Promotions

[ElliotS]

Didn't you listen to CrazyG(*)? Logistics have several bonuses:
1. Hit and retreat.
2. More experience.
3. Extra damage when not moving, specially if you have the 'against wounded' promotion.
Now the only one that has been nerfed is #3.

(*) Obviously not, he didn't talk, he just wrote.

#1 was also nerfed, because hit and retreat deals 10% less damage than before. Logistics is still the best promotion, but I don't think it needs more nerfing. I think that making other promotion paths suck less is the better option.

 

[CrazyG]

This morning I played a war on Immortal, my India vs Rome. I kept track of every time an archer shot, and whether or not the unit it hit was damaged or not.

Of 187 shots, only 13 were on undamaged units. I suspected the ratio to be low, but not this low. Really the only reason to take accuracy right now is the uncommon need for siege archers, or to get the accuracy tier 4s. On later wars undamaged shots might be common though

Here are my suggestions for archer promotions

Barrage - no change needed
Accuracy - +10%RCS, +10% CS, +10% on cities
Make accuracy archers a little more sturdy. Barrage is still overall better, but I think this helps accuracy compete. I think city attack damage should stay, it does have some utility.

Logistics- the nerf helps, I think the better approach now is to buff its competition. I do think its okay for logistics to be strong because you sort of need this power later on when every melee unit has cover.
Range - does this need -20% combat strength? The extra range seems amazing, you get to deal damage without taking hits. The thing is you don't do very much damage so unless you need the 3rd range every single shot its kind of bad. In my experience, this just reduces your damage without benefit more often than logistics does. An archer with 1 level of barrage deals more damage than 3 accuracy, 1 range promoted archers do most of the time.Maybe just -10% would suffice
Snipers- it bothers me that logistics units outperform this promotion by so much. I would up the damage dealt to 35%. If possible, I think this promotion should work for undamaged units though. Potentially has great synergy with logistics archers
Infiltrators- could ignore zone of control be added to this? Its basically just for skirmishers, but I think that is okay.

 

[ElliotS]

So out of this discussion we got a nerf to logistics, but nothing else. I still think this is an issue that could use addressing. I'll restate my opinion for discussion's sake:

Here is my proposed changes to the archers/skirmishers:

Barrage side is the same.

Accuracy is changed to Hardened. Each level gives +10% RCS and +15% CS." Hardened 3 could offer medic 3 or march, but I don't think it needs to.

Here is my proposed changes to siege units:

Barrage changed from : "+5% RCS, +15% against wounded." to "5% RCS, +5 splash damage to adjacent hostile units." and logistics replaced with "+50% RCS to full health units." to avoid too much splash damage.

I feel that these changes will not only differentiate siege and archers, offer more choice, and more fun, but also improve the AI. (as I cringe whenever I see an AI's archers go accuracy.)

Lastly move supply to be behind level 1 coastal raider on melee ships.

 

[Bromar1]

So out of this discussion we got a nerf to logistics, but nothing else. I still think this is an issue that could use addressing. I'll restate my opinion for discussion's sake:

Here is my proposed changes to the archers/skirmishers:

Barrage side is the same.

Accuracy is changed to Hardened. Each level gives +10% RCS and +15% CS." Hardened 3 could offer medic 3 or march, but I don't think it needs to.

Here is my proposed changes to siege units:

Barrage changed from : "+5% RCS, +15% against wounded." to "5% RCS, +5 splash damage to adjacent hostile units." and logistics replaced with "+50% RCS to full health units." to avoid too much splash damage.

I feel that these changes will not only differentiate siege and archers, offer more choice, and more fun, but also improve the AI. (as I cringe whenever I see an AI's archers go accuracy.)

Lastly move supply to be behind level 1 coastal raider on melee ships.

I really like these suggestions. This will also make a lot of archer UUs better as they can be more durable with the hardened promotion.

I also agree with supply unlocking after coastal raider 1. Coastal raider is pretty lackluster so this would be a good buff