Regent build order - need help/advice

[tdellaringa]

Hey All,

So I have been playing regent for awhile and win fairly often, usually win with a score between 3000 - 4000.

Problem is, when I don't win I usually get whacked around 900-1200 or abouts there via war.

What happens is I may be way ahead culturally, have the most land and not done anything to anger my neighbors - but they are all annoyed at me anyway (probably because I am ahead) and attack me. They always seem to have a better army than me.

Here is what I normally do build wise:

I often play America (usually actually) - I get scout warrior out my capitol, then start pumping out settlers.

I usually then mix workers, spearman and settlers early on. When I start building 4th, 5th cities - here is where I'm not sure.

Usually I build temples to help keep my people happy. I never build granaries at all, doesn't seem to matter. I also usually take my best producing city to pump out good stuff.

I'm wondering what you guys build at this point, should I not do the temples? They always take a long time but seem to help.

I like to get temples and marketplaces built in my outer cities, but I think at this point my enemies are building armies.

This brings me to the research order too - I often like to push to get to monarchy fast. I like to get the Oracle built and the Colussus built early, I rarely go for the pyramids.

Usually when I get off good I end up with most of the wonders early on at least - but I find that many times they catch up mid game and even surpass my ability to produce.

I like to get eduation/great library as well - some of you pros got to have some tips for me!

Tom

 

[zagnut]

If you go to the War Academy (left sidebar on main page) you will find some good articles on this subject. Try Cracker's Opening Plays and Faster Expansion.

I have found that a rigid set of opening plays is impossible in this game because there are so many different permutations. However, those articles can point you to some good opening strategies.

 

[Shabbaman]

Don't build workers. If you build an early granary, you'll be able to produce more settlers. In my experience the limiting factor in early settler-production is the little growth, not little production (shields).

What do you do with those workers anyway? You start with one worker, use it to mine near your capital. Don't irrigate, that doesn't work under depotism. Try to find and connect the luxuries. You can try to buy a slave worker from another civ (this has the advantage that it slows them down).

Check the war academy. You might want to join a succesion game too.

Succes!

 

[Tassadar]

Built a few archer and look at your domestic advisor telling that xxx civilisation fear our archer, that s good, if you have only defender, they wont fear you so much. So a few archer or horseman will detere a.i. to attack you. Trade with them, they love that.

 

[swiftsure]

With regard to irrigation and despotism it does add additional food to bonus resources like cattle and wheat. It also increses food production on flood plains. i always irrigate these resources especially on outer cities. Rapid growth in these cities with pop rushing is often more efficient than normal growth with crippling corruption and inefficency

 

[BillChin]

Originally posted by tdellaringa

...
Usually I build temples to help keep my people happy. I never build granaries at all, doesn't seem to matter. I also usually take my best producing city to pump out good stuff.
...

Granaries are very powerful. There is a big debate when and whether to build one in the capital, but building granaries for river cities is a no brainer. This will give you a huge boost mid-game when you have enough luxuries to go over pop seven. These granary cities can pump out settlers, workers or wonders as needed on Regent level. Using granaries efficiently will increase your expansion rate 20% to 50%. Imagine that!

On higher difficulty levels human expansion can not keep up, so early war is often an attractive option. Popular strategies for Emperor level include an archer rush with two or three cities, or a swordsmen or horsemen rush with four to six cities. On large maps, it may be Knights because there is room to build ten or more cities.
- Bill

 

[warpstorm]

In addition, if you are playing an Expansionistic civ (and you said you were) I'd recommend building one or more additional scouts right away. If you don't, you are wasting a good part of your civs trait.

 

[cracker]

Tom,

I would definately recommend that you read through the articles on improving your opening play sequences. These will help you a great deal.

Ignore any advice or comments that focus on a rigid prescribed build order, because these issues fail to recognize and understand the basics of terrian power and position assessment

Shabbaman,

You need to read the articles too. Your comments and advice that you posted in this thread are terrible indicators that you may not understand that basics of how the game is played. Understand how to use workers, undertand how irrigation works, understand how the despot penalty applies. Your comments about understanding growth limits and the value of buying early slaves are very valuable but the rest of your information is missing the mark.

Good luck,

 

[ripcord_tx]

Originally posted by Tassadar
Built a few archer and look at your domestic advisor telling that xxx civilisation fear our archer, that s good, if you have only defender, they wont fear you so much. So a few archer or horseman will detere a.i. to attack you. Trade with them, they love that.

Is this true? I suffer the same problem - I try to expand as much as I can with a spearman or two in each city, and if I expand too fast and I'm not well defended, the AI attacks. Usually when one attacks, they all attack. I've been appeasing them by giving them gold when they ask and trading when I can, but when I run out of stuff, here comes the pillaging.

Would a single archer deter this?

 

[cracker]

Ripcord,

I am pretty sure that the archer comment is not true. The AI evaluates military power on a localized basis for attack strategies and in addition it views units only as single purpose. In the AI's mindset a unit can only be offensive or defensive and can never switch roles.

A single archer will have no greater impact on your power assessment than a single spearman.

Number of cities has a greater impact on how they assess your power than the same number of military units. (I think the ratio is actuall in the 2 or 3 to one range where one city will add more power than 2 or 3 militray units.)

I have been noting some really screwy power assessment ratios in V1.29 in some games but have not yet fully quantified what the problem may be. There are obviously still some programming errors in how the AI advisors look at unit power and unit count because you can get some really wacko comments when the AI should be cowering behind fortifications in fear of its life.

We are working on the Quick Start data for this month and that may show that you still have to be more extreme in your choices to either expand more quicckly or build military more quickly that your current pace. A moderate path in the middle road will almost always get you attacked.

 

[Tassadar]

Built 1 archer and look into foreigh advisor screen, it will say xxx fear our archer, so since i built early archer in my game i dont suffer any bullying from a.i.. Send them on frontier town and built some wall, later on i trade with them and when i got the opportunity i attack ( with knight usualy).


So built a few archer in old age and come back to tell me your experience. i am sure a.i. will respect you much more.

 

[Allemand]

Even "good advice" will fall short if it doesn't consider the circumstances you are in. The ideal circumstances (for me) would be to have one or two green cows in your capital city's radius, then you are assured of a good start. In this case, I would build a granary in the capital but first I would pump out a couple of warriors and two or three more scouts. Playing America, the scouts should find a settler in a nearby hut in the first 10-15 turns, giving you a second city. After the granary is built, have the capital pump out about 6-7 settlers. By that time, you should be out of the ancient era (thanks to those scouts finding all the techs) and into Republic. Forget Monarchy, it's not nearly as good as Republic. Best bet is to research the Monarchy line slowly or at zero science (after you get Ceremonial Burial) while your scouts find the other stuff. The cities you created should have varying missions, some earmarked for wonders, some for units (put barracks in these), and one or two for building settlers. You may have a temporary shortage of units, but that second city can work on that until you get barracks in a couple others. The scouts may find some warriors, too. Warriors are good enough in the Ancient Era on a huge map. You should be out of it by 1500 BC, anyhow.

You seem preoccupied with early wonders, but most of them are nearly useless for America. You don't need the Great Library because you are ahead in the tech race (at Regent, for sure). The Pyramids is a good choice if you have a large continent, but not if it is small. The Colossus is nice to have, but not necessary on a huge map, you'll have enough cities to make its effects unimportant. The Great Lighthouse is really great if your map is not panagea, but with a panagea map it is simply nice to have. Any other ancient wonders should be iqnored, they are temporary and don't last long enough to justify the effort. The wonder race heats up in the Middle Ages because of the many useful ones there, so prepare your cities for that. Make sure some of them have temples, colloseums, marketplaces so they can put all their efforts into building Sun Tzu, Cistine, Leonardo, Magellan, JS Bach, and Smith. You'll need at least two, probably four cities prepared for that. Of course, an alternative is to go to war after you get Chivalry and get enough leaders to build those, but getting leaders is sometimes easy, sometimes hard, so don't count on that. Best to prepare your cities. The wonder cities should be near the capital, if possible (else you may need to build courthouses, which wastes a lot of time), and have at least 3-4 hills and some decent food sources (hills are most important, but you can't use many of them if you don't have food to offset their weakness).

Everything I've said fits the circumstance where you have good food sources in your capital, or in some nearby sites. However, if you get a crappy starting position then you can expect a hard time in the early going. For hard times, military units can make a big difference.