scientific leaders for AI. help needed!

[altanneruon]

i am building newtons in one of my towns, about 10 turns ahead of my biggest rival ( found this out using espionage), but they managed to complete it before me somehow. i can only assume that they were given a scientific leader, and use him to hurry production. i thought that the AI especially on chieftain level only used their scientific leaders to increase science output in their towns. is there any way i can prevent the AI from recieving a great scientist, as i know that there is always only a very small chance he will appear? i would even start war with them to stop them beating me to this great wonder. what can i do, any suggestions?

 

[timerover51]

i am building newtons in one of my towns, about 10 turns ahead of my biggest rival ( found this out using espionage), but they managed to complete it before me somehow. i can only assume that they were given a scientific leader, and use him to hurry production. i thought that the AI especially on chieftain level only used their scientific leaders to increase science output in their towns. is there any way i can prevent the AI from recieving a great scientist, as i know that there is always only a very small chance he will appear? i would even start war with them to stop them beating me to this great wonder. what can i do, any suggestions?

When you start a new game, and get to the player set-up screen, you have the game setting box at the bottom of the screen. In the box is a button for whether or not you want to allow Science Great Leaders. If you uncheck it, then no Science Great Leaders will appear. In Conquests, Military Great Leaders evidently cannot hurry production, so there would be no way for wonders to be sped up.

 

[Spoonwood]

I think the AI can use MGLs to rush wonders in Conquests, but the human player can't.

 

[vmxa]

Yes the AI can rush a wonder with an MGL as they do not go through the GU interface. Having a head start does not tell us the whole story. When you checked on the town how many shields did they have in the box?

How many were they making, net, each turn? How many did you have in the box and how many where you making in that town?

IOW, if they had 20 and you had 20 and they were size 12 and in a GA and net twice as many per turn as you they can make up time. The other thing is the level. If you are above Regent, they pay less for a wonder than you will.

Even a 10% difference will make an impact on a large wonder. 600 saves 60 shields, more if you are on even Emperor. The point is you have to know all of these things to determine if they used a leader of any kind. Well you could run the save into CPRViewr.

 

[timerover51]

I think the AI can use MGLs to rush wonders in Conquests, but the human player can't.

Hmm, interesting, I will keep that in mind when doing mods. Also, something interesting has shown up in my Naval Mod. So far, every time I build the Great Library, with the first free tech it gives me, I am getting a Scientific Great Leader. So far, this has happened with the Dutch, the Byzantines, the Vikings, and the Spanish, so the Scientific Trait does not seem to be a factor. Also, in the same mod, I am just about always getting a Scientific Great Leader sometime in the Middle Ages with a new advance. Is there any chance that I have accidently hit a quirk in the hard-coding?

 

[Spoonwood]

The editor warns you that changing the game rules might have strange effects.

 

[timerover51]

The editor warns you that changing the game rules might have strange effects.

Yes, it does, and apparently changing the rules the way that I have done has had some odd ones. I wonder what the next one will be? Hopefully, non lethal.

 

[Civinator]

SGL:

The option for SGLs in the last version of the editor (1.03) is broken. This means, if you create or mod a biq with the editor you normally have, you won´t get a SGL. For the normal epic game in C3C SGLs are working as long as the editor isn´t used for that biq.

Countermeasures: Create the mod or scenario with Steph´s editor or the editor version 1.00, which was coming with the vanilla version of C3C. Here this option is working well.

MGL:

MGLs can hurry the production of all kind of buildings except Great Wonders. So for example they can be used for rush building small wonders.

It was frequently reported, that the AI can hurry Great Wonders with MGLs (what the player can´t do).

 

[timerover51]

SGL:

The option for SGLs in the last version of the editor (1.03) is broken. This means, if you create or mod a biq with the editor you normally have, you won´t get a SGL. For the normal epic game in C3C SGLs are working as long as the editor isn´t used for that biq.

Countermeasures: Create the mod or scenario with Steph´s editor or the editor version 1.00, which was coming with the vanilla version of C3C. Here this option is working well.

I would have to check what version of Conquest Editor that I am using, but it is the one that came with the Civilization 3 Complete version that is part of the Civilization Chronicles. I have been using that editor a fair amount and I have been getting Science Great Leaders on a fairly regular basis, with the option of rushing a Great Wonder or boosting science output. I will try and post a screen shot the next time I get one. With my Naval Mod, I am getting a Science Great Leader with EVERY GAME if I build the Great Library first and get the two free techs that I have it set to give. Again, I will take and post a screen shot of the occurrence.

MGL:

MGLs can hurry the production of all kind of buildings except Great Wonders. So for example they can be used for rush building small wonders.

It was frequently reported, that the AI can hurry Great Wonders with MGLs (what the player can´t do).

I have the Great Library, Sun Tzu's Art of War, the Heroic Epic, Newton's University, and the Military Academy all set to produce Leaders in the Naval Mod. With the unit editor for leader, I have the "build army", "finish improvements", and "science age" all checked. The Leaders that are produced by the Wonders can all build armies, but they can only rush Great and Small Wonders. They cannot rush ordinary buildings.

If you wish, I would invite you to try it out. Now, I am on a Macintosh verses a Windows box, so I do not know if that might make a difference. I tried out the mod on the Windows box, and did not notice any differences. I will endeavor to play a game through the building of the Great Library on the Window machine and see what happens.

 

[Civinator]

INow, I am on a Macintosh verses a Windows box, so I do not know if that might make a difference. I tried out the mod on the Windows box, and did not notice any differences. I will endeavor to play a game through the building of the Great Library on the Window machine and see what happens.

This could be the difference. I was talking about pc SGLs and MGLs. If you have a biq that was treated with the wrong editor, the blue option for SGLs in the start menue is greyed out. And I was speaking about battle-created MGLs (as they are in the normal epic game), not about autoproduced SGls. Btw.: How well does the AI use these autoproduced SGLs?

CivComplete/Chronicles (for pc) contains editor version 1.03.

 

[timerover51]

This could be the difference. I was talking about pc SGLs and MGLs. If you have a biq that was treated with the wrong editor, the blue option for SGLs in the start menue is greyed out. And I was speaking about battle-created MGLs (as they are in the normal epic game), not about autoproduced SGls. Btw.: How well does the AI use these autoproduced SGLs?

CivComplete/Chronicles (for pc) contains editor version 1.03.

The editor in my copy is 1.3, which I assume is the same as everyones. I will post screen shots on the Creation and Customization Forum of the settings that I am using, as the Blue Option for SGLs in the start menu is working for both Windows and Mac versions, and I have gotten SGLs in both versions with my modified biq files. The interesting thing about the autoproduced Leader units is that while I have the Science option checked, all they can do is build armies, and hurry production of Wonders, Great and Small. As for how the AI uses them, I have never checked.