Sorry....but this sucks!

[Machi]

Why can't they create a game where the computer (AI) doesn't cheat but operates under the same parameters that the human player has to abide by?

For example: when you play higher difficulty levels it is better to buy tech rather than research it on your own. But why? This can only happen by the AI cheating!

I've started games on Deity (or 1/2 levels less) where I have one or two cities and then suddenly a foreign unit will appear and then I find out from it that they are waaaaay ahead in cities/units/tech/etc.

I'm just a little disappointed. I would like to just play a game the way it was meant to be rather than exploiting little nooks and cranies that the developer left open.

Sorry for the rant....I'm just a bit pissed off right now.

 

[punkbass2000]

PLay REgent. IT's an even playing field.

 

[God]

First, how else can they make diety challenging without giving the AI advantages? I didn't play Civ 2 on the higher difficulties so I don't know how they handled it.

If its unfair play regent or monarch. Regent is an even playing field with the AI getting no advantage or disadvantages. IMO Monarch is more even because I think that the superior thinking and strategizing (is it a real word? ) of the human player evens out with the little AI production advantage.

 

[IDSmoker]

At least in Civ3, some (or nearly all if you look through the editor) of the AI cheating is exposed to the player.

I have played way too many games where the AI cheats are never revealed.... (of course, the first computer game I ever played came on a cassette tape, so I've been at this awhile! <grin>)

 

[Zouave]

There are various aspects of Regent I believe constitute AI cheating, though not nearly as bad as the higher levels.

Check to see if AI cities other than the capital get factory-level production without factories. There is stuff with omnisicent knowledge of the map, and with galleys and settlers.

Yes, it is a pain.

 

[Jaybe]

Levels higher than Regent not only give AI civs cheaper improvements and advances, but also multiple Settlers and units (This ain't Civ2). AI advantages increase with the level of play. For the Player to have cheaper improvements and advances (but not multiple Settlers and units), play below Regent.

In some other ways, the AI has advantages to make up for the HUGE advantage the Player has -- the ability to THINK. The AI knows what units you have in each of your cities, and perhaps where ALL your units are.

It sort of comes out in the wash. You may be surprised or shocked to see what the AI does. It may be a challenge to overcome it, and perhaps you will lose the game from it. But next turn (and game) you will know better, but the AI will not learn from what YOU do.

 

[Trabpukcip]

Yet it's frustrating that they didn't create a level at which the computer is equal to the human... I most of the time play regent becose it's the closest to human the AI is... but Deity is just exagerated... there's no way you can beat it without cheating yourself ;(

 

[Jaybe]

I always play at Regent. Play the higher levels if Regent gets too easy for you. Or if you want to get a higher score. Higher levels score higher, but it may not be nearly as satisfying if you lose!

With version 1.21, I have read that Diety is REALLY challenging. Remember, initially Diety was supposed to be UNBEATABLE, so if you are going to play it understand that you will be losing (or quitting) most of your games.

 

[sabo]

At least the tougher levels are really tough, I think it's the only computer game I"ve played where it isn't a cake walk at higher difficulty levels. Unfortunatly the AI can't think like a human, it has no reasoning power. For instance Persia started a war with me cuz I didn't give him my territory map BOO HOO. I just bought the game and I'm just now figuring out how to play it even though I played civ II, my first game I got beat on chieftan, I can see I'll be ready for diety in about a month or so.

 

[alver]

Hi,

I've seen some people complaining that they should make the AI better on the higher levels, not changing the rules. IMO that would be a waste of resources, because they'd have to put extra work into improving the AI for these levels, work that I (and other not-extremely-good players) might never enjoy the effects of.

And of course the AI would be easily beatable anyway once you discovered its weak points.... so keep the difficulty levels as they are!

 

['Copter Pilot]

alver, I agree with you, but I also don't think they could easily improve the AI just by throwing some more ressources at it (that is programmer time). AI is still cutting-edge research, and I think the AI in Civ III is pretty good -- it makes a worthy (and for me still difficult to beat) opponent on the 'level' level (Regent), a great improvement on Civ 2 and SMAC.

To those who complain that the AI gets extra goodies: The real world isn't a level playing field. It's not as if France, Germany and England started with one town each in 2000BC. Poland was quite unlucky being stuck between two bullies like Russia and Germany, for example (this of course is an extreme simplification of matters). But if you're a good leader, you can overcome these disadvantages. This is pure realism.

 

[louiethelesbo]

The game is excellent it does not suck....if you want to see sucks..I would refer you to Pamela Lee Anderson and Tommy Lee.

 

[punkbass2000]

Originally posted by Trabpukcip
there's no way you can beat [Deity] without cheating yourself ;(

That's not true.

 

[Mad Hab]

Pesonally, I think the best job was made on Heroes of Might and Magic III. On the setup screen you can learn EXACTLY what each difficulty level does. Two exemples:

Easy: The AI plays poorly and the player starts with a large advantage in resources.

Expert: The AI plays at its best and has some advantage in resources.

I would really like to see that crystal clear in Civ 3 - I don't know why Firaxis tried so hard to conceal this information from us. It's a game, and I think the player should be aware of ALL the rules - the ones that he will follow and the ones that the AI will follow...

Mad Hab

 

[rangers85]

Originally posted by Mad Hab
Pesonally, I think the best job was made on Heroes of Might and Magic III. On the setup screen you can learn EXACTLY what each difficulty level does. Two exemples:

Easy: The AI plays poorly and the player starts with a large advantage in resources.

Expert: The AI plays at its best and has some advantage in resources.

I would really like to see that crystal clear in Civ 3 - I don't know why Firaxis tried so hard to conceal this information from us. It's a game, and I think the player should be aware of ALL the rules - the ones that he will follow and the ones that the AI will follow...

Mad Hab

Mad Hab, look in the editor and you'll see exactly what the AI starts with at each level. I'm not sure what's in the instruction manual since it's at home, but I know the editor states exactly what units and the amount they start with. If they were trying to hide it, you definately wouldn't be able to find it there.

 

[jpowers]

Maybe I'm just an awful player, but I find that in Regent mode, supposedly 'even,' the AI gets 2 techs for every one I get. I usually play scientific civs and build a fair number of libraries, etc. My science funding is as high as I can make it, but the AI always has a huge list of techs that I don't.

 

[alexander dumas]

In Regent, I find that early on the AIs get a lead in Techs and its hard to get wonders, but by the modern age, I can out research them even when I sell them everything I discover. I like to think that I'll win on that level over time because I'm not wasting energy making improvements to useless squares and not building anything that won't give a good return (a coal plant when I have a hydro plant, boats on inland seas). The histographs usually have me even until I get a pivotal advance or resource and then I start making little leaps up.
Another reason why you probably see the AI with lots of techs you don't have is that they sell them to eachother all the time. I love trading techs because I can get tanks and railroads at ridiculously early dates.

 

[Trinity]

If you want to level it a bit more, just mod it. Give yourself a couple 2 settlers, 2 warriors, and 2 workers at the start, or give yourself bronze working. Cheating? Perhaps. But at Monarch and Deity, the opposing civs will soon pass you.

I prefer a commercial/industrious civilization. They produce faster and you get commerce bonuses. You can always play them militaristically. I go for a golden age around 500 AD when my empire is fairly large, then rake in the cash.

Regarding research. Just push the tech advances and buy the political advances. They usually are cheap and they take a lot of time to research the trees.

I'm playing Regent level now, and it's tough even keeping up. You're not going to get those cultural wonders you got in Chieftan and Warlord so focus on getting the following:

1. The Pyramids (granaries)
2. Sun Tzu's Art of War (barracks)
3. Sistine Chapel (I'd even write this one off for Smiths) ( , & cultural bonuses for temples and cathedrals)
4. Smith's Trading Company
5. Wall Street & Newton's University
6. Iron Works (if you're lucky enough to have iron/coal within one city limit
7. Battlefield Medicine
8. Theory of Evolution (2 free techs) & Universal Sufferage (if only to deny your enemies)
9. Seti
10. Apollo

You'll have the money to really crank out units and pay for upgrades. When a civilization gets too culturally strong, make an MPP/RoP with another civ, provoke a war with the strong one and kill it. Never settle with the civ until you've destroyed their city of wonders.

This regent level game ain't over yet. I just took a 1 point lead after beating Greece into oblivion. And to help you, do an internet search on the Ferengi Rules of Acquisition (Star Trek DS9) -- they will help. Screw the AI on deals as much as possible. Remember YOU pay lump sum, THEY pay per turn. Spend the 10 minutes finding the max that they would "probably accept". Take a loan from a rich civ then provoke them into a war and go cry innocent victim to the rest of the world. They will help you crush the aggressor.

 

[God]

On my first complete large map regent game, I managed to get all the wonders except, Pyramids (didn't need them so didn't build it), Oracle, Sistine (Didn't realize how great it is), Smiths, Great Wall and Magellans.

And I only rushed a few with leaders.

Its not too hard. Use palace prebuild for the essential wonders, for me then it was Great Libary, Leonardos, Bachs, UN (rushed it w/GL), and Theory of Evolution.

 

[Amask]

I find AI cheating OK, because how else should it have any chance of beating humans. I mean it is very hard to program the AI in a way where it will be as smart as humans and will be able to find all the sneaky things. Just play, and eventually you will find a way to beat it. Have you seen the High Scores? - 64000 on deity is something you can aim for, but even 5000 is not bad.