Outpaced AI in CPT, but still got beat?

[jdbwillia]

Hey guys,

Playing Civ5 on Prince. Wanted to do a cultural victory and was playing as Siam. Early on, it was evident that Egypt was trying to do the same thing. I played well, only had 2 cities and was cranking out +700 CPT by the end. Egypt and I stayed neck and neck all the way. I actually started building my Utopia project first, and then he started. We actually finished on the SAME TURN and it gave him the victory because (presumably) his score was higher.

I was fine with all this until I looked at the graph screen and saw he most culture he was ever cranking out was about 350 CPT. Huh?! How can this be? Seems I should've whipped his butt and got finished with my policies way before him. He also had 3 cities at the end which would've presumably given him a higher target to reach.

Any ideas?

Thanks,

Jason

 

[Louis XXIV]

A few wonders (Oracle, Sydney, Christo Redentor) plus Free Speech will mean he probably isn't paying as much per policy. Not sure if it's enough, but it would help.

 

[jdbwillia]

I built Sydney and Christo, plus I had free speech as well. It really doesn't add up to me. Any other ideas?

Does the AI really not play fair on Prince?

Thanks,

J

 

[Mesix]

Possibly early policy lead when having only a single city.

Did Egypt build Stonehenge and the Oracle in their capital before expanding? Did you go Liberty early for the free Settler/Worker/Great Person while Egypt went Tradition for the extra ? Were you running two cities the whole game while Egypt waited to expand until later?

 

[jdbwillia]

Those are good points.

I built Stonehenge, but I think he got the Oracle. We both expanded to two cities early on, then he built a third in the late game. Now that I think of it, I'm not sure how quickly he actually built his 2nd city - I would need to go back and look.

I'm not sure what order he did his policies, but I did not do liberty at all. I did Tradition, Honor, Piety, Patronage and Freedom. I believe he did all those, except he did Liberty instead of Patronage.

So, if I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying he could've stayed at one city and got a big jump with cheap policies early on - then later, even though I had a lot more CPT, I was basically playing catch up. Is that right?

Thanks,

J

 

[vexing]

ai plays on chieftain (regardless of your difficulty), one of the benefits is they only need 67% of the culture you do at prince+.

prince is not "fair".

 

[apocalypse105]

ai plays on chieftain (regardless of your difficulty), one of the benefits is they only need 67% of the culture you do at prince+.

prince is not "fair".

True olso he gets a production bonus just like you play chieftain so he could build the utopia project faster then you do if you have the same production base and started equel


BTW maybe he started it earlier then you how do you know that?

 

[jdbwillia]

@vexing - wow, did not know that. I guess that makes sense though - the difficulty level only changes MY difficulty level, not theirs - but I could've swore that I read somewhere that Prince did not give the AI, nor me, an advantage.

@apocalypse105 - I knew because I checked the Victory Status screen before I started building it, and I was the only one who had completed 5 Cultural policy trees. He completed his 5th a few turns later.

 

[vexing]

@vexing - wow, did not know that. I guess that makes sense though - the difficulty level only changes MY difficulty level, not theirs - but I could've swore that I read somewhere that Prince did not give the AI, nor me, an advantage.

yes, prince is touted in the game and occasionally elsewhere as being even, but it's not. there is no even setting, unless you modify the .xml files to set the AI's difficulty to prince. barring that, warlord difficulty would be pretty close - you get slightly toned down bonuses they get on chieftain, and the AI gets some penalties.

how this came to be is unknown to me, but i suspect they found giving the AI inherent bonuses easier than coding competent AI.

 

[Dedrytus]

jdbwillia, do not worry. After last patch I can not even start Utopia project. For example last game: I built only capital and puppeted some cities. 4th policy tree was almost filled but... it was year 1950. All civilizations were dead except one (with only one city left), last space ship part was for some turns in my capital. I wanted cultural victory but I was unable to do this.

 

[timtofly]

Egypt is one of the fastest culture "gaining" AI's available. If they had only 3 cities, then they must have been going for Utopia. I have never seen them that small. If you want to generate culture, you need more cities annexed and buildings that produce it, or stay small.

Having Cultural CS's in the modern era, will also give a lot of culture.

 

[King of Prussia]

I would suggst try to get the Piety tree done as fast as possible. That is what I did to help get my Cultural Victory. In the long run those % discounts will eventully add up. Also if you are playing with a lot of barbs, try doing the honour tree. That will get you a lot of culture.

Alao try and plan out what Social Policies you want to get and what order. Makes it a lot easier.

 

[muhtesem insan]

create a puppet empire...

 

[TPQ]

It is conceivable that Egypt popped some culture ruins early on, giving them a head-start. That and as Vexing mentioned, Prince is not even, despite what the in-game text has to say about it.

 

[Soronery]

yes, prince is touted in the game and occasionally elsewhere as being even, but it's not. there is no even setting, unless you modify the .xml files to set the AI's difficulty to prince. barring that, warlord difficulty would be pretty close - you get slightly toned down bonuses they get on chieftain, and the AI gets some penalties.

how this came to be is unknown to me, but i suspect they found giving the AI inherent bonuses easier than coding competent AI.

Seriously? Every SP strategy game gives AI bonuses at harder difficulty levels. Coding AI is not easy.