the road to Diplomatic Victory

[Yndy]

@TheNiceOne

You are probably right. I was wondering about that but I never actually tested it so I assumed you shouldn't make any deal. It is quite likely that you should only refrain from giving anything for 20 turns but what about if they give you 1gpt for your obsolete science? Moreover I was very frustrated to see that I lost my rep by making peace with a civ before their defeat and their defeat was actually a rep hit for me.

 

[Iver-P]

Question: What triggers a UN vote. Obviously building the UN is the first trigger, but what about after that if the first vote is inconclusive?

 

[satchel]

Originally posted by Iver-P
Question: What triggers a UN vote. Obviously building the UN is the first trigger, but what about after that if the first vote is inconclusive?

Iver, it's just a fixed number of turns - either 10 or 20, I can't recall at the moment. If you wait long enough there will be another vote.

 

[Monophonic]

Originally posted by Aggie
Difficulty is to avoid the situations you can't control. Like a culture flip in which you lose the coal source you were trading with another civ...

I lost a resource in a similar fashion in a game a long time ago. Can't remember which resource, but it dried up. Of course I had another source, otherwise I wouldn't have traded it in the first place. The interesting part was that the trade continued as if nothing had happened, but I was without that resource until the trade expired (or I cancelled it, can't remember which).

Of course that won't help if you really are crazy enough to sell your only source of coal...

 

[DoTheMath]

Originally posted by Yndy
1. Never engage in .per turn trade or ROPs with dying civs. If you see that a civ is going to be destroyed you should stop trading because you will get the rep hit when they die.

Yes, also,if the diplomatic rules of CivII apply, the civs that hate your friend are going to dislike you, and quite often a weak civ gets ganged up on.

 

[Zachriel]

One other tactic that bears mentioning is eliminating any Civilizations that will not vote for you in the United Nations. In I, Hammurabi, Hammurabi had a very poor relationship with Xerxes. The solution? Total annihiliation of the Persian Civilization -- whatever the cost.


http://www.zachriel.com/gotm14/

 

[satchel]

Late reponse; I haven't had time to play civ in ages, so I haven't been reading the game forums lately.

Thanks for the contribution, Zachriel - you are my civ hero, so it's an honor to have you in my strategy article thread! Your strategy is a good one. As long as you keep in mind the general principles behind waging war while aiming for diplomatic victory, it should be very effective. Thus: wage war honorably, without breaking treaties or trades, and do not raze any cities you take while eliminating your enemy. If you generously distribute the spoils of your war (for example, when you have annexed your enemy's territory you might find yourself with some extra resources on hand), Zachriel's strategy may actually help your diplomatic position.

 

[wisewood]

A tip:
In the game, about 5 civs (out of 16) usually build UN. However, not everyone get to be elected in the UN. Two civs with the biggest population get elected.

 

[Paul#42]

Thanks for this great essay. Helps me a lot to understand, why nobody likes me after invading the zulu empire

* never, ever engaging in RoP-rape, or the other actions that the AI treats as RoP-rape. That means making sure you have no units in their territory when you declare war - not even a lone ship a few squares away from one of their cities. I declare war on the diplomacy screen either by choosing "prepare for war" or by calling up the peace treaty from "active" agreements and canceling it.

Did I get this right: This only applies to RoP-Agreements, if there's nothing like that (and no "fresh" peace treaty nor any other 20-turn-deal) I can also stay on enemy's territory next to his capital and reply with a war declare to his proposal to pull back my units? Or should I also remove my units to declare a war like "it should be"?

Although I rather like to declare war in MY turn...

 

[satchel]

I have been away from the forums for quite a while and I am astonished and pleased to see that people are still reading my Diplomatic Victory article.

Paul, as I understand the AI will regard a declaration of war occurring when your units are already in their territory as RoP-rape regardless of whether you have a RoP agreement. Any sneak attack or declaration occurring while your units are in enemy territory will harm your reputation. To declare war honorably - that is, without suffering a reputation hit - you must make sure you have no units in enemy borders (watch out for your sea units!), declare war on the diplomacy screen, and then wait for the next turn before entering their territory.

 

[v0iDDr0iD]

"and then wait for the next turn before entering their territory"

What? I thought I had a pretty good understanding of how to attack without getting a rep hit, but it never occured to me that you should actually wait another turn..

I usually
1 declare war through the diplo screen while
2 making sure no units are (or have been) in my enemies territory this turn.
(3 and of course no active deals)

Then I might use fast units to capture some crucial cities the very same turn.
Are you saying that this approach will have the same effect as if I hadn't done 1 & 2??

On another note; will you get a rep hit when declaring war against someone giving YOU gpt? Say you traded a tech for gpt, and after 5 turns want to go to war with the same civ (having no other active deals)

Will the AI actually regard you as breaking a deal when all you do is stop taking their money?

 

[satchel]

Thanks for the post, v0iDDr0iD.

I believe that you are right - I was mistaken when I advised waiting until the next turn after declaring war before entering enemy territory. I recently had this discussion with someone else on a different thread (I wish I could remember where), and realized my error. I am sorry for the confusion.

 

[Esox]

I realize this (very informative) thread has been dormant for a while, but maybe somebody can answer me this - to win a UN vote, do you need a majority of all civs in the GAME, or all civs that VOTED?

For example, there are 6 civs. One abstains and I get three votes including my own. Is that a 3-out-of-5 majority, or a 3-out-of-6 better luck next time?

I don't use the editor to test these things...

 

[TimBentley]

All civs in the game.

 

[Holy Despot]

Honest to be I never won a diplomatic victory only CONQUEST.But I have always been interested to keep my reputation clean.It helps you negociate all profitable trades(luxuries for techs,gold for techs and the crucial MA and ROP which are esencial in military conquest). One question:
By what rules is the second candidate of the UN vote determined-the one that doesn't build the UN. Is it population,score, power or is it always the human player?

 

[EMan]

Priorities:

1. Civ with 25%+ of World's Population

2. Civ with 25%+ of World's Territory

3. If neither 1 or 2 applies, Civ with highest % of World's Population.

P.s. I played a PTW game to a Diplomatic Victory and condition 3 applied! (viz. No Civ, apart from me, had 25% of Population OR Territory!.........Needless to say, I "Manually" determined who my Rival would be in the UN Election, declared war on them AND formed a Military Alliance with ALL the other civs against them to ensure their vote! )

 

[Holy Despot]

declared war on them AND formed a Military Alliance with ALL the other civs against them to ensure their vote! )

Yes this is a commonly used tactic and is flawless.You practicly snatch the Victory from the AI's noses.Very clever.