Revolution? (Number 9)

[duke o' york]

The time has come for us to evaluate our government situation. We are currently in a democracy and are making great advances in science and pots of cash but happiness problems are on the horizon and are in need of consideration. We have just discovered Communism and the benfits of this government to our empire are worthy of consideration. Erm, here.
I have included the other government options here too just in case but doubt that anyone will vote for them. At the moment I'd have thought that it is a straight choice between Democracy (my personal favourite) and Communisn (Ren's personal favourite). Which to go for? The choice is yours, although feel free to be swayed by other people or attempt to sway the vote of others by discussing the two options in this thread. If we decide to change our government then I shall post another thread for when: whether we change straightaway or wait for an Oedo year or wait until we have enough marketplaces or whatever. Please suggest the time you'd like the change to be made if you vote for anything other than Democracy.
(Number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9, number 9.................. sounds of Paul bundling Yoko into a sack and tying it)

 

[Zwelgje]

I'll go for democracy. Hapiness problems can be overcome by Women's Suffrage, building temples, cathedrals, marketplaces and stuff. On top of that we wanted to let the empire grow by celebrating and we have to give the people luxuries then. Therefore the people will be happy anyway. The benefits of democracy are clear (to me at least ).

 

[duke o' york]

I don't know what our chances of getting Women's Suffrage at the moment are, but I can hope. We've already got Cathedrals in all our cities thanks to Mike's but can always fill in any happiness gaps with colossea (happy Gamecatcher people?) or police stations if necessary. What is the per turn cost for a police station - I've never built one before.

 

[Kev]

Personally, I'm sure you all know that I think that Democracy is the place to be. I think that it's important to get the tech advantage to be sure to get things like Hoover and SETI as well as being first to techs like Mobile Warfare (Tanks) and Robotics (Howitzers). Not to mention the great results of trade - which should pick up in a serious way over the next batch of turns.

If we wish, once we have the ability to build tanks, howitzers, alpine troops (Tactics), and battleships (Automobile), THEN we may want to look at switching to a more military-friendly government and go all out. Even at that point, I'd rather go Fundy - which we'd either have to steal or get by taking over Pompeii as it's a dopey tech to actually study on our own.

The chances of getting Women's Suffrage is great if we wish to build it. We can do it NOW. I think that's likely the best one to do, and I think we can get the UN as well anyway. If we get both, then war in a democracy is much easier to navigate.

 

[duke o' york]

I too would favour fundy over communism as then we could fund our fundy fun (in plain English, pay for more troops) really easily, but this is a decision for the distant future and we should make the most of Democracy for the moment. All that cash! And all those lovely techs! I don't want to have to move governments if at all possible, but if another civ's on the verge of launching their SS then we should strike them down and nip their foolish dreams of victory in the bud. :nya2:

 

[Kev]

Agreed, duke. I don't think that we'll have to worry about a space race for quite a while yet. I think that we'll be fielding plenty of howitzers by the time the Apollo project comes to fruition.

Paul McCartney death hoax trivia: Did you know that the playing of the "Number 9" portion of "Revolution Number 9" BACKWARDS is supposed to sound like "Turn me on Dead Man"?

 

[Dell19]

Democracy for now but if we ever decide to have a large scale war then Fundy could be the way to go...

 

[Leowind]

Unless we're planning a major military offensive I say stay with Democracy. If and when we decide to go on the offensive we can switch to Fundy or Communism if Fundy not yet available to us.

 

[Duke of Marlbrough]

I don't think we will ever have such a large scale war that it woudl require us to switch governments. It's not like we are going to sit still and then launch attacks on the entire world at once. We already are advancing on a couple of fronts and once we have a break in the Wonder races, I think we will start to push out a bit more.

Democracy forever!

How much is a police station? I, too, have never built one.

If we miss out on WS, I think we should make the city that did build it our starting point for an offensive.

 

[Mr Spice]

Police stations cost 2 gold per turn. I am also in favour of democracy, but it does make it extremely important to upgrade our economic inftrastructure. We should for example make sure to get all three trade routes in all our cities. With large, well-developed cities and a strong economy, democracy is way better than both fundamentalism and communsim even when undertaking large offensives.

 

[Dell19]

Who voted to stay constantly in anarchy?

 

[elibb]

I also voted for Democracy because we're not in any large scale wars at the moment, so there is no reason to change to anything else as Democracy gives much better trade. Even we do get into a large war I think Democracy would be the best choice for a government because of the amount of gold we will generate.

 

[Ren]

Oh ****, things aren't looking too good for Communism

But I must confess that at this stage of the game Democracy is usually the better choice, although do Caravans count for out-of-city unhappiness?

I do, however, strongly disagree with the opinions of some of you about Fundamentalism. In short, it sucks! In more depth, sure you get 10 free units per city, and no unhappiness, but what about science? Are you planning to leave an offencive until we have reached Robotics?! What the **** is that?! We cannot afford to let the AI expand and that for that long, and Democracy isn't that good!

Having said that, Communism would be a good choice now, so we can start our crusades now. It's science isn't all that far behind Democracy, you don't get the unhapiness with units roaming that you do with Democracy, cash is pretty good, veteran spys can come in handy since nobody seems to like building Barracks and corruption is almost non existant, especially since our empire is pretty condensed at the moment. I know you don't get the trade bonuses that you get from Democracy, but even with the United Nations the senate is still a bastard to deal with, and since it really doesn't look like we're going to get the Statue (are we? I could be wrong here...Oh well) we can't afford to be revolting all the time to declare war.

In conclustion, Communism rules, that's all there is to it

 

[Zwelgje]

Originally posted by Ren
But I must confess that at this stage of the game Democracy is usually the better choice, although do Caravans count for out-of-city unhappiness?

Caravans aren't military units so they shouldn't count in for unhappiness. (Civ1 logic )

 

[duke o' york]

No, caravans don't count as military units for obvious reasons. Neither do dips nor spies nor transports.
I also don't think that you get veteran spies from having a barracks in the city. They become veteran after they successfully complete a mission, rather than being created vets unless under communism. Vet just means that they have a better chance of surviving a mission and returning home afterwards. I'm tempted to invite Mr Darkshade in here to "convince" you otherwise Ren, but it seems that the democratic decision points toward democracy at the moment.

 

[Ren]

For a start, Darkshade doesn't know whet he's talking about, I think it's a chronic disease common of South Australians And secondly, I'd appreciate if you leave it a bit longer until others read my comments on "Revolting Matters*"

*Sorry, couldn't help myself

 

[duke o' york]

Ren, your arguments can't possibly stand for anything if you aren't even convinced enough to vote for Communism yourself!

 

[Dell19]

Originally posted by duke o' york
Ren, your arguments can't possibly stand for anything if you aren't even convinced enough to vote for Communism yourself!

He wants us to go to communism in the future, for now he is happy with a democracy...

 

[Kev]

Originally posted by Dell19
Who voted to stay constantly in anarchy?

Perhaps "Fonz" stopped by to give us some more insight.

And welcome elibb. Please feel free to speak up more!

 

[Ren]

Originally posted by Dell19
He wants us to go to communism in the future, for now he is happy with a democracy...

Well you're partly right, but Communism now looks better in light of the new evidence (our planned conquests in China)

Democracy is good only for mid game play, where peace rules and science & money are needed to get wonders. I don't care what you others say, I've tried Democracy in war time and it just doesn't work. (note the period)