Raging Barbarians

[Joxer]

My Preferred Settings:
World Size: Standard - Huge
World Shape: Continents, Terra, Pangea
Speed: Marathon
Sea Level: Low
Climate: Tropical
version: Vanilla 1.61
No Barbarians

I am trying to improve my game at Noble level. Without the Raging Barbs setting, I can dominate most games and get most of the wonders, especially late game as I outpace the AI.

But when I add this one setting, my game goes down hill, really it falls of a cliff.

I do not seem to have the right playstyle with this setting as I get pounded by hordes of barbarians. If I do not have copper nearby I might as well start over as it just takes too long to research iron working before the horde crosses the borders. Archers seem to be a hit or miss against axemen so I just ignore Archery until I can extort it from someone or trade for it when I am ready to get feudalism and longbowmen.

If I do have copper, I can get 2-3 axemen out and slowly expand. But I miss out on some of the early wonders like Oracle/Pyramids.

The AI seems to be able to do better at dealing with them as they can place cities with impunity and also build the wonders.

Several Questions
- What units do you use to fogbust? How many?
- Early expansion strategy before barbarians arrive?After?
- Do you still plan an early war if you can?
- Does adding this setting raise the difficulty of a game that much?
- Should I just step up to Prince?

 

[OctavianFlu]

Hey Joxer. I know what your talk'n about. Putting that raging barbs on does indeed change how you play. Typically when I have that setting turned on I am conscious of where I put my units to defend my city. I will try to put archers in a defensive position where I think the barbs will take route.

For example, lets just say I have two resources that I would like to protect. I place an archer on both of them, plus an additional archer 1 square outwards. This might cause the barb to attack my later unit instead of my earlier defending resource unit. Even if the barb does go after my other defending unit I'll have a backup unit to help with the cause. Before long those XP points will be quite handy.

But!! If you are playing Warlords, just chop the great wall always seems to do the trick

 

[hvevo]

When I played Vanilla 1.61 (now playing mainly Warlords), I always played the Raging Barbarians setting on. My strategy was to bee-line to Bronze Working and establish a second city to claim copper. Sometimes the copper resource was far from the capitol but I rather try to overcome the initial problems with maintenance by modifying my strategy than by regenerating a new map. Anyway, after my second city was founded I either went for Archery (if the 2nd city was far from the capitol and copper would take many turns to connect) to defend my capitol before I could build axes or then for worker techs. Once copper was connected I knew that I would survive the barb hordes.

- What units do you use to fogbust? How many?
In Vanilla, I use axemen, since they are only ones to counter barb axes. In Warlords I use chariots. I usually have ~4 fogbusters outside cultural borders, one defender on every strategic resource and 1-2 inside cities. After that I consider myself capable of expanding more without worrying about barbarians.

- Early expansion strategy before barbarians arrive?After?
2nd city to be founded to claim copper. Once copper is connected, pump axes so that you can defend yourself. After you are able to stop the barb hordes without losing too many improvements etc, you can expand again, either peacefully or aggressively.

- Do you still plan an early war if you can?
Always. If I have copper/iron near the capitol, I rush with axes/swords. Otherwise I wait for cats.

- Does adding this setting raise the difficulty of a game that much?
No, it just gives you a reason to concentrate on your military from the beginning of the game. If you have copper nearby, it might actually make the game easier, since the AI doesn't know how to deal with barbarians efficiently and is scared of moving workers/settlers around, insted fortifying them in cities.

- Should I just step up to Prince?
If you can win most of the time at Noble with barbarians ON, I think you can handle Prince. It's not that big step up, really. OTOH, if you play with No Barbarians like you claim in your post, I would suggest you playing more at Noble level with barbs on. In my opinion, No Barbarians makes the initial game too easy.

 

[Ecofarm]

In vanilla, you are at a huge disadvantage with raging barbs.

Warlords = chariots (Egypt anyone?) and industrious for the wall (Ramesses anyone?).

 

[scooter]

As to moving up to Prince, once you get the hang of the barbarians, the step from Noble to Prince isn't really all that big, but Prince to Monarch is pretty hefty IMO. Definitely try to play with Barbarians on, it makes the game more balanced. I would not try to jump from no barbs to raging barbs... way too big an adjustment, raging barbs really is a lot (especially if you're isolated, you'll have a full-time job on your hands).

 

[Ankh-f-n-Khonsu]

I think he's playing with barbs on; it's when he sets them to rage that things go awry.

I know the feeling. In preparation for the latest WOTM I tried my first game with raging barbarians — this at Noble, when typically these days I play at Prince.

I got smeared. Eventually I get the continent fogbusted, but by then I'd spent so many resources I'm way behind in everything. Somewhere I'm not finding the proper balance.

I gave that game up and tried my second game with the ragers, this time the real WOTM. I got smeared.

 

[Ecofarm]

First, instead of moving up a difficulty level, mow someone's lawn and buy warlords. Then ask for advice - getting advice from long ago recollections (vanilla days) is hardly specific enough to solve immediate challenges. No-one capable of playing civ and reading forums is poor, just "update challenged".

 

[scooter]

First, instead of moving up a difficulty level, mow someone's lawn and buy warlords. Then ask for advice - getting advice from long ago recollections (vanilla days) is hardly specific enough to solve immediate challenges. No-one capable of playing civ and reading forums is poor, just "update challenged".

Wow... to the OP, ignore this person, it doesn't matter if you have warlords or not, they're both Civ and they're both a ton of fun. Everyone who has Warlords has Vanilla, so it doesn't make much of a difference anyway.

Honestly, I wouldn't mess with Raging Barbs quite yet, regular barbs can be hard enough when you get to higher difficulties (at least if you're a builder at heart like me). Try playing on Prince first (Barbs off for you first game, then turn them on if you do well without them), and let us know how it goes!

 

[Ecofarm]

I guess I was a little over the top, but warlords is worth the investment; that's all I meant to say.

 

[Harbourboy]

Just fog bust all over the place and then let the AI deal with the barbs that are rampaging all over their lands.

 

[Joxer]

Ecofarm
I guess I was a little over the top, but warlords is worth the investment; that's all I meant to say.

Aye, I would like to get the expansion but my wife controls the money. I have a few more date nights to go before I am there.






I am looking for the balance between building units and building wonders. If I can nab an early religion, I ignore stonehenge. I always go for the Oracle as it would be silly to not try for the free tech.

Since I play on Noble, the happiness cap is not too much of a pain so I fore go the Pyramids unless I have stone and an Industrious civ.

My usual build pattern in the capital is worker -> warriors until size 3 -> settler -> wonder(either Stone or Oracle)

Tech pattern: worker tech -> BW -> (worker tech if copper, Archery if no copper) -> AH -> (horses = HBR, no horses = Priesthood)

My second city builds a worker as well to speed up the resource hookups. Like everyone else, I try and find the second city next to copper. But its either near my capital or in Never Never Land so I am sunk and cannot invest the time to research Iron Working and hope I have some iron before the axemen come calling.

Do I need to change my opening build pattern?
Re-prioritize my wonders?
Really get Warlords for Great Wall and Chariot bonus vs Axemen?
(I would think I should be able to beat raging barbs without it)
Change my tech path?

 

[JIM G]

I dont think Stonehenge is useful to you in this case, Joxer - with barbs on the hammers are better spent on your army. Get religion early on and use it instead to push out your borders.
I wouldnt worry too much about having Iron if you do have copper. What you need to do is make sure you have your axes promoted as much as possible. To do this build barracks and then send your axes to to fight the barbs. Make sure you promote some to be anti-melee but also some should take woodsman and/or hill defense - then group axes together so their promotions complement each other. Make use of the terrain - station troops on hills or in woods. Use rivers to your advantage. Also once your units have reached 10 xpoints they wont gain any more from fighting barbs - pull those back & send newbies out.

 

[Wlauzon]

Raging barbs + tropical and Asoka can be an advantage on huge worlds, especially if you are playing seperate continents.

The key is that you HAVE to get the Great Wall. That puts all the other civs at a large disadvantage in the early game.

And the reason for tropical + Asoka (or Gandhi) is that the fast workers can clear jungle in one turn less.

That scenario works very well at Noble, not so well at Prince but still a slight advantage for some types of game play. Not that it is any worse for you at Prince, but the AI cheats so they get things faster and cheaper usually, offsetting some of the detriment they get from the barbs.

 

[Swift-N-Deadly]

Im new to this game, how do i change my settings so i can get no barbarians and also raging barbarians?

Also in multiplayer, what settings do most ppl play under?

I just use normal settings (cuz i dont no how to change it), except hte option to pick leader, map size, and type of map.

 

[Welnic]

After you choose single player, choose Custom Game instead of Play Game (or whatever the top choice is). It is mostly the same except that you will see a bunch of checkboxes of things that you can turn on or off.