Tradeable Resource Rarity

[erronius]

Hi! I used to play Civ 1 when I was a kid and loved it. I decided to give Civ 3 a try. Here's my beef: I'm having trouble finding much in the way of strategic resources (specifically iron, which is pretty crucial). I've explored most of two different "standard" size maps with the "middle" settings (i.e. 4bn years old, temperate, etc) and found a grand total of two iron deposits. In the first game, I didn't find any saltpeter either (anywhere, even in enemy territory) so my early tech advantage was pretty much zilch. The iron I managed to find was in another Civ's territory and I couldn't trade with them because they didn't have harbors, I think. In the 2nd game, I did find some saltpeter at least, but the only iron I found was literally all the way across the map. My question is, is this the way it's "supposed" to be? Or have I just gotten hilariously unlucky (it wouldn't be the first time)? It's also a little frustrating that of all the dozens of settings, there is no option to make the world more rich in these resources. Any advice? Thanks.

 

[tjs282]

Hi! I used to play Civ 1 when I was a kid and loved it. I decided to give Civ 3 a try.

Glad to hear it, and welcome to Civfanatics

Here's my beef: I'm having trouble finding much in the way of strategic resources (specifically iron, which is pretty crucial).I've explored most of two different "standard" size maps with the "middle" settings (i.e. 4bn years old, temperate, etc) and found a grand total of two iron deposits.

Hahaha--welcome to my world! Yes, this is not at all unusual, at least in the Conquests expansion pack. The original iteration of Civ3 ('Vanilla') had ~1 of each resource-type per civ on the map (so on a standard map, you'd likely have somewhere between 7 and 9 Irons -- although not all spread out evenly, obviously). Resources were made more scarce in Conquests -- about 0.75 resources per type per civ, so a Standard-size map would now only have 5-7 Irons -- presumably in order to 'force' more early resource-wars. So if you want that Iron, it's more likely you'll have to have to fight for it (or hope that a 'new' source -- actually an 'exhaustion'/respawn of an existing source -- pops up in your territory).

In the first game, I didn't find any saltpeter either (anywhere, even in enemy territory) so my early tech advantage was pretty much zilch.

I have got into the habit of assuming that I won't ever have Iron at the start of the game -- it saves time and heartache in the long-term! I don't bother prioritising research on Iron-Working: instead, I build Warriors for home-guard duty, and Archers (Warrior Code), Horsemen (Horse-riding), and/or Catapults (Mathematics) for attack. Although you will eventually need Iron-working (as a prerequisite for Construction = Aqueducts), it's not usually worth spending research on yourself: the AICivs will almost always go for Iron-Working as their first choice of second-tier Ancient Age techs, so you can usually buy or tech-trade for it relatively early on.

The iron I managed to find was in another Civ's territory and I couldn't trade with them because they didn't have harbors, I think.

Also not unusual, especially in the early game at the lowest difficulty levels, when the AICivs have significant build-cost handicaps and therefore take much longer to get city-improvements up and running.

It's also a little frustrating that of all the dozens of settings, there is no option to make the world more rich in these resources. Any advice? Thanks.

Although you can't increase the resource occurrence in the game setup, it is possible to mod the 'frequency of occurrence' settings for resources in the conquests.biq (game rules) file, using the Editor for the specific version you want to alter: the 'on-line helpless'-file (not my joke, but I like it!) for the Editor (sort of) explains how these numbers work. If you do that, make sure to save the .biq under a new name, e.g. 'Resource-rich.biq'. You can then play this ruleset through the 'Civ-content' option in the start-screen; be aware though, that you cannot record any high scores using a modded .biq.

 

[erronius]

tjs282, thank you so much for the detailed response. I realize now that part of my problem was that in order to give myself an easier time of it in my first couple games, I actually reduced the number of civs hugely (3 opponents in my 1st game, 2 in my 2nd game). It sounds like this is a good way to screw yourself out of finding these resources. I will look into modding the biq as I don't really care about high scores at the moment. As a gripe, I would say I think either you should be able to mod the average amount of resources that spawn per player or that the amount should not depend on the number of players. Also I can understand resources like Uranium and rubber being sort of uncommon, but Iron? What the flip. Iron is everywhere in the real world.

Oh well, and thanks again for your advice!

 

[justanick]

My question is, is this the way it's "supposed" to be? Or have I just gotten hilariously unlucky (it wouldn't be the first time)?

More like that later. If you play a standard map with 8 civ in total you have a fair chance of aquiring a source of iron one way or the other. If you reduce the amount of civs you also tend to reduce the amount of resources. So better donnot do that.

 

[tjs282]

tjs282, thank you so much for the detailed response. I realize now that part of my problem was that in order to give myself an easier time of it in my first couple games, I actually reduced the number of civs hugely (3 opponents in my 1st game, 2 in my 2nd game). It sounds like this is a good way to screw yourself out of finding these resources.

Yup. Don't be afraid of putting more Civs on the map: they're not nearly as irrational/ aggressive in Civ3 as they were in Civ1 -- apart from maybe the Mongols and Zulus -- and at the higher levels, you will actually need the AICivs as trading/ research partners, the more the merrier. And as you've found out, more civs = more resource-tiles!

If you want to give yourself an easier time of it, there are several other things you can do, other than reducing the starting competition:

• Play at a low difficulty level: At Regent, all build/food/tech costs are the same for Human and AI-Civs. Chieftain/Warlord gives the Human significant production advantages
• Play on a larger map, and/or use lower %Water values. The more Settle-able land there is available, the further into the game it will be, before the AICivs start getting seriously aggressive.
• Play on a Archipelgo-map. The AICivs won't risk leaving ships in danger of sinking over the interturn, so a (large) Archi-map will tend to keep them separated from each other and you for longer. And the Civ3-AI kinda sux at overseas invasions...

I will look into modding the biq as I don't really care about high scores at the moment. As a gripe, I would say I think either you should be able to mod the average amount of resources that spawn per player or that the amount should not depend on the number of players.

Apart from messing with appearance ratios, another thing you can do to increase resource-tile occurrences, is to mod the number of starting civs per map-size. I recently played a Tiny 70% Archi-map with 24 civs (using the 'Worldwide' Mod). It was so crowded that some Civs didn't have room to found a capital, and I've never played a game so murderous -- with me being the chief genocide. But there were resources on every other tile!

Also I can understand resources like Uranium and rubber being sort of uncommon, but Iron? What the flip. Iron is everywhere in the real world.

Can't argue with you there. Someone made the point very early in Civ3's release schedule that copper and tin (i.e. Bronze) are actually much scarcer -- I read a theory once that the Trojan War was actually about securing one or other of those metal ores -- but iron is of course much harder to smelt, at least while using Bronze Age technology.

Oh well, and thanks again for your advice!

You're very welcome.

 

[Lanzelot]

I realize now that part of my problem was that in order to give myself an easier time of it in my first couple games, I actually reduced the number of civs hugely (3 opponents in my 1st game, 2 in my 2nd game).

Well, reducing the number of civs doesn't necessarily make the game "easier" for you. Quite the contrary... View the AIs as your "helpers", who supply you with techs, resources, luxuries and gold! Then you can see: the more civs the easier it'll be for you.

Example: if you have to research every tech on the tech-tree by yourself, I doubt you will be able to launch the spaceship significantly before 2000 AD. But if you know how to use the AI to do the work for you (especially on the higher difficulty levels, where they get such a big bonus and consequently can research much faster than you), it becomes quite easy to launch around 1000-1300 AD!