Slavery

[pokiehl]

To clarify, I never said corvee, ilkum, etc. were identical to chattel slavery. That’s why I specifically listed them as “forced labor” systems.

 

[Patine]

To clarify, I never said corvee, ilkum, etc. were identical to chattel slavery. That’s why I specifically listed them as “forced labor” systems.

Slavery, without any qualifying terms, was what I was talking about in my recent diatribe, there. I don't feel quibbling benefits anyone with such a topic.

 

[Patine]

Well, if you class it as a simulation management game, then it's not really too far from Civilisation, is it?

I was thinking of a different game with a similar name. But the difference of fictionalization on a target audience is astounding, if not necessarily a good thing.

 

[GeneralZift]

I was thinking of a different game with a similar name. But the difference of fictionalization on a target audience is astounding, if not necessarily a good thing.

Sorry, can you explain what you mean? Aren't both of them fictional?

 

[Patine]

Sorry, can you explain what you mean? Aren't both of them fictional?

I meant both Rimworld and the Phantom Menace, and many other fictional examples, compared to a game loosely based on real world history and events, like the Civ series. The latter is too close to home, if you will.

 

[vorlon_mi]

Sure but over time a lot of slavery systems also had the population of slaves disappear, and since Civ takes place over the course of centuries the slaves disappearing could just be reflective of historical accuracies. Besides you make it sound like workers aren't worth building in Civ VI, but of course they are.

First, thanks to all of the people who responded to / quoted my post.

To be more clear, I do think builders (in Civ6) and workers (in Civ3-5) are worth building. I've read posts in Civ3 and other forums that propose that the worker is the most important unit in the game. In my Civ6 games, I am adding builders to my queues in every era, because the number of tiles to improve keeps increasing.

But I'm less convinced that a whole slavery mechanic -- whether capturing them as part of war, or raids, or some other mechanism -- just to generate a 3-charge builder is worth developing. I don't see its benefits to the human player; I'm not sure that an AI player would make use of it. If Civ7 went back to worker units *without charges*, that might make sense from a gameplay view. Declaring a war just to capture an unguarded worker is very common in Civ3 or Civ4; I expect that it also happened in Civ5 or an unguarded settler in Civ2.

I agree with the moral arguments from @Patine in post #35. I wouldn't consider purchasing a 4X game / historical game just because it represents slavery well. I want an empire building game, that is inspired / informed by / infused with history. The game mechanics will necessarily be abstractions and simplifications, leaving out certain aspects.

 

[Patine]

expect that it also happened in Civ5 or an unguarded settler in Civ2.

Actually, one can't capture enemy Settlers (and later Engineers) in Civ2 - one just attacks them (unless one bribes them with a Diplomat or Spy, I guess).