SGOTM 10 - Team Liz

[markh]

Pity we do not have cannons. They could possibly bring the hitpoints of a BG down and force it to retreat if in our borders and given the AI keeps their usual manner.

 

[Paul#42]

Pity we do not have cannons. They could possibly bring the hitpoints of a BG down and force it to retreat if in our borders and given the AI keeps their usual manner.

If the test shows that cavs don't do any harm, I will rush some arties in our towns on barb continent. It's all about money - Who said we had enough?!?

EDIT: Can't wait to play again! I should have taken a vacancy day for this

 

[Andronicus]

I'm pretty sure if there is more than one unit fortified there it would appear so. By my rough calculations it might take 8-10 cavs to knock off each hit point - thats 64-80 cavs to take down 1 BG. I recommend attacking with 100, although if we control the territory the BG is in I would support a lower number (perhaps 40 or 50 in case that's successful). Rushing some cannons seems like a good idea provided they all get there on time. Need to settle and attack in same turn so BGs dont get chance to bombard units sitting in new town (then any units behind mountains could come in for the kill).

 

[Paul#42]

in 540 AD with 1 turn to go, I take another time inflicted break.

Record is 54-13 kills, with 11 elite victories still no MGL
settlers will have to walk for two more turns to found a town next to mountains. They seem to form a wall around a 3x3 quadrat. It does not look like it has an island in the middle.

Ahead lies some more attacks (I hope to get 2-3 other towns in the next turn) and lots of MM...

I will finish tonight. Sorry for the delay.

 

[Abegweit]

If A team has finished, there can't be any island. Also, if they are finished, the posted date will be their penultimate submission, not the last one.

 

[Paul#42]

After flight check
Barbies are down to 5-6 towns. Okay, one of them is a little tricky though...
slaves near Neu Dover shall build a road to connect ivory.
Lots of cavs have movement left, so do some workers and settlers.
The southern part of barbie continent has no settler. Just some stray units.
17 elite wins did not give us a leader

Barbies in the fog
7SW-1S of New Chehalis is a MoW that I just moved via Goto - passing by I saw a barb galley 3 SE! (see screenie)
It might carry a settler, It has to be killed!
Another galley is between to NE islands. Same! I used our MoW there to bomb New Chanca

combat settlers
East of olive hill near Barb Stronghold are 6 slaves to build a road so the settler NE can found a town on the olive hill next turn. On the hill 4 SW there is another settler to found another town next turn. Three cavs should be enough to protect him, barbie sends a single knight every turn plus a LB every now and then...

tactics
Don't be surprised to see some slaves in enemy territory. I used them as recon and shields
Our strike should be on a BG that has a plain or grassland adjacent on the other side so we can move from out of range to the city in one turn. The south-most tile looks like a plain. Fog gazers? (See screenie)

foreign affairs
Bill has been silent all the time. Luxes make happy and peacefull
We are strong compared with barbies with our 116 cavs.

finance
I raised luxury rate to 30% to be save because we had enough money (did I really say that?!?) to do upgrades and some short rushes.
Let's go, let the next set be our last one!!

Reinforcements
Our ship chain has just been torn by my fault. There are 8 cavs on sea

I forgot to set back some game options (show movement etc.).
I hope I have no units left on Gotos...

Here is the save

 

[Paul#42]

Battle details

0) 500 AD
Switch all settler builds with more than 10 turns to go to wealth.
Shortrush lots of horses.
Gift wines, dyes and spices to Bill to lower sneak chances.
Cancel some road and mine builds in corrupt areas - we only need irrigation and population there
Man-O-Wars sink two galleys [2-0], capture a new one (who needs to build them, anyway? ).
Change all Man-O-War-builds to barracks...
Send Man-O-War to explore the islands and clear Pirates' coasts
MM to 840 gpt.
current military: 98 cavs, 4 horses, 8 MoW, 17 Galleons.

IBT
vet MDI (2/5) kills cav [2-1]

1) 510 AD
vet cav kills vet pike [3-1]
Zapotec
vet cav (3/4) kills vet pike [4-1]
vet cav loses to vet pike (1/4) [4-2]
e cav (4/5) kills vet pike [5-2, 1ev]
e cav (4/5 kills 1/4-pike [6-2. 2ev], takes town [11, 11 resistors].
New Apache
vet cav (1/4) kills reg pike [7-2]
vet cav (4/4) kills reg pike [8-2], takes town [2], razed, two slaves.
New Zipo (north of New Apache)
vet cav (4/4) kills reg pike [9-2]
vet cav (2/4) kills reg pike [10-2],takes town [5], razed, five slaves.
Olmec 2
vet cav (4/4) kills vet pike [11-2]
vet cav (1/4) kills vet spear [12-2], autorazes town, destroys galley.

3/5-cav kills reg pike [13-2]
MoW (3/4) kills galley [14-2]

Found Neu Newcastle next to silks, keep Zapotec next to furs, now 5 luxuries
MM to 886 gpt. short rush some horses.
rush a galleon on the east coast.
send some cavs to barb island NW of barb continent.

IBT
some artillery (BG?) redlines cav on hill.
vet longbow loses to 3/4-cav (4/5) [15-2]
vet knight loses to vet cav (3/4) [16-2]
galley loses to MoW (3/5) [17-2]
build 11 horses.

2) 520 AD
Upgrade 10 horses
now we have 115 cavs.

New Chehalis[5]
3/4-cav (1/4) kills reg pike [18-2]
3/4-cav (1/4) kills reg pike [19-2], takes town [4, 4 resistors, barracks].
Chehalis [12]
vet cav retreats from reg pike (1/3)
vet cav loses to reg pike (2/3) [19-3]
vet cav loses to reg pike (2/4) [19-4]
vet cav (2/4) kills 2/3-pike [20-4]
4/5-cav retreats from 2/4-pike (2/4)
4/5-cav kills 2/4-pike [21-4, 3ev]
4/5-cav kills 1/3-pike [22-4, 4ev], takes and razes town (7 slaves)

vet cav (3/4) kills vet knight [23-4], spots BG on mountain (8hp)

Anasazi [11]
vet cav (1/4) kills vet pike [24-4]
vet cav (4/4) kills vet pike [25-4]
vet cav loses to vet pike (1/4) [25-5]
vet cav (2/4) kills vet lb [26-5]
3/5-cav kills 1/4-pike [27-5, 5ev], takes town [10, 8 resistors].

e-cav (2/5) kills vet pike [28-5, 6ev]
vet cav (3/4) kills e warrior [29-5]

Teoihuacan [12]
vet cav loses to vet pike (2/4) [29-6]
vet cav (1/4) retreats from reg pike (2/3)
vet cav (2/4) kills reg pike [30-6]
vet cav loses to 2/3-pike (2/4) [30-7]
vet cav loses to 2/4-pike (3/5) [30-8]
vet cav (4/4) kills 3/5-pike [31-8]
vet cav (1/4) kills 2/4-pike [32-8]
vet cav (3/4) kills vet lb [33-8], takes town [11, 10 resistors], rax, market (sold)

Neu Chanca [7]
vet cav (2/4) kills vet pike [34-8]
vet cav (3/4) kills reg pike [35-8]
vet cav (2/4) kills reg pike [36-8], takes town [6, 6 resistors], rax

vet cav (3/5) kills vet pike [37-8]

right now we have 7 luxuries, but I play it save, leave lux rate at 10%.

IBT
BGs redline some cavs
3/5-MDI (1/5) kills 3/4-cav [37-9]
vet MDI loses to vet cav (5/5) [38-9]
vet knight (2/4) kills 1/4 cav [38-10]
6 cavs, 4 horses built.

3) 530 AD
Our GA ends. I love to do the MM while all those numbers are calculated wrong
I just do it for our most important towns, calculating corruption is too difficult...

3/5-cav (3/5) kills 2/4-knight [39-10, 7ev]
e-cav (2/5) kills 4/5-warrior [40-10, 8ev]
vet cav loses to e-horse (3/5) [40-11]
vet cav (2/4) kills 3/5-horse [41-11]

Cherokee 2 [1, on NE island]
vet cav (3/4) kills reg pike [42-11]
vet cav (2/4) kills reg spear [43-11], 1 reg LB left.

Apache [6, west coast]
vet cav (3/4) kills reg pike [44-11]
vet cav (1/4) retreats from reg pike (2/3)
4/5-cav (3/5) kills 2/3-pike [45-11, 9ev]
4/5-cav (3/5) kills vet LB [46-11, 10ev], takes town [6, 4 resistors]

Regroup some units.

IBT
BGs destroy improvements
vet knight (1/4) kills vet cav [46-12]
Golden Age Over message
Zapotec flips (no units lost)

4) 540 AD
3/5-cav (2/5) kills 1/4-knight [47-12, 11ev]

Olmec [11, west coast]
vet cav (4/4) kills vet pike [48-12]
vet cav (5/5) kills reg pike [49-12]
vet cav (4/5) kills reg pike [50-12], takes town [10, 9 resistors, rax, harbor]

Cherokee 2 [1, on NE island]
3/4-cav kills reg LB, autorazes town.

New Chinook [5, on NE island]
vet cav loses to vet spear (1/4) [50-13]
vet cav (3/5) kills reg spear [51-13]

Zapotec [11]
vet cav (1/4) kills reg pike [52-13], razes town.

vet cav (4/5) kills vet pike [53-13]
vet cav (3/4) kills reg pike [54-13], captures 2 settlers

Chanca [10]
vet cav (1/4) retreats from vet pike (4/4)
reg cav (4/4) kills vet pike [55-13]
vet cav (1/4) retreats from vet pike (2/4)
vet cav (4/4) kills 2/4-pike [56-13]
e-cav (3/5) kills vet LB [57-13, 12ev], razes town

IBT
BGs redline some of our cavs.
vet LB retreats cav (1/4)
vet knight kills 1/5-cav [57-14]
Apache flips (3 injured cavs lost)

5) 550 AD
Apache
vet cav kills reg spear [58-14]
3/5-cav kills reg spear [59-14, 13ev], razes town

vet MoW (3/4) kills reg galley [60-14]
reg MoW (1/3) kills reg galley [61-15]
e-cav kills 2/4-LB [62-15, 14ev]
vet cav (1/4) retreats from vet MDI (4/4)

New Chanca [11, East coast]
vet cav (3/5) kills reg pike [63-15]
vet cav loses to 3/4-pike (1/4) [63-16]
vet cav (2/4) kills 3/4-pike [64-16]
vet cav (4/4) kills 1/4-pike [65-16], razes city.

vet cav (2/4) kills vet knight [66-16]
4/5-cav (4/5) kills vet MDI [67-16, 15ev]
2/5-cav (2/5) kills vet LB [68-16, 16ev]
vet cav (1/4) retreats from vet pike (3/4)
vet cav (2/4) kills reg pike [69-16]
vet cav (1/4) kills 3/4-pike [70-16]
vet cav (3/5) kills vet pike [71-16], captures settler
vet caravel (3/4) kills galley [72-16]

New Chinook [5, on NE island]
3/5-cav (3/5) kills 3/4 spear [73-16, 17ev], razes town

vet galleon loses to vet galley (4/5) [73-17]

New Lupaca [6, NE coast]
vet cav (4/4) kills reg pike [74-17]
vet cav (1/4) kills reg pike [75-17], takes town [5, 4 resistors, rax, duct]

Chinook [10, West coast]
vet cav (1/4) retreats from pike [3/4]
cancel attack. two 3/4-cavs won't defeat 2 vet pikes and a LB

 

[Andronicus]

Nicely done Paul

A minor point which probably doesnt matter now, but core towns with market actually make more money if all 12 citizens work a tile rather than hire a taxman (eg Oxford can use a coast, Hastings a mountain etc).

Dr Evil has 6 towns, 2 we cant see - one (presumably BS) walled off by those BGs, and one further north as indicated by the cultural borders. Of those 1 is building Sistine Chapel (Cherokee).

Our finish date will be determined by logistics of getting cavs to the scene, particuarly having sufficient force to get through the BG wall.

@ Abegweit. Is it possible for you to create a similar scenario to test cavs attacking a 8hp (increasing to 10 as promotes) 8 defence unit fortified on a fort on a mountain. How many do we need for each hp? Will the BG withdraw if we damage it and it is in our cultural boundaries?
edit - looks like we are going to have to do it without army

We have had 2 flips already. I suggest abandoning all Barb towns with resistors ( we have a settler who can grab the gems). (Olmec does give advantage of a route through western side - I would rather settle our own there but likely will take too long). Barb towns without resistors can starve whilst rushing military - see below.

With probably no more than 5 turns to go we are unlikely to get value from rushing horses / upgrading from our home continent for more than 1 or 2 more turns. I suggest all rax towns on Barb continent can rush horses (using slaves if avail or first rushing worker if slave not avail) and towns without rax could rush rax, then horse. These units have greater chance of actually being useful than units produced on home continent.

I am unsure whether we should attack the BG first to get at BS or take down surrounding cities first. I lean towards the latter as we alreasdy have sig WW and losses attacking the BG and counter attack bombards will only worsen WW and the later that happens the better. Access by west appears difficult with cavs exposed to BG bombard on the narrow strip - perhaps concentrating all forces anti clockwise then attack BG is better way to go

Do we need 2 towns next to BG wall? - that gives 2 targets for BGs to bombard and more subsequent WW.

 

[Abegweit]

Good going Paul It does seem that, unless there are some big surprises at Stronghold, we are about 4-5 turns from the end.

As for the simulation. I don't know how to do that. I did try some tests with Offa's program and it doesn't seem so bad. For example, 30 cavs are a virtual lock to take down a strength 46 6 HP defender. We have around fifty in the area ready to go next turn.

I'll probably get at this tomorrow morning. RL is here - and I need to read the turn log too. Any comments before then are welcome.

 

[Paul#42]

A minor point which probably doesnt matter now, but core towns with market actually make more money if all 12 citizens work a tile rather than hire a taxman (eg Oxford can use a coast, Hastings a mountain etc).

You are right. I was getting a little tired of MM and many towns might not be in best balance after end of GA and striking ww.

We have had 2 flips already. I suggest abandoning all Barb towns with resistors ( we have a settler who can grab the gems). (Olmec does give advantage of a route through western side - I would rather settle our own there but likely will take too long). Barb towns without resistors can starve whilst rushing military - see below.

Flips have been no major problem by now, as long as we have no units in there and the town is not too far away to take it back immediately. Although the second flip town had two resistors immediately - One more chance for promotion / leader...

With probably no more than 5 turns to go we are unlikely to get value from rushing horses / upgrading from our home continent for more than 1 or 2 more turns. I suggest all rax towns on Barb continent can rush horses (using slaves if avail or first rushing worker if slave not avail) and towns without rax could rush rax, then horse. These units have greater chance of actually being useful than units produced on home continent.

Units from our core can be used the very next turn (with a properly set up ship chain ), so they are not farther away than units being built in towns on barb continent. I'd keep it going. However there are towns producing horses (and taking valuable shields form closer towns) that are too far away to get to the front in 3 turns. They should change. The closer should rush every turn.
London could build a horse every turn with a sacrificed worker.
Before upgrading horses I'd let them walk 3-5 roaded tiles to the next rax-town to get them closer to their harbors. It's worth the effort.
The MoW are so far to the N because I let them bomb the towns before attack. I should have build more of them for that purpose

Do we need 2 towns next to BG wall? - that gives 2 targets for BGs to bombard and more subsequent WW.

I thought having two would be nice and if we lost one by accident we would have wasted a lot of time... I should have brought one more to the NE wall.
However they are options, we don't have to use them, they will provide their benefit immediately.
I'd suggest founding the southern town first and let the settler for the olive hill right where he is now.

Looking at the screenie, I think there should three (injured) cavs protect the workers. They might be an appealing target for the next turn's knight...
Looking at the Strongholds cultural borders, we don't need Anasazi to push them back. It should indeed be razed immediately.

 

[Paul#42]

Good going Paul

Thanks. It was fun.

I'll probably get at this tomorrow morning. RL is here - and I need to read the turn log too. Any comments before then are welcome.

I'd love to read something from Redbad and markh, too. But worldcup takes its toll, I guess...

 

[Andronicus]

Dont really have much more to comment on.
Only would restate the obvious that what we produce on our home continent in more than 3 turns (and perhaps 3 turns) will have little influence on events in next 5 turns.
A horse produced next turn will be upgraded to cav on your turn 1, reaching the battle probably not till turn 4 even with ship chaining. Thus building horses on home continent after your turn 3 is wasted (hopefully).
OTOH a rushed horse on northern barbaria can reach the action within 2 turns, one turn being the upgrade to cav. I recommend spending our current gold on rushing horse in New Chahalis and raxes in Neu Newcastle and Neu Liverpool.
I also suggest abandoning Anasanzi and the 2 to the east - too many resistors and these towns give us little value.

If the combat calculations hold we should have no trouble taking out 1 BG and clearing a path for us. Once we do so we will have worse WW because of both cav losses attacking BG and subsequent BG bombardment

 

[Abegweit]

Agreed about keeping the towns. They also provide taxmen. Anything with resistors dies on the last turn, though. We don't need flips then.

As for comments, there's little to say beyond congradulating you for a good set of turns. I'm convinced from Offa's calc that the wall guard should be easy enough to take down. If anyone has reason to think I'm wrong, I'd like to hear about that. The rest is just about finishing the job.

Only question left is what awaits at Stronghold.

 

[Abegweit]

I couldn't wait to play

Thought I'd give you this little picture from my first turn. Eighteen brave cavalrymen gave their lives to bring it to you. There were two 10/10 BGs in that town

Rule Britannia!

 

[Andronicus]

Well done

I make it 4 northern towns (and did the one in the south flip?)
Can we get a force to each town to finish off in 2 turns?? Now there's a challenge for you. I think getting to the hidden one north of BS could be most difficult. Will BGs target a strike force cutting across from the east or are they more likely to bomb the c... out of BS? Dont forget those MoW to get rid of any Barb galleys and then can bombard coastal towns.

Looking forward to reading the story of success so can go check other threads.


PS money doesnt matter any more - I do recommend abandoning all Barb cities (BS flipping would be no fun)

 

[Andronicus]

There were two 10/10 BGs in that town

Were they 10/10 BGs to start with or did they promote from 8/8? If the former then they must have been started at that strength.

 

[Abegweit]

I took out the flip easily enough. We have two more elite victories to our credit. Still no leaders.

There are indeed four towns in the north. Two turns is impossible. We have nothing near it and anything which goes near The Wall gets redlined so we have to go around to the right. Besides, our forces have been decimated. The attack on BS took 33 cavs. The rest are all redlined. Realistically, it'll take five turns. Maybe four.

As for BS, the city's fate can be devined from the picture. Several other barb cities seem to have suffered from terrorist attacks as well. Not all. But I fear that the saboteurs are not finished with their heartless deeds.

The BGs did indeed start as elites.

Edit: there is one barb galley left. Still playing this turn.

 

[Abegweit]

Aw. What the hell. I couldn’t wait.

Pre-turn assessment.

Things look pretty good. I do make a few small changes. To start with, the settler builds are changed to horses and rushed. Cavs are all we need at this point and a regular is better than nothing.

Disband settler at Beach Head and rush horse. New Chehalis and New Warwick also rush horses. Short rush a few horses at home. Move cavalry into position for attack on Wall Guards. A lot of units are on gotos

[inter-turn]
Lose 2 redlined cavs to a knight and a longbow. New Chehalis and New Portsmouth flip, the latter to the Dutch.

560 AD

Guard Destroyer founded on the olives.
Two retreating and one dead cav later, the wall is down , revealing Stronghold and a 10/10 Guard on defence Thirty more cavs take the attack to BS and ...

Three galleys are killed at the cost of a MoW. I believe that’s it.

Varmint cleanup
4/4 cav vs 4/4 knight -> 1/4 knight
3/5 cav vs 1/4 knight -> 3/5 cav
5/5 cav vs 3/3 spear -> 3/5 cav [2-1]

War weariness is up another notch.

[inter-turn] Barbs bomb the crap out of all the forces around BS.
Several cities riot because I am too lazy to scroll ahead when the game is basically over. Nothing important though.

570 AD

Attack on New Teoihuacan.

MoW bombs vet pike and misses.
MoW bombs vet pike and takes two points.
Vet cav vs 3/3 pike -> flawless retreat
Vet cav vs 3/3 pike -> 2/4 cav
Vet cav vs 2/4 pike -> 2/4 cav and the city falls

Terrorists destroy Neu Chanca [hmm]

There are 32 wounded cavs at Hastings 2 and 3 more at New Lupaca from the attack on Stronghold. I doubt any but a few will see any action.

Abandon Neu Reading and Neu Hastings as there are barbs in the neighbourhood.
Disband a bunch of slaves, then rush a cavat Hastings 2.
Bomb Chinook. There are at least two vet pikes in the city
Move nine cavs into position to attack Cherokee and eight for the

[inter-turn]Barb movement in the south. More towns must be abandoned.

4/4 LB vs 1/4 cav -> 4/4 lb
4/4 LB vs 4/4 cav on hill -> 3/4 cav

580 AD

Bomb Chinook.

Battle of Cherokee
Bomb the city twice
4/4 cav vs 3/3 pike -> 3/4 cav
5/5 cav vs 2/3 pike -> 4/5 cav
4/5 cav vs 2/3 pike -> 3/5 cav and the city is taken

Move past Cherokee to find the mystery city – Lupaca-on-a-hill

Abandon Neu Leeds and, I am sorry to report, Beachhead. It would probably have been possible to hold the city but I’m not taking any chances at this point.

The entire population of Barbarian Stronghold suddenly gets the urge to ride the horse and joins the English cavalry.

More terrorist strikes hit at New Lupaca & New Teoihuacan.

Tax collectors show their true colours and put on clown hats. One of them decides to have a real party and raises the lux rate to 100%.

[inter-turn]
It’s official. Everyone !

Beachhead Remembered founded between Cherokee and Chinook.

Battle of Chinook
A bunch of MoWs play with Chinook, leaving a 3/4 spear as the top defender.
4/4 cav vs 3/4 spear -> 2/4 cav
4/4 cav vs 2/4 pike -> 4/4 cav
4/5 cav vs 2/4 pike -> 2/5 cav and the city is captured

Battle of Lupaca
4/4 cav vs 3/3 pike outside Lupaca -> 3/4 cav
4/4 cav vs 4/4 pike -> 2/4 pike and retreat
4/4 cav vs 4/4 pike -> 5/5 pike
4/4 cav vs 5/5 pike -> 3/5 pike and retreat
4/4 cav vs 3/3 pike -> 3/4 cav
4/4 cav vs 3/5 pike -> 2/4 cav
5/5 cav vs 2/4 pike and…

And people all over England celebrate the downfall of Dr. Evil, seeing the manifest superiority of English ways. Even subject peoples realise the truth.

Great game, guys! It was an honour to play with you. I'm off to see if anyone can catch us.

It would have been amusing to get a leader with that last attack, but our record remains perfect.

 

[juballs2001]

well done guys! sorry i could not have been more help. with all the stuff going on in my life, i just couldnt find the time to do both SGOTM.
it was an honour to once again play with you guys!
i think we got a shot at the laurels!

 

[Abegweit]

I'm pretty sure that Klarius will beat us.