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Stalker0

Baller Magnus
Joined
Dec 31, 2005
Messages
8,844
I think Shoshone just because one of its primary powers gets nerfed if you turn off ancient ruins, which I think a decent number of people do. Also I think Portugal does "big land" better with their ability to just GG citadel the land they need to take.
 

CrazyG

Deity
Joined
Oct 14, 2016
Messages
5,785
Location
Beijing
Oh. And its shoeshone right? I thought they probably werent that great but have just been having fun with them.
yeah it was Shoshone. Even with ancient ruins I think he's just alright. Choosing them is cool, and it's nice to skip the border growth one since you don't need it, but most options are pretty good anyways.
 

JamesNinelives

Emperor
Joined
Mar 16, 2019
Messages
1,667
Location
Australia
Speaking of Shoshones, what happened to @JamesNinelives?

I'm around. I don't check in as often these days as I've been mainly playing civ 6 to be honest :). I'm enjoying the Cree a lot, who have some similar strengths to the VP's Shoshone (recon UU, extra territory, versatile UI). I do miss the tactical AI from Vox Populi, the lower graphics requirements, and the way the AI is competitive until the end of the game. But I love the unique great people, the dynamic natural disasters, the city-planning of districts and wonders, and the visuals of a lot of things. The modular way that you can add and combine game modes is also great, I play with secret societies, barbarian clans (which can become city-states), and heroes and legends.
Also, I'd put one of Ethiopia, Shoshone, and Songhai in trash tier (but which one?) People disagreeing about rankings is a good sign of balance in my opinion.

It's been a while but I've played about a dozen civs consistently and I still consider the Shoshone to be one of the strongest in Vox Populi, at least on the settings I play.

Mainly because 1) if you use your early ruins to get maps and unit upgrades you can effectively create super-scouts that can sweep the map for ruins, city-states etc. before the AI gets to them. It's counter-intuitive but sometimes I beelinge Sailing because it can nets me several ruins before the AI can reach them, and if you get a free tech out of it's good return on investment. 2) the faith ruins in particular are powerful - if your map has lots of ruins it can actually get kind of silly with Shoshone founding before anyone else. 3) and their UI gives culture, food, and production and is buildable in a lot of places from very early on. Their UU is fun but has relatively little impact. Extra starting territory is excellent but not game-changing. Shoshone allow me to get a very strong early lead and that tends to put me in a good position for whatever else I want to do.

I find the Iroquois to strong but situational. If you start in the jungle or forest you can pretty much guarantee conquering a neighbour early with your good hammers and a spammable UU with no resource requirements. Also great for building wonders. That said, bad starts for Iroquois can be really terrible. I rank them above average overall.

Both Shoshone and Iroquois I think are probably under-rated in general because they both have strong elements of chance to them and that's not very popular, particularly if you play on a high difficulty. You have to be willing to play them at their worst in order to get a good feel for how they perform as a whole.
 
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