They won't stop attacking!!!

[ronnybiggs]

In all my monarch games lately, there's nothing I can do to have friendly relations with my neighbors. One just keeps attacking me, and even when I manage to overpower him, the next neighbor comes in. Is it the fact that I'm ahead in score? That doesn't make sense because they do it when I'm behind. Is it that I have my own religion? Or the fact that I jump to Universal Suffrage with Pyramids? Or am I just a horrible diplomat?

The last also seems unlikely, since I'm constantly checking up on them and I'm offering whatever I can to earn their friendship.

The constant warfare just drags my kingdom down in the long run with war weariness and lack of infrastructure building. It's becoming a drag on my enjoyment of this game as well. Please tell me I'm just doing something wrong.

 

[JoeM]

1) Ensure you have a large distributed army.
2) Check your relationship modifiers with your neighbours.
3) Ensure you have a large distributed army.

 

[JoeM]

Oh and invade them alternately.

 

[timerover51]

You might want to check your game preference settings and see if by chance you have them set to constant war. I have played Civ4 a little on my son's laptop, and noticed that there are several setting controling AI agressiveness. I know in Civ3, I have the same problem, which is why I have been busy doing modding to buy myself some edges. I will look some more later today, and try to get back to you.

Otherwise, if you want a more peaceful game, and go for a cultural or space race victory, change the setting to always peace, and go from there. Best to pick your starting civilization carefully. Also, you can always go with a hot seat game and play more than one civilization, which really helps is getting tech advances and trading. This also will split the attention of the AI.

 

[Mad Professor]

I have learned to watch the power graph carefully. Get too far behind the other civs and they will be after you mercilessly. Perhaps this is your problem? If you look at that power graph regularly and make sure you build more military if you find yourself near the bottom, that might improve things.

The other thing is to carefully watch what makes the other civs unhappy with you. read the comments in red with the minuses beside them and see what's causeing the problems. I've found at Monarch that I've got to give in to demands of another civ from time to time just to keep them off your back. Giving that 100 gold they demand as tribute means +1 instead of -1 or even +1 instead of -2 for some leaders. This 2 or 3 difference in the their score can be a significant factor in getting some warlike leaders to attack someone else rather than you. They don't have to like you much - just more than someone else they can hit - as long as you're not at the bottom of the power graph and presenting a tempting target.

I find it valuable to see how each AI leader thinks of the other AI leaders too. You can do that by clicking on the leader on the foreign advisor relations page, and you will see the attitude of each leader to that other leader. If you know someone who is annoyed at you is about the same amount annoyed at someone else nearby, you know it worth it being nice to him because it might get the other guy attacked instead of you.

 

[TheBoatman]

Attack nearest neighbours first , sooner than you get too many "DoWed on friend." modifiers, cripple their early economy (even if you can't conquer them, capture workers on the first turn and pillage their improvements). They will attack you sonner or later anyway ("close borders"). Get the same religion with civs further away, trade with them a lot. Choose your friends and enemies early in the game and don't change often. And never trust alexander or tokugawa...

 

[Veo]

Attack nearest neighbours first , sooner than you get too many "DoWed on friend." modifiers, cripple their early economy (even if you can't conquer them, capture workers on the first turn and pillage their improvements). They will attack you sonner or later anyway ("close borders"). Get the same religion with civs further away, trade with them a lot. Choose your friends and enemies early in the game and don't change often. And never trust alexander or tokugawa...

Yep. In addition to worker napping, pick one or two civs as friends so as to catch the ones you're next to in a sandwich. Then for the rest of the game pull them into war with you when the AI comes calling. Or just give into demands, and remember who needs the payback later

 

[Naismith]

I have learned to watch the power graph carefully. Get too far behind the other civs and they will be after you mercilessly. Perhaps this is your problem? If you look at that power graph regularly and make sure you build more military if you find yourself near the bottom, that might improve things.

I would bet this is your problem. I would go even further and suggest there are a lot of benefits to maintaining a #1 rating. Including:
1) Less demands for tribute, which translates into fewer negative diplo modifiers if you refuse. If you do get a request for a tech or something, you can safely refuse, knowing the AI won't attack you anyway. (I love this part.)
2) Less chance of other AI's joining in against you if you end up in a war, whether you are the instigator or not. This is particularly important if you are like me, and regularly declare war to take more territory. If you aren't at the top power-wise, other AI's will see this as a great opportunity to attack while you are distracted.
3) Even the really crazy AI's like Monty will think twice about attacking if you are way ahead in power. If you are #1 in power, and ahead by 30% over your nearest competitor, you are almost immune to attack. Note I said almost. Even if they do attack you, you've got the means to make them pay for it.

I started playing Civ with Civ3, and my style was mostly peaceful builder, with occasional wars of conquest. In Civ4, I've learned to keep a much larger military for defensive purposes. But with such a nice military, it's hard to resist taking it out for a test drive. I'm becoming more of a warmonger all the time.

 

[manwiththehands]

One a two continent game Monty is wiping out one civilization after another. I'm Catherine and doing the same thing on my continent. I checked the power graph. Even with my building almost nothing except military units Monty's power graph was still going into the stratosphere. Sure enough. As soon as I was done wiping out Hathesput, ready to relax a few turns Monty shows up on my western shore.

 

[ronnybiggs]

I started playing Civ with Civ3, and my style was mostly peaceful builder, with occasional wars of conquest. In Civ4, I've learned to keep a much larger military for defensive purposes.

I've noticed that. In Civ 1 and Civ 2 - the egg theory of civilization (stong impenetrable shell, organism coming to life safely inside) works really well. In Civ 3, without zones of control and not destroying multiple units in one attack, that theory goes down the toilet. Now with AIs rating you on your military strength, it's even worse.

But my problem was that even as a strong ruler I'd still get gang-tackled. Maybe I just wasn't strong enough - and that the more improvements you have, the tastier you look.

Another issue - has anybody noticed that the AIs like to attack just as you're about to get key techs like feudalism or rifling?

 

[ChrTh]

Apparently you should be playing the game these guys are.

 

[ronnybiggs]

Yeah I'm on that thread too. I told them I'm having the opposite problem. On a side note, where is the Aggressive/Passive AI toggle located?

 

[Wodan]

I'm surprised no-one has mentioned religion.

Two ways to have peaceful neighbors:
1) Start a religion early, and spam missionaries early. Yes, you're going to have to delay building tasty stuff like Forges and Lighthouses, in order to make the missionaries.
2) Avoid religion and focus on other techs. As soon as one of your neighbors get religion, adopt it and become it's biggest convert. Get Meditation or Monotheism so you can make missionaries. Spam that religion to your other neighbors.

Either way, everybody will get +5 or +6 on relations with you because you're the same religion. Oh, occasionally someone will attack because of other reasons (despite the bonus) but your game will be pretty peaceful.

Wodan

 

[ronnybiggs]

Yeah, that's one way around it. The trouble comes in when I can't even get the foot in the door - literally, they won't let my missionaries on their lands. And developing your own religion is really so much easier and more profitable than adopting someone else's.

Oftentimes I'll be waiting with galleys/caravels and missionaries for the Open Borders talks to commence, and once it's established, rush in before the AI changes its mind again.

But this is part of my main issue. I never get the chance to even have good enough relations. They'll start off cautious, become annoyed before I can even act like a friend, and then tell me they're tired of my lies and are going to attack me. And I'm like "Lies, what lies? What the hell did I do to you?"

I think I need to play a couple more games to make sure this isn't just an issue of lack of military deterrent.

 

[Wodan]

Yeah, that's one way around it. The trouble comes in when I can't even get the foot in the door - literally, they won't let my missionaries on their lands.

Gifting your missionaries to a 3rd party who has open borders with both of you usually works.

And developing your own religion is really so much easier and more profitable than adopting someone else's.

Sure. But, sometimes you simply can't because the AI beats you to the punch. Also, there are definite advantages to getting BW earlier, cottages, earlier, etc.

Wodan

 

[ronnybiggs]

Sure. But, sometimes you simply can't because the AI beats you to the punch. Also, there are definite advantages to getting BW earlier, cottages, earlier, etc.

Discovering a religion's never been that big a prob for me. If you're playing a civ that starts with mysticism, you can usually grab buddhism or hinduism real quick and not suffer for growth. But I've been trying the Chinese lately, so I'll get all the growth techs - BW, husb, pottery - then snap the CoL slingshot to pick up Confucianism. The issue is then my original question - whether I can enforce my beliefs with my neighbors.

From the game I played last night, it looks like if I have a strong military they're much less upset about my heathen ways. The -4 modifier will go down to -3 or -2. Or maybe it's because I've infiltrated them with missionaries? I don't know... fact is, everyone's been treating me nicer since I've been fortified with musketmen.

Peace through Strength.