RFC:I - Civ Discussion.

[kairob]

What I could do with here is ideas for the UP, UU, UB, UHV, Leaders and Spawn Dates for all the civs in the game. I will collect all the attempts in this first post for easy access.

Britain, France, Spain, Portugal, Netherlands, Russia, Turks, USA need only minor tweaks to UHV's:

Spoiler :

British UHV:
1. Found at least 3 cities in every continent by 1730 AD
2. Have 3 none-european Vassals in 1950 AD
3. First to enter Industrial and Modern era

French UHV:
1. Colonize Quebec, the Hudson Bay and Louisiana by 1760 AD
2. Build Notre Dame, the Statue of Liberty and the Eiffel Tower in Paris by 1900 AD
3. Control Louisiana and Canada by 1950 AD

Spanish UHV:
1. No English, or French, or Dutch cities in the Americas in 1700 AD
2. Control Aztec and Incan territory in 1760 AD
3. Control the Core Area of 3 European Civilizations

Portuguese UHV:
1. Have the most explored map of the world in 1650 AD
2. Have open borders agreement with 12 other civs in 1650 AD
3. Found 15 extra-European colonies

Dutch UHV:
1. Have the most extended map of the world in 1650 AD (50 years later)
2. Be the first to found a city in Australia
3. Secure or get by trade 7 spices resources by 1775 AD

Turkish UHV:
1. Control the Balkans, the Black Sea and Mesopotamia in 1700 AD
2. Spread Sunni Islam to every Persian city by 1800 AD
3. Have as vassal states at least 3 other civs in 1870 AD

I have done one as an example, feel free to criticize as I know very little about the Safavid Empire and am getting all my info off the internet...

Completed Civs:
(Still open to debate though)

For some unknown and unexpected reason by internet died whilst saving some changes during editing this page, information past this point is randomly missing and I don't have time to fix it until later today. Sorry for the invonveniance.

 

[Zagoroth]

Well one way to go with China is to have an alternate history beginning in colonization. This would be because the mod starts around the time of the Treasure Ships.

UHV:
1. Be the first civilization to build a city in North America
2. The Sino-Japanese union- vassalize or control Japan by 1580 C.E.
3. Be the first civilization to undergo the Industrial Revolution.

Those would be an example of an alternate history UHV. However if we only wanted a max of one overly alternate history criteria then this would be better.

UHV:
1. Be the first civilization to build a city in North America (one overly alternate history criteria)
2. Have open borders agreement with Portugal, the Netherlands, Spain, and Japan by 1600 ish
3.Control or control by trade six resources of silver by 1830 C.E.

 

[JiimBV]

Canada

Leader(s):
MacDonald
Trudeau
King

Spawn Date:
1867 (or closest to)

UP:
Power of the CPR: -50% time required to build a railroad
OR
Power of the Great White North: Tundra produces +1
OR
Power of the North-West Passage: All coastal cities have +1
OR
Power of the Fur Trade: All furs produce +5 OR Furs are not obsolete after plastics

UB:
Microwave Station: Replaces Broadcast Tower:
+100% culture instead of +50%
OR
Hockey Rink: Replaces Amphitheatre:
+1 per ice square in the city's fat cross instead of +1

UU:
Canada Corps: Replaces Infantry:
2 instead of 1
OR
Mountie: Replaces Cavalry:
14 instead of 15
+50% vs. gunpowder units

UHV:
1: Build a railroad from the Atlantic to the Pacific by 1900 (did do)
2: Control 8 fur resources by 1920 (did do)
3: Control America by 1950/1975/2000 (didn't do but wanted to)

 

[kairob]

@ Zagoroth - Sorry, but I don't see how your UHVs for china relate to its achievements or desires. Thanks for your contribution nonetheless though, input is always welcome.

@ JiimBV - Thank for your Canada ideas, they all look very good to me. I quite like the idea of combining your Power of the Great White North and the Hockey Rink, but with some tweaking.
Firstly does Tundra currently gives nothing? If so then giving it +1 still wont make anyone work it. So how about their UP makes tundra give 2 and 1 like Inca mountains?
Secondly I like the Hockey Rink but think that +1 per ice tile is both overpowered and hard to code. How about just + 2 and +25% ?

Your UHV's look good, but again coding gets in the way. Railroad ones sound good but I think I remember hearing that they are hard to code (otherwise the British UHV will change to make the Cape to Cairo). So the first two look good but we need one more.

Also about the fur one, I particularly like that as it is a very subtle way of saying 'control Canada'. I don't know about the number 8 though, I'll load up civ later. I think the number of furs should be the same as however many furs the are in the whole of North America.

Lastly I thought Mounties were a branch of the police? If so they wouldn't be suitable for a UU...



EDIT:
Checked in WB and the are 6 furs in canada. I think that the objective should therefore be to control 6 fur resources. (i.e. in your territory and not via trade. If possible you should be able to sell and swap these and still achieve the goal, but if thats not possible then maybe we should have one of the corps rewarding furs instead, so at least they will have a chance at making them useful.

 

[JiimBV]

Oh, yeah, the 8 was a random guess. So then 6, as you say.

So was the tundra, unfortunately I've never played as Russia or the Vikings, or any civ with tundra in it. So whatever it takes to make tundra usable.

Hmm... let's see... 2+ and +25% works. And as for a new UHV..

I'm really having trouble thinking of another one. Ugh.

OOH!

1: Control 6 fur resources by 1920 (did do)
2: Have a peacekeeping unit in every nation and/or have no nation be at war in 1950 (did do.. sorta)
3: Control America by 2000 (didn't do but wanted to)

2: Basically have a unit in every country, requiring open borders with every country. The only major war was the Korean War, right? And Korea is non-exsistent in RFC, so this is plausable. Please be easy to code. Or at least the second part be easy to code.

Two and three conflict, I know, but it'll add to the fun/difficulty, wouldn't it?

And yeah, I know about the Mounties, but I at least wanted to give you a choice

 

[kairob]

How about 'Do not Declare war on any Old World Civ' before 1950? Its similar and sounds more code-able.

EDIT: Are they called Canada Corps or Canadian Corps?

 

[JiimBV]

That's completely and utterly unrealistic. It declared war on Germany in WW2. I don't think that would work very well. Best would be a "No wars in the world in 1950", which seems easy to mod, and possible but difficult to play, and is realistic considering the civilizations that would be in this version of RFC. And it would represent Canada's role in WW2 and peacekeeping.

Oh, sorry, Canadian Corps. Sorry.

EDIT: For , , etc. need to have the first letter to be lower-case in order for it to show.

 

[kairob]

Yeah, good point. No Wars in 1950 seems a bit odd though, as its totally out of the players control if two foreign parties declare war on each other in 1949...

How about have open borders with 8 civs? be the highest scoring ex colony? control Alaska? (did Canada want Alaska?)

 

[JiimBV]

Hmm.. yeah. Open borders with 8 civilizations.. Seems reasonably difficult, especially since you'll need to be at war with America, which may end up being friends with most of Europe, the only possibility for a religious friend.

And don't we..err..you lol need new UHVs for most of Europe? Portugal and Holland do for sure.

EDIT: No, I'm pretty sure we didn't, and if we did, we already have one thing we didn't accomplish.

 

[kairob]

Cool, I'll put in the 8 Open Borders then, it represents both your diplomatic success as well as your place as one of the worlds biggest trading nations.

 

[JiimBV]

Aww shucks. Why thank'ee.

And here's some ideas for the ones already in RFC. Not Germany or China or Japan, just the others.

Britain: Fine, but may want to change "Be the first to circumnavigate", as that would've happened by 1500 or whenever this starts. Maybe a conquering of Germany UHV, or a bombing of Germany UHV. Or a defense of the British Isles UHV. I dunno.

France: All work perfectly, and colonizing Quebec and Hudson's Bay helps with Canada spawning.

Spain: "Be the first to found a city in America", definitely want to change, as they should start with cities in the Americas. Perhaps something to do with Spain at home. Also, add Franco as a leaderhead.

Portugal: "Have the most explored map of the world in 1500AD", maybe move it later.

Netherlands: Fine.

Russia: Great.

Turks: "Control the Bosporus (the Istanbul Strait) by 1500AD" needs to be moved slightly later or replaced.

America: Great. Might want to include something with Mexico and Canada but not needed.

EDIT: OOOPSS!!! Please forgive me.. I just realized that it starts by 1500 or earlier. I thought it was in 1660.

Fixed everything.

 

[kairob]

Britain: Fine, but may want to change "Be the first to circumnavigate", as that would've happened by 1660 or whenever this starts. Maybe a conquering of Germany UHV, or a bombing of Germany UHV. Or a defense of the British Isles UHV. I dunno.

How about 'Control 3 Vassals' by 1900? With so many colonial civs (particularly, Canada, Australia and India) it will make it a matter of being the dominant power in its historic area...

France: All work perfectly, and colonizing Quebec and Hudson's Bay helps with Canada spawning.

How about Control Louisiana (2 cities) and Canada (4 cities or vassal) in 1800? This would force them to compete with Britain for Canada, as well as fend of the Americans for at least a while.

Spain: "Be the first to found a city in America", definitely want to change, as they should start with cities in the Americas. Perhaps something to do with Spain at home. Also, add Franco as a leaderhead.

Portugal: "Have the most explored map of the world in 1500AD", maybe move it later. Same with "Have open borders agreement with 12 other civs in 1650".

How about most explored map in 1650?

Turks: "Control the Bosporus (the Istanbul Strait) by 1500AD" needs to be replaced. Moving it later would be kinda stupid.

Agreed. How about the aim of stamping out Shi'a, maybe 'Spread Sunni Islam to every city in Persia by a certain date?' (If Persia is a theocracy this may well mean invasion), control North Africa? or even be first to enter the industrial era?

I also think the vassal one needs replacing too, but like you say the arn't many ideas for them.

America: Great. Might want to include something with Mexico and Canada but not needed.

Again, I agree, Manifest Destiny would be nice, but isn't a top priority.

 

[JiimBV]

Austria

Leader:
Ferdinand I (if someone could find a leaderhead)
Maria Theresa

Spawn Date:
1500

UP:
Power of the Hapsburgs:
Start with diplomatic bonus with all European civs, and defensive pact with Spain

UB:
Opera House: replaces Theatre
1 , 5 culture, +25% culture

UU:
Grenzer: Replaces Rifleman
+50% vs. gunpowder units

UHV:
1: Change Government to Hereditary Rule by 1510 AD, never change again until 1900 AD
2: Control Germany and Bosporus by 1800 AD
3: Vienna must be the most cultural city in the world in 1850 AD







British UHV:
1. Found at least 3 cities in every continent by 1730 AD
2. Have Canada, India and Australia as vassals in 1950 AD
3. First to enter Industrial and Modern era

French UHV:
1. Colonize Quebec, the Hudson Bay and Louisiana by 1760 AD
2. Build Notre Dame, the Statue of Liberty and the Eiffel Tower in Paris by 1900 AD
3. Control Louisiana and Canada by 1950 AD (requires war with Canada and America)

Spanish UHV:
1. No English, or French, or Dutch cities in the Americas in 1700 AD
2. Control Aztec and Incan territory in 1760 AD
3. Have Spain and Austria be the only civilizations in Europe in 1900 AD (Hapsburg Alliance)

Portuguese UHV:
1. Have the most explored map of the world in 1650 AD
2. Have open borders agreement with 12 other civs in 1650 AD
3. Found 15 extra-European colonies

Dutch UHV:
1. Have the most extended map of the world in 1650 AD (50 years later)
2. Be the first to found a city in Australia
3. Secure or get by trade 7 spices resources by 1775 AD

Turkish UHV:
1. Control the Balkans, the Black Sea and Mesopotamia in 1700 AD
2. Spread Sunni Islam to every Persian city by 1800 AD
3. Have as vassal states at least 3 other civs in 1870 AD

 

[kairob]

Sounds good in general, but the name Opera House is already taken by the national wonder and I don't like the Spanish Hapsburg UHV of no other Euro Civs.

Also, would close allies be the best way to describe the Austrian-Spanish relations or would one be a vassal of the other?

 

[JiimBV]

Oh, forgot about that. I exclusively play RFC, so I rarely ever build the Opera House. Austrian Theatre? Operahaus? Opera Theatre?

They were not vassals as far as I know, Spain to Austria or Austria to Spain., rather two kingdoms ruled by the Hapsburgs. They were bound together by continuous inter-marriage and an alliance based on the fact they thought themselves higher than the rest of Europe. As for the no non-Hapsburg civs in Europe, that was simply because I had NO other ideas for a UHV. Can you think of anything? I'm drawing blanks.

How are things coming along for RFC:I Kairob? Whatcha got done so far?

 

[kairob]

Very little so far but I have had a couple of goes at changing things (like the new calendar is in place) and the game still works so thats good. I am mainly focusing on learning python by reading through the tutorials and stuff.

 

[merijn_v1]

UP:
Power of the Hapsburgs:
Start with diplomatic bonus with all European civs, and defensive pact with Spain

UB:
Opera House: replaces Theatre
1 , 5 culture, +25% culture

UU:
Grenzer: Replaces Rifleman
+50% vs. gunpowder units

Spanish UHV:
1. No English, or French, or Dutch cities in the Americas in 1700 AD
2. Control Aztec and Incan territory in 1760 AD
3. Have Spain and Austria be the only civilizations in Europe in 1900 AD (Hapsburg Alliance)

UP: I don't like the DP with Spain. It's a UP for Spain too this way. And the UP is the same as the France. And then it isn't a Unique power.

UB: The same UB as China, but more powerful. And not Unique building.

UU: The same as the UB. Same but more powerful.

UHV Spain 3: This is then also a UHV for Austria. And nearly impossible.

 

[kairob]

All good criticism. Do you have any alternative suggestions?

 

[BurnEmDown]

Austria's UHV shouldn't be "change to HR by 1510" because then humans who played some other civ and want to switch to the Austrians could find that the computer switched to something else (or just stayed in despotism) and it will ruin their UHV.

For the British UHV, instead of specifically Australia, Canada and India as vassals, just say "3 non-European vassals".
For French UHV, Notrde Dam will be already built in Paris, so something else could replace it.
Spanish UHV: Maybe instead of no other civ in Europe whatsoever (except for Austria) don't include Russia and any vassals of Spain or Austria. (If Austria gets a vassal and you must destroy it it pretty much means you're gonna have to eliminate all of Europe).
Dutch UHV: Maybe instead of 7 spices it could be 1 of each spice group and 1 of each X group? (could be silk, ivory, Bananas, any other resource which fits).
Turkish UHV: instead of 3 vassal states, how about control Austria's Core zone? (or 2 vassal and Control Austria's Spawn zone).
BTW kairob, what do you think about UHVs and the later starts? I mean could it be possible for a player to start in ~1600 (whatever the second start's date) as a civ which already "completed" it's first 2 UHVs or is about to and then all he has to worry about is the 3rd one?

 

[Zagoroth]

During the Ming dynasty China was trading with the Portuguese, Dutch, and Spain. At this time they were increasing the wealth of the country. Between this time and the Opium Wars they were trading tea, silk, and china for silver to increase the nation wealth. That is how the UHV conditions are related.