Well, i tried that. Followed Acken's liberty guide (as best as i could) to the point where i had 8 cities. Unfortunately while i was able to combat the pressure of my direct neighbors
Spoiler:
Rome
spread to the western part of the map with more than 20 cities when i had 11 and was starting to passively pressure my cities. And then we hit renaissance (so missionaries were more expansive) and WC was founded while i was last in production (good bye WF) and my culture wasn't great either (for a culture game).
I should be having an easier time of this than I am, not the least because I am the only civ that opened piety! I got out three 5x GPr before Industrial, and hit just the civs w/o religion. I am hoping that plus RT will get me the plurality achievement. (EDIT: No, 2nd by a wide margin.)
Even if I conqueror a rival Holy City or two, saving faith up for 3x GMu means not much more conversion opportunities. Maybe this time I should fill out Piety rather than getting more Freedom tenets? I am not sure a late Reformation believe will at all useful.
I am have more success with peaceful CV than ever, but southern neighbor launched on T309 and I was still 30+ turns to getting influence everywhere. I am going to reload, hold of building the Musicians Guild until I close out Aesthetics, see if that makes the difference. Map does not have enough late era strategics for me to get my war on when I would like to…
Late war with the far SW civ got me to T339 and about ~5 turns to influence everywhere before the S neighbor launched. I am hitting Internet (w/ Ratty fisher) at about T250 which is about the fastest I have ever gotten there. NVC just a hand full of turns later, and then close out Aesthetics not long after that. Oxford, Hermitage, and two museums themed. By ~T270 my Tourism is at ~450 -- but that is just not enough. For wonders, I have: SoL, Disney, SOH, CNN, Pentagon, GFW, Hubble -- nothing early.
But the N neighbor asked me to dow the civ in the middle with her, and the far SW civ dow’d me not long after. XCOM are a ways off, but I have Radar and A-Bombs, so the wars should be some good opportunities. S neighbor has Nuke missiles, so I am not ready to deal w/ her now yet, but she is also at war with far SW civ. So this third run has some good potential! (EDIT: Not enough, SV loss T313. I do not know if I can win this by CV. I will roll back even further, maybe I can busy the furthest away civ with wars, since I cannot get to him in time.)
Lawl wuut a game. Had I known the details of the map/tweaks in advance I'd have played this quite differently but I become to appreciate the uncertainty and was even in real danger of losing for quite a while. Getting back in to my comfort zone of domination driven game was enough to turn the tide, though and based on my own experiences I expect longer than average games from those going achievement hunting.
T339 Cult ABCDe. Yup, even longer than my TD games and as long as the Poly DCL which I started as a RP adventure, not as a DCL. And there really wasn't a split achi for the WF/IG but now the letter combo looks much like an impressive local driver's license.
The part I missed on achi department was IG which was build in 3 turns - I went all out & put ~1200 hammers on it;
Spoiler:
Wu
won by 2200+.
For a proper recap I need some recovery time so it won't happen today.
For me, the hardest achievement is completing 4 SP trees before I have enough tourism to win the game. Having conquered many cities made religion trivial for me when I also have nearly 500 fpt. One of the disadvantage of extremely wide play is the very expansive SP cost when you annex. But the only way to generate high fpt/cpt would be to annex due to puppet cities not prioritizing faith/culture buildings. It would've been a ton easier if I chose To the Glory of God for reformation instead of Sacred Sites.
Replaying the 50+ turns in Freedom is not getting me anywhere. More wars, but not enough difference. Third time, SV loss T317. I rolled back to Ideology (I get there 4th) and will try autocracy and more war.
SP are coming in pretty steady, but I have to wonder if I am doing them in a sensible order? Full Tradition, then I open piety, open +1 in Aesthetics, Rationalism until Ideology. I pick one or two tenets but mostly stay in Rationalism, timing finisher to pick up Internet. Then I close out Aesthetics, and the rest of game is ideology Tenets. Big Ben is available, so open Commerce at some point.
Would I be better off skipping Rationalism to get a Reformation belief? I am pretty sure I can get Sacred Site, but it is after closing out Tradition, so does not seem like it would much matter? Or should I worry less about Aesthetics and use TtGoG to unlock GMu purchases?
Those details might not matter at all if I war heavily on the northern neighbor. She has a bunch of Wonders, but has not been a threat to winning, so I have been playing nice with her while I try and fight with the southern neighbor (who wins by SV).
I had several timing issues in my game partly because I was so far off what I usually do but lack of policies wasn't ultimately a problem at all - converting the holy cities was by far the greatest obstacle hence I delayed the VC for quite a bit and then had leftover GMs and faith to buy even more.
On top of filling 4 trees I put 6 (I think) on Freedom, 3 Ratio & opened Exploration in far from optimal order but that was mostly due to getting a map I wasn't expecting or even anticipating but then again my game was extremely long.
For me, the hardest achievement is completing 4 SP trees before I have enough tourism to win the game. Having conquered many cities made religion trivial for me when I also have nearly 500 fpt. One of the disadvantage of extremely wide play is the very expansive SP cost when you annex. But the only way to generate high fpt/cpt would be to annex due to puppet cities not prioritizing faith/culture buildings. It would've been a ton easier if I chose To the Glory of God for reformation instead of Sacred Sites.
1. It must be the religion you founded
2. The second part explains it, you can buy any 3 great people of the same type with 5000 faith other than prophets, they are excluded since their value is different
3. I'm going to allow that, so a full ideology counts as 2 full SPs (dunno why would anyone do that tbqh)
4. A simple majority is enough for this, doesn't need to be 50% of total number of cities on the map, if your religion was in 7 cities and the next one in 6, it scores, ties are not allowed though
Will 6 policies in an ideology count as filling a single tree? Ex. Full Tradition, full Piety, full Exploration, 6 in Autocracy - good for achievement?
Not that I much care either way but I assumed the idea behind the 'fill 4 policy trees' was to avoid (ab)using Ideologies excessively hence I don't see the point of the said achi if Ideology counts towards it in any way - in that case it's just a matter of cumulative culture throughout the game.
Will 6 policies in an ideology count as filling a single tree? Ex. Full Tradition, full Piety, full Exploration, 6 in Autocracy - good for achievement?
Pretty sure it doesn't count, otherwise I could've won a good 30-40 turns earlier. I was simply waiting for filling 4 SP tree in addition to the 6 in ideology, while delaying IG and Internet as much as possible since I don't want a premature victory.
Achievement favored a wide ICS piety conquest style approach, with the UB of Ethiopia, with the obvious exception of C, which I'll explain.
End game statistics:
60 cities, 1067 pop, 9289 bpt, 2605 cpt, 632 fpt, 80 happiness, 2710 gpt, 2774 tpt during IG.
My IG was delayed as much as possible, and only completed on the exact same turn as the win, on turn 329. Interesting fact was putting in 7670 hammers while only needing 6480. I'm not sure why it still took 3 turns to complete IG. With my hammers, it should've been completed in 1 turn if it counted.
Achievement C requires 24 SP, plus the 6 for ideology for reaching tier 3. For my game, I chose Order for the synergy to the UB. I needed at least 2 tier 2 for happiness/science boost from Order. With all buildings with free SP except for ideology building unavailable, it was difficult to get enough culture for a very wide game. Especially since puppet city rarely build culture/faith buildings, so annexing is pretty much a must. Eventually I figured that in order to get C, I had to delay winning as much as possible, that meant to never conquer the final culture leader, delay Internet as much as possible, and delay/sell airports (hotels can't be sold). Obviously not working landmarks also work, but that decreases culture. Obviously delaying IG is also a must. The free SP from winning IG gave me the final SP which was the tier 3 order for increasing tourism, which was obviously superfluous, as game was won as soon as IG finishes. So I had exactly 30 SP.
Obviously piety was required for huge religion game, and liberty for wide play. The other 2 was rationalism and commerce for the happiness/gold. I never opened aesthetics or any other trees. Piety reformation was Sacred Sites which was a mistake since the tourism is very low compared to AI culture on deity, a much better choice would be To the Glory of God, allowing purchase of GW/GA which would've been a huge help.
Religion status at the end:
Judaism 79, Eastern Orthodox 10, Catholic 9, Taoism 2, Buddhism 0
Obviously my religion Judaism dominated with just under 80% coverage.
Tithe gave me 299gpt which wasn't that much compared to my total gpt. Most of the non Judaism cities are located in isolated islands or CS where it was problematic to get my GPr in to convert. My capital which was my holy city has a pressure of +232, due to my religion being world religion, and enhancer Itin. Preachers with tightly spaced cities. All other religion's capitals were conquered, and combination of GPr and inquisitors converted them and removed the holy city status. I've bought so many GPr that the next one would cost 8k faith.
Details:
Spoiler:
Stole workers off Wu, Dido, William. William tried to settle cities so far away from his land for some odd reason, so it was easy to DoW him and steal his settlers. Religious CS with stone circle pantheon got me 2nd religion with Pagodas. Easy DoF with Dido, Wu never liked me after the worker steal and tries to citadel bomb me, but I resisted the urge to DoW, instead worked with diplo to turn the entire world against her so she wouldn't try to invade me until I have artillery to take her cities. Eventually having common enemy was able to get me DoF with most of the rest of the world. Augustus had taking rationalism early, got most of the wonders and was running away, so he's definitely the 2nd target after Wu. Otherwise there is a risk of losing to his SV or CV. Wide liberty play guarantees some AI will hate me, so it's easy to direct all hate towards Wu. Meanwhile, religion spread to most of Washington, Gustavus, was battling with Theo's in William's land and having almost no presence in Pacha's land.
WF was 1st proposal, won pretty easily with 1k hammers with wide empire. Invaded China as soon as I have enough Artillery. Surprising was able to build Brandenburg gate in capital for extra promotion. Took Beijing around turn 243 after Rome also declared on Wu. Immediately declared on Rome so that his army would be caught between 2 wars, and for the easy capture of cities he took from Wu. Rome falls 8 turns later. By now, rocket artillery/bombers made conquest easy. Next target would be Pacha, as Monty was already eliminated and Pacha controlled his capital. My GPr would need to do some real work after conquering Incan land to convert all his cities.
The only other holy city that remains would be Theo's so she was the next target. War was extremely short due to her horrible tech, and I would use her Great Mosque of Djenne to spam 5 charges GPr. Next I wanted Sistine Chapel from William, but Amsterdam was about to fall to Sweden, so I paid him to sign peace with Gustavus and immediately declared war to capture his cities. That action made Sweden denounce me and he would surprising DoW me following my peace with William. Of course, the war with Sweden was suicide for him and I took all of his cities. Washington despite hostile towards me never bothered to declare war on me, so there wasn't any reason to invade him. I needed him as the culture leader to stay alive so that I wouldn't win culture victory too early as I described above.
WC: everything that increases culture was passed, except natural wonders. Arts funding. World religion for mine. World ideology was passed way too early, so every AI civs except 2 went Order and made it impossible to get SoL or Prora since both of them only had 1 city. ISS was also done for some extra culture/prod from scientists.
Achievements:
A: all AI holy cities were conquered, and converted with GPr + inquisitors so they lose holy city pressure.
B: trivial achievement with me with 632 fpt, 3 great merchant bought.
C: difficult achievement as described above. Finished liberty, piety, commerce, ratio, with 6 in Order
D: main reason for playing wide piety, and falls into place once AI cities became mine and was converted with GPr. Religion has almost 80% coverage.
E: winning WF/IG is also trivial, main caveat is wanting to delay IG as much as possible. 1 turn later and I would've missed this achievement with IG.
^^ Six in an Ideology is pretty much standard. So for the achievement to allow Ideology to count for one of the four full trees, the ideology tree really should be need to be pretty complete. Maybe two tier 3 tenets? It would be simpler if Ideology picks do not count toward the achievement, no matter how many one gets.
Nice run Sclb! Looks like the only challenge was hitting the achievements!
Loss my Autocracy run to T297 launch. I was less than five turns from dropping nukes. I have to figure out how to war sooner than later.
Pretty sure it doesn't count, otherwise I could've won a good 30-40 turns earlier. I was simply waiting for filling 4 SP tree in addition to the 6 in ideology, while delaying IG and Internet as much as possible since I don't want a premature victory.
But it only says:
3. Finish at least 4 social policy trees - 3 points
You didn't need 6 in ideology.
@stormtrooper412, why not just say the first 2 don't count in ideology so you need 8 for 1 Full Tree. If the goal for some reason is to devalue ideology policies, that's fine and means 4 non-ideology trees.
I understand some people don't enjoy discussing the 'semantics', but given there are people from different countries and language backgrounds on here, it's beneficial if we all have the same understanding of the achievements.
Who cares, that win by SCLB looks like me on Immortal. That is an impressive domination of the game. The only thing I don't envy is the amount of time it must have taken to manage all those cities and units. What is also impressive is staying happy without grabbing Prora.
I appreciate a good AI drubbing like this a lot more than a T200 SV. Nice work!
You know you guys are right. I suppose it's too late to retroactively change stuff now but let's meet halfway, how about, full ideology counts as 2 trees, and a pair of tier 3 tenets counts as one tree. Alright? I honestly imagined this to be Tradition/Piety into Commerce/Aesthetics into Rationalism kind of game where the culture just churns on
IMHO, keeping with the spirit of the OP, if tenets count at all, a full Ideology tree should only count as one of the the four. But what counts as a “full” Ideology? Six is less than half full!
Agreed, amazing play by SCLB. I will be lucky to win at all, let alone with a CV.
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