exceeds the cost of owning it - since you are a rational consumer.

potential problem with d is that consumers lack information - producers have more info about their products than what consumers have (the classic example being the market for "lemons" -> google for George Akerlof)

If you find that the game does not work - then return it if possible for a refund.

4: Well, a firm controls a limited amount of resources, and does what it can to make a product that there will be demand for based on these resources.
Firaxis makes a complex game (i.e: "my brother thinks it is too much effort to get into the concept of the game"). Increased complexity means increased potential to do something that was not intended.

5: Related to 4 IMO. Testing, afaik, was done by competent people. Even competent people can overlook elements in a game. In economics we call that capacity problems. Capacity problems increase with complexity.

6: I disagree. Obviously, many of the elements introduced in this game is a direct result from people talking about what they missed in civ3, and people moderating the game (see the graphics forum under civ3 c&c for example)
Also, the AI is significantly improved over that wich was civ3 and civ3 conquests AI. Assuming you have played beyond civ3 regent, and have tried civ4 noble or beyond, this should be clear to you. Also, there is plenty empirical evidence @ this forum already.

7: If your argument holds, then statistics would show a (slight) decline in sales, when comparing sales of civ1, civ 2, civ3 and civ4 over time. The reasoning behind my logic is as follows: consumers punish producers of products with poor quality. This is a trial and error mechanism. Access to information (through the internet for one) enables consumers to check if other consumers have had issues with products. This means that low quality products generate less revenue, and less chance of sequels, than higher quality products.

8-11: Not worthy of lengthy comments.

Lastly, I am going to paraphrase a great guy: For some people it works, and for some people it doesn't*


*This is a col original: "...sometimes it works and sometimes it doesnt"


Edit: for the heck of it, here are some of my system specs:

www.srtest.com said my system was sufficient for minimum and recommended settings
I run win xp, with SP2
Athlon XP2100+ = 1.77Ghz
512MB of DDRam (which anyone experienced with hardware will tell you is certainly not new. I would rather call it "antique")
20+GB of harddrive space
non-optimal swapfile
samsung dvd rom (since I am European, the game is on a dvd)
Hansol 730E (probably not even for sale anymore, and certainly not the best monitor for its time either)
nvidia based Gforce FX5700, which is a 128MB graphics card. This card was not sufficiently updated in terms of drivers, till recently

All of these are more than sufficient "according to the box", and by my playing games without crashes, proven sufficient in real life as well.


A key understanding is: software producers are not hardware producers. There are variants of the same hardware products, and IMPOSSIBLE to test absolutely every hardware configuration.

 

[Scipioness]

I do agree that some people go WAY over the top in criticising Firaxis for the release, lack of testing, etc. Every game released has bugs, look at R:TW as a shining example of a possibly great game they STILL haven't gotten right with 3 patches and an expansion pack. Firaxis should at least be given time to fix the problems of the vocal minority.

However, I have big problems with members of the community who blame the buyer rather than the game for *some* of the problems. I bought the game, and my PC specs are as good, if not better than, everything in the 'recommended' section of the requirements. I have totally up to date drivers. However, I can't play large/huge maps past AD1900 or so, as the game slows to a crawl, then crashes. I only have 512mb of RAM, and would happily upgrade if I thought it was going to do any good, but a few days of browsing this forum has shown me that people with 2Gb upwards have the same problems as me. I desperately hope that they fix it in the next patch, but the problem I have is with people simply posting "buy more RAM" or something similar, where I think it totally reasonable to assume a game I have paid good money for and meet all recommended specs for to work in every mode of gamplay. Not sing or dance, cook me dinner or give me constant graphical delights, I don't pay that much for computer parts to expect this, I don't play first person shooters, simply work. This is something I'm not sure that Firaxis have delivered on yet for approximately 30-40% of people. Yet.

 

[Kid_icoris]

Ya i can agree with that, alot of people sound like they have just written the game off completely but ya they do have to fix the issues with the game but i think people need to be more patient with the game. Its barely been 2 months and we've gotten a patch for it im sure they are looking at all the issues and working hard at making the game more accessable so the people enjoy the game

 

[bancki]

Well, I got one thing to say about game prize... I think is WRONG to sell UNFINISHED product. All most same, going eat in a restaurant, you get your meal but no spoon to eat with... And you have to wait 2 weeks for a UPDATE, to EAT (play) and still PAY the full prize 50€. That is so wrong... and still not every one have internet connection at home to update the game. Do the gamehouse send the patch with snail mail? No...

 

[Mazruk]

Dear Firaxis,

I really like Civ 4 and its wonderful new features (religion, promotions, civics, 3d, improved AI and diplomacy, etc). You deserve a big from this fan of civ 2, civ 2 ToT, civ 3, civ 3 PTW, civ 3 conquests, civ 4.

It ran first time out of the box for me, although, before I got it, I had problems on my machine with Dx9.0c and driver/mobo/bios compatibility that I suspect a lot of people suffered only once they got the game and therefore blamed it for their issues.

It is good to see that Firaxis continue to treat their fans well by issuing a patch as soon as you could. The patch works well on my PC, although I got a 1706 error (no valid source). This error didnt stop the patch installing but may have confused/annoyed some users. My Civ 4 is the european dvd version and the patch was downloaded from the in-game menu.

As a release manager, I appreciate the difficulties in testing to the nth degree a complex piece of software that sits in a complex environment (individual PCs). I think you have done a great job in the circumstances. I for one feel sorry for the flak you guys have taken from the noisy minority. However, I hope you take heart from the positive reviews of your game in the press and the odd positive post here by members of the silent majority (when they can drag themselves away from the game!).

Keep up the good work

 

[blakjak69]

Part of the reason these software developers release this kind of garbage is due to people (consumers) that keep defending them and making excuses FOR THE DEVELOPERS to try to justify why it was OK for them to release it as it was. We all know this game should have NEVER been released as it was in the first place. You then hear people saying that "it has ONLY been about two months for the first patch" and praise these developers for their good work. Anyone else see something wrong with that? If you buy ANY other type of product and could not get it to work properly for over one month, would you praise the manufacturer for fixing it "in such a timely manner"? I doubt it very much!

The more people accept this type of crap, the more the developers/manufacturers will release this type of crap (and fix it later). The first patch is a perfect example of this with something as basic as the World Builder not working. Release garbage to fix garbage because people will accept it and some will even defend it. To these people, I'll sell you Civ 5 (yes, Five!) today and if it doesn't work, i'll fix it later...I'm sure you'll be fine with that!

Don't get me wrong, Civ 4 is an OK game and one day may be as good as Civ 3 was (after several patches, ironically), but it should have been that way when bought it and installed it on my PC...not four or five or ten patches later!

 

[Paalikles]

Dear Firaxis,

I really like Civ 4 and its wonderful new features (religion, promotions, civics, 3d, improved AI and diplomacy, etc). You deserve a big from this fan of civ 2, civ 2 ToT, civ 3, civ 3 PTW, civ 3 conquests, civ 4.

It ran first time out of the box for me, although, before I got it, I had problems on my machine with Dx9.0c and driver/mobo/bios compatibility that I suspect a lot of people suffered only once they got the game and therefore blamed it for their issues.

It is good to see that Firaxis continue to treat their fans well by issuing a patch as soon as you could. The patch works well on my PC, although I got a 1706 error (no valid source). This error didnt stop the patch installing but may have confused/annoyed some users. My Civ 4 is the european dvd version and the patch was downloaded from the in-game menu.

As a release manager, I appreciate the difficulties in testing to the nth degree a complex piece of software that sits in a complex environment (individual PCs). I think you have done a great job in the circumstances. I for one feel sorry for the flak you guys have taken from the noisy minority. However, I hope you take heart from the positive reviews of your game in the press and the odd positive post here by members of the silent majority (when they can drag themselves away from the game!).

Keep up the good work

I ll support this instead of the first post myself.

Replace release manager with economics student.
And I havent seen any errors related to installing the patch yet.
Nor did I have any technical problems with my machine. But the rest is my sentiments exactly, and my prior post confirms my view.

 

[Paalikles]

Part of the reason these software developers release this kind of garbage is due to people (consumers) that keep defending them and making excuses FOR THE DEVELOPERS to try to justify why it was OK for them to release it as it was. We all know this game should have NEVER been released as it was in the first place. You then hear people saying that "it has ONLY been about two months for the first patch" and praise these developers for their good work. Anyone else see something wrong with that? If you buy ANY other type of product and could not get it to work properly for over one month, would you praise the manufacturer for fixing it "in such a timely manner"? I doubt it very much!

The more people accept this type of crap, the more the developers/manufacturers will release this type of crap (and fix it later). The first patch is a perfect example of this with something as basic as the World Builder not working. Release garbage to fix garbage because people will accept it and some will even defend it. To these people, I'll sell you Civ 5 (yes, Five!) today and if it doesn't work, i'll fix it later...I'm sure you'll be fine with that!

Don't get me wrong, Civ 4 is an OK game and one day may be as good as Civ 3 was (after several patches, ironically), but it should have been that way when bought it and installed it on my PC...not four or five or ten patches later!

Interestingly, some did not find civ3 "good" before 1.29 was out.

It seems some people tend to buy something just because they want it no matter what - neglecting that they theoretically should not be able to get the game to work (see posts by those who run the game with less than the required specs)

And those who run the game and experience problems, having - in theory - the required specs - tend to forget that it is physcally impossible to test absolutely ALL specs.
The fact that those people still complain, means (IMO) that they neglect the option to aim for a refund.

If it doesnt work - either get different hardware - or get a refund (if possible)
I doubt that 100% of all potential civ4 players can get it to run, even when patched ad infinitum.