Seige range

[vexing]

Also, I don't think it's that complicated with a range of 3. The rules are consistent, you just need to apply them step by step.

the hexagonal pattern does make things complicated in the third ring. if you look at my middle photo you'll see a situation like this:

o-o-o-u-
-1-o-h-o
o-o-o-2

you have unit at u, hill at h, open terrain at o, targets at 1 and 2. you can't hit 1 because of the hill left and below the unit, even though in reality it's blocking none of the line of sight, yet you can hit 2 directly below you even though the same hill is blocking 50% of the line of sight.

 

[Deau]

Thumbs up for potatosalad's post #12, it's all a matter of nearby tiles height with regards to your own height. Forests adds an height to go through but not for fireing (aka even if you're on a forest hills, you can't shoot beyond an adjacent forest hills)

The only distinction is you need to have sight to your target and siege weapons have reduced vision.

vexing's pointer to range-3 & hexing coding is interesting but is an issue that somewhat rarely occurs since baseline range-3 units have indirect fire.

 

[vexing]

i gave longbowmen 6 range, and am now more mystified than before.
why isn't the cow hittable? there are just forests between the two.

 

[Deau]

i gave longbowmen 6 range, and am now more mystified than before.
why isn't the cow hittable? there are just forests between the two.

Is there not a "hidden/broken" forest-hills that appears as a flat-forest on the way? I know I often see a few broken tiles that show as flat and are in fact hills.

Edit : another funny/awkward one is 3 tiles to the south. There is a forest/hills that blocks sight but it only blocks it for the forest SE and not to the forest SW of it...There is probably some kind of awkward pathing in the code involving a priority on hex sighting which was also kinda pointed out on your first post Vexing

 

[vexing]

i'm just going to chalk it up as yet another bug. thankfully the rules are at least consistent in the second ring, and 3 range (without indirect fire) is fairly unusual.

 

[Deau]

i'm just going to chalk it up as yet another bug. thankfully the rules are at least consistent in the second ring, and 3 range (without indirect fire) is fairly unusual.

Yeah there is hardly a point in doing a robust pathing that handles range>3 if no unit is supposed to get it w/o indirect fire. That being said, the range:3 pathing is also somewhat awkward. It seems consistent with itself but definitely not logical.

If you picture the hexagon movement as 1-6 starting @ 1 o'clock and going clockwise, you will notice on your SS that 2 tiles north & south from the Chu, there is a forest/hills that should prevent fireing past it.

Now a 1-1-6 path is fine but a 6-6-1 path isn't yet both tiles should be equally restricted by the tile on 1-6 or 6-1. Same occurs to the south where 4-4-3 is fine and 3-3-4 isn't whilst the tile on 3-4 or 4-3 is the one locking the view.

a rough overview leads to saying that the 1-4 axis is favored over the 2-5 axis which is favored over the 3-6 axis for pathing but even based on this, the ranges 4-6 still have many, many awkward issue. This simple priority on pathing also doesn't fix the cow issue you pointed as it should be pathed through 1-1-2 by the above which has no clear height object restraining view

 

[Johan de Witt]

Let's break this down...


You can always shoot all adjecent hexes, so all X1 hexes are shootable.

Because the unit is on a hill, only forested hills and mountains break line of sight. There are no forested hills in the X1 hexes, so all X2 hexes are viable for shooting. If there would've been a forested hill in hex E1 for example, hex I2 would not be viable since E1 would've broken the line. Notice that H2 and J2 would still be viable because the line would pass E1 but never cut it.


There are some strange things at range 3 though...
B3 is not viable... the line goes through A1 and then B2 which breaks the line (forested hill).
C3 is viable, but this is just weird in this game. The line would go through B1 and then B2 which should break the line, but apparently doesn't while with the line to B3 it did...

Same thing happens with K3 and L3. Both times the lines would go through H2, but with L3 it doesn't break the line and with K3 it does.

Also, the example I gave for H2 and J2 doesn't work on the third line. When drawing a line from the unit to I3, it doesn't cross F2 but somehow it does break the line...

EDIT: While writing this, I realize my own fault... Because we're not looking from above but with an angle, it seems like the line doesn't break F2, but it does. This doesn't explain why H3 is viable though.

Perhaps it is because H3 is also a hill? You can shoot over a forested hill, but only when the hex behind it is also a hill?

 

[vexing]

being in a forest removes third ring visibility from the left-lower two and right-upper two tiles.