Tactical Fun #190

[Victoria]

You have a small but highly experienced force a long way from home with no additional support wishing to take an egyption outpost. When maneuvering to attack your scout spots a relief column of noob tanks coming to the cities defense. What would you choose as your best next move if you expect no more Egyptian reinforcements?
Do you think you can win this battle against the AI player?

So only land tiles are numbered so your Ranger R1 is at tile D6 While your Tank T1 is at tile I2
There is no right and wrong, just your choice

Tanks 80 move 4
Infrantry 70 move 2
Rangers 45 Move 3
Artillery 60/80 move 2
AT 70 move 2

A follow on from Tactical Fun #297

 

[Victoria]

OK, no-one wants to play. Maybe it was too hard?
Anyway my choice here
I'll try another simpler one and if it gets no replies then I'll stop. I do not think many people look at tips&tricks often

Spoiler :

Thanks to the AT promotion "hold the line"
My artillery fires at strength 90 (did half damage to a tank)
My infantry defends at 88 or 90
My tank defends at 98 due to its promotions and support

Their tanks attack at 80 + up to +4 flankning. Next turn my troops get double attacks as better odds against a more damaged set of tanks
The ranger at the bottom fortified and on average it will take 2 tanks to kill in one turn... which is what the AI will do, always target a scout. It splits their force making them yet easier to kill.
They will be dead meat fast mainly due to an upgraded spearman and being able to double attack.

 

[liv]

I tried to think about it and my instinct was to go to take the city first. I would definitely have lost those beautiful rangers if I did that. Your approach was helpful

 

[Victoria]

You would have lost that artillery too.

 

[liv]

I would? Huh. I am not doubting you. I just did not see that
I would have moved I1 to attacking position beside city.
So I would have moved the artillery into shooting position beside the whale. The AT behind the artillery on the desert.
Moved I3 on to the hill and I2 beside the artillery. My theory is that I would take the city on the next turn and then fight off tanks. Depending on what the tanks did I may have had to jump the artillery in the sea to save it.
I only play single play so I have not really faced this situation. It is interesting.

 

[Victoria]

I conceed its better than I thought. You will probably still loose the AT crew but likely gain that city and yeah artillery out to sea.
Its a nice option

This is probably better than yours or mine... a combination, it appears the square promotion is not working currently

Spoiler :

The Rangers defence is 81

 

[It'sPat]

I would have moved I1 to D3 and AT1 to D4 then A1 to F1 and fire at the leftmost tank. R1 attacks the 2nd to leftmost tank and then pulls back to E3. I2 moves down and takes R1's place and I3 moves to E4. T1 goes to E5. If there is nowhere for R2 to go South, then I would retreat it West to the desert in between the sheep hills.

My instinct says the AI attempts to outflank a line whenever possible, although it does not generally postpone an attack one turn to get better potential odds on a following turn. Three of the tanks would start to go around the Dead Sea and the rest would assault the Eastern most section of my line. The forest on E6 would stop one tank from attacking, and two would attack my tank without much effect (96 vs 84?). But maybe they would attack I3 (76 to 80?) if they are really calculating the odds.

Next turn, I think A1 would attack the city as I doubt there would be a tank in range. T1 heads for the forest at G5, pillaging the road in the marsh. R1 goes to G4. The infantry and anti-tank fall back one space to the NW.

Turn after that everybody falls back one more space, the artillery finishing leveling the city and the tank takes it.

Honestly, I probably wouldn't put that much thought into it. I probably would not have had the tank take a place on the line and I3 would have been badly battered.

 

[civtrader6]

This one's too tough, and there's so much unknowns for me.
It also highlights how much of the game's complexity seems to be lost and never used.
Like promotions - not sure what it even means to have an army that is this promoted... nor what are the promotions means after L2. Maybe once I managed to get an L3 scout; best ever was L6 field cannons - but that was a long time ago, before I learned proper warmongering. Nowadays, I can't remember when was the last time I even had field cannons (or used crossbows), even on deity. Ah balance.

 

[Victoria]

The L7 was just a way to say... I have all promotions. It was really aimed at

Understanding the level 4 Anti cav promotion hold the line is really powerful against cavalry including +10 to artillery
That 7 levels of promotion do not help your melee troops against cav at all.

But yes too complex.

 

[Mr. Shadows]

I've been thinking about this, and my initial ideas were off because I didn't understand hold the line. I almost never build anti-cav units so I haven't taken a close look. However, I just finished taking on Jadwiga's Legacy at Deity and hold the line made fighting off knights a breeze. I have a new appreciation for the class. Taking that into account Victoria has is right in the second post. The tanks don't have much ability to hurt those infantry, not in that formation.

 

[civtrader6]

The L7 was just a way to say... I have all promotions. It was really aimed at

Understanding the level 4 Anti cav promotion hold the line is really powerful against cavalry including +10 to artillery
That 7 levels of promotion do not help your melee troops against cav at all.

But yes too complex.

yes yes i get this part. I meant to say, I've got no idea what the effect is - or in other words - i cant appreciate what the promotions bring - as they are incredibly hard to get. And in the best case scenario in my games, even the charriot that rampage around, become knights and take cities all over the place, rarely make it to level 4. Sadly, even if they do - its at a stage in the game where its irrelevant. So much game complexity available - but not used.
Now anti-cav is even worse - early game seems too expensive - AI (Scythia excluded) rarely has enough horses to justify it for me. Mid game - too squishy.

 

[Victoria]

a stage in the game where its irrelevant. So much game complexity available - but not used.

Not by the optimal crowd, no. I quite like a long game every now and then.
I just like exploring features, but yes more relevance to everyone is better.

 

[Bee7]

The L7 was just a way to say... I have all promotions. It was really aimed at

Understanding the level 4 Anti cav promotion hold the line is really powerful against cavalry including +10 to artillery
That 7 levels of promotion do not help your melee troops against cav at all.

Very useful—I rarely get units to level 4, must be something to do with my style of play, or with having to find stuff for the kids all the time! Neat trick with the scout, will remember that. I have used settlers as bait, but never thought of scouts. Are there any tricks to getting higher level promotions, apart from the obvious shoot to kill strategy?

 

[Victoria]

I have used settlers as bait, but never thought of scouts

My scout are a military unit so often hang out with the army, their speed, bait and ZOC qualities make them very useful.

Getting spears shot at for promotions is not a good idea, the die that way. You can normally get one up quite fast if you use it to take each city as that give 10 Xp which is the only exception to the 8 xp rule. Naturally the stab cavalry quite well before that and building them with a barracks helps.

 

[Domain]

Pretty much I would just swap l1 and A1, the other units would be used to cover the other flank. With L1 swapped it will still be out of range of the city while it bombarded. The units being higher experience will be able to hold off the tanks while the artillery beats down that low level city. And knowing the AI half the tanks wills spend more time trying to flank you then focusing a target which will allow you to use your strong units and anti tank to focus down the flank closes to artillery....this city with those units wouldn't be hard to win again...you would maybe lose one or tw9 units but with that anti tank you should be able to distract those tanks long enough.

 

[Victoria]

The joke is the AI sends two tanks back to take out the scout, so going toward the city means you are only against 4 tanks for a couple of turns and your infantry and tank get 2 attacks. The realist is mincemeat but we do have to imagine the AI was half human or the scenario gets some weird valid answers.

 

[Domain]

I mean even without the scout you are fine, if those were army tanks or even 2 star tank then I would question this but with them being basic first gen take I don't see them even without the scout distracting being able to break a line created by those units. The artillery can just horsehocky behind them able to break the walls in like 3 turns?

 

[Victoria]

Yes, as long as your infantry make use of the AT promotion, without it they are -10