It's even better if they are the first AI you meet! DOW immediately. I usually train my soldiers against them too. Chances are you will be allied with them anyway later in the game
TSG 241 After Actions Thread
- Thread starter Nizef
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Why declare war before you have a reason, eg no worker yet? If they offer an easy quest you may still want to pick a different victim. Training the troops is fine but you’d have to have to use 1-2 soldiers that could have been exploring.It's even better if they are the first AI you meet! DOW immediately. I usually train my soldiers against them too. Chances are you will be allied with them anyway later in the game
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I believe if you DOW on first contact the other CS and AI dont know and don't give penalties. I can't confirm this, just something I picked up on the way. As you say it reduces the quest options, and it will be your closest neighbour.
I hesitate to DOW first contact on culture CS as they are often handy for my game style..
I don't always go this route, sometime I steal and make peace the same turn.
When I do an immediate DOW on very first contact I make up for potential losses by using the city and its units as an xp farm.
I thought he means an AI, as opposed to a CS. AIs don't offer quests, CSs do.
If you DOW another AI before meeting anyone else, the other AIs don't know, and there is no warmonger penalty. Only if you completely eliminate them, you'll get a penalty with Civs you haven't even met yet. (Does't make sense logically but that's the way the game works.)
For city states it's different: If you DOW more than one throughout the game, you will get serious penalties from the other CSs. As described by @lerocco above. I think even from the ones you haven't met yet. And if I remember correctly, they stay during the rest of the game and don't gradually wear off like the warmonger penalties you get from the AI.
So to farm an AI, you DOW the first AI you meet ASAP, then continue scouting, and once you have units you want to train you can send them to the AI to practice. Or make some money in a peace deal.
To farm a CS, you camp a unit nearby to keep stealing workers.
I haven't tried this tactic yet, I used to make peace after stealing the worker to escort it back home. But that's how I think it's done (correct me if I'm wrong).
Thanks, now I have it. I knew about DOW on AI civ before anyone else knew, but I also thought this applied to CS. If the CS remember anyway, there is no need to DOW on first contact, as you say, wait until the opportunity arises for the first time, but don´t make peace after the first worker steal, camp a fighting unit to keep grabbing the workers, but keep the unit out of sight of the city. Or simply maintain the war and occasionally send some troops over, kill units and capture workers.
I also wasn't sure if DOW against a CS would give me a warmonger penalty with the AI civs if I did it later in the game, so it seemed easier to DOW on sight.
Even knowing the actual rules, I still think there is merit in immediate DOW to the near neighbour, as you don't have to camp out a unit so much as keep popping over for a quick look. And after DOW there are the nominal T20 and T35 turns when the workers are produced, the scouting or raiding can even take these into account.
Farming the nearest AI civ for workers and xp is a common practice of mine, while my army is being built the rest are being trained.
Slightly off topic, but DOW on contact with AI is worth it, if you think you can get ahead of them in military strength. They usually give a city to make peace, while you are fighting elsewhere. It can be an easy way into an otherwise tricky location. Even if you can't get ahead on military strength, all you lose is a trading opportunity. This works well against peaceful AI who don't usually build large armies.
I never seem to have any luck extorting gold in peace deals.
I also wasn't sure if DOW against a CS would give me a warmonger penalty with the AI civs if I did it later in the game, so it seemed easier to DOW on sight.
Even knowing the actual rules, I still think there is merit in immediate DOW to the near neighbour, as you don't have to camp out a unit so much as keep popping over for a quick look. And after DOW there are the nominal T20 and T35 turns when the workers are produced, the scouting or raiding can even take these into account.
Farming the nearest AI civ for workers and xp is a common practice of mine, while my army is being built the rest are being trained.
Slightly off topic, but DOW on contact with AI is worth it, if you think you can get ahead of them in military strength. They usually give a city to make peace, while you are fighting elsewhere. It can be an easy way into an otherwise tricky location. Even if you can't get ahead on military strength, all you lose is a trading opportunity. This works well against peaceful AI who don't usually build large armies.
I never seem to have any luck extorting gold in peace deals.
fiddlesticks
russia is a terrorist state. Visit u24.gov.ua
On deity and immortal I’m choosy about warring the AI. There has to be a really good early payoff like a worker steal, city location block, or trade route pillage. They’re also very useful in lump sum peace deals. But in general I only want 1 or two early wars at these levels because the benefits of friendships and lump sum friend trades outweigh warring benefits.
On lower levels I war as much as possible because bullying the ai is much more valuable than trades and friendships.
On lower levels I war as much as possible because bullying the ai is much more valuable than trades and friendships.
If my asking about the next game every two weeks is getting tedious, please don’t hesitate to hush me. But once again I’m curious to familiarize myself with the parameters of the next challenge. Happy Easter & thanks!
Indonesia? On an island? You must be kid… Ahhh, wink, wink, you got me last time with the neighbouring civ but this time, you’re not fooling me.Next game will be an easier one - Indonesia, Culture, Warlord, Standard speed and size. Map isn't finalized yet, but expect to start on an island.
successfully win at 204T, I will submit videos of my game and post link here later.
the core strategy is to make full use of Carthage UA, by picking Messenger of Gods
and choose Liberty + Exploration, both happiness policies works well with Carthage.
- Did you play peacefully or warlike? Did you use your UU?
Keep friend with Byzantium Morocco and Rome, DoW on Zulu, Assyria and Spain.
- What technologies did you prioritize?
Tech order at the beginning is Sailing - Luxury Tech - Wheel - Optics - Philosophy for Oracle (not NC) - Theology for Exploration
after that is what I need for DiploV (Education - Astronomy - Printing Press - Radio - Telecommunications - Globalization
- What Social Policies did you choose and in what order? Which Ideology did you choose?
Liberty except Representation - Exploration first row - Rationalism + Order + finish Liberty - Patronage.
- How many cities did you have in the end and where did you settle them?
self found 7 cities and conquerd 1 (and another city at the endgame for Forbidden Palace).
the core strategy is to make full use of Carthage UA, by picking Messenger of Gods
and choose Liberty + Exploration, both happiness policies works well with Carthage.
- Did you play peacefully or warlike? Did you use your UU?
Keep friend with Byzantium Morocco and Rome, DoW on Zulu, Assyria and Spain.
- What technologies did you prioritize?
Tech order at the beginning is Sailing - Luxury Tech - Wheel - Optics - Philosophy for Oracle (not NC) - Theology for Exploration
after that is what I need for DiploV (Education - Astronomy - Printing Press - Radio - Telecommunications - Globalization
- What Social Policies did you choose and in what order? Which Ideology did you choose?
Liberty except Representation - Exploration first row - Rationalism + Order + finish Liberty - Patronage.
- How many cities did you have in the end and where did you settle them?
self found 7 cities and conquerd 1 (and another city at the endgame for Forbidden Palace).
It's actually my first deity diplo game. I now understand why people generally don't like it.
I have a empire far more powerful than what is required for a DiploV. In SV and CV games more resources always means faster victory.
but in DiploV games, the victory time is fixed after Printing Press (73T as far as I know). You have to wait these turns and watch you resources wasted.
Carthage is really a extremely powerful civilization on sea maps with Liberty + Exploration strategy. DiploV can't show her full power.
If going for SV, we can beeline Medal Casting instead of going for Philosophy and Theology, and go more wider to fully use the power of her UA.
I have a empire far more powerful than what is required for a DiploV. In SV and CV games more resources always means faster victory.
but in DiploV games, the victory time is fixed after Printing Press (73T as far as I know). You have to wait these turns and watch you resources wasted.
Carthage is really a extremely powerful civilization on sea maps with Liberty + Exploration strategy. DiploV can't show her full power.
If going for SV, we can beeline Medal Casting instead of going for Philosophy and Theology, and go more wider to fully use the power of her UA.
The_Black_Vegetable
Chieftain
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2023
- Messages
- 51
Exactly. And if you mess up, it's +20 or so turns. I was actually having (at least by my standards) a very strong game, but I missed the first opportunity by one turn.
Players should be aware of spoilers. This video is out a bit early, we ask that you wait until the game closes. In this case, that is 15 April, before posting videos of the currently active game of the month.
Thank you.
Thank you!
JeffreyLXV
Chieftain
Diplomatic victory on turn 279. Perhaps the least difficult deity game I've played.
First win as Dido, earning No White Flag Here achievement.
Peaceful. Shaka tried early but was repelled at the coastline.
Prioritized research to acquire Globalism, and city-state alliances. Missed Forbidden Palace
Tradition; Rationalism; Freedom; Patronage.
Four cities founded; acquired uMgungundlovu when it rebelled.
First win as Dido, earning No White Flag Here achievement.
Peaceful. Shaka tried early but was repelled at the coastline.
Prioritized research to acquire Globalism, and city-state alliances. Missed Forbidden Palace
Tradition; Rationalism; Freedom; Patronage.
Four cities founded; acquired uMgungundlovu when it rebelled.
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JeffreyLXV
Chieftain
Placemark.
BuilderFTW
Warlord
- Joined
- Aug 8, 2011
- Messages
- 134
Turn 259! Struggled a bit in a war with Shaka. Tech felt slow this game. Just barely had the gold for 41 votes needed
raider980
King
- Joined
- Sep 27, 2010
- Messages
- 739
Diplo V T315 on the 2nd WL vote. I thought I would have had it on the first vote but Shaka had taken Samarkand and I was going to be 1 vote short. I debated taking Samarkand back but didn't think I could get it in time. Shaka had a lot of Battleships around it. And it turned out I miscalculated the turn my Diplomats would arrive in their respective capitals so I wouldn't have won on the first vote anyway. If it says 5 turns on the Diplomats and 5 turns on the WL clock, its too late. But I easily got it on the second vote.
Played completely peaceful; no AI ever attacked me but I don't think that was going to last much longer if I hadn't won at this time. Spain was making rumblings of attacking me and my ideological opponents were getting peeved and denouncing me. I went Order, even though two AI already had taken it, just so I wouldn't run into happiness issues. It turned out well because 4 others also went Order. I only ended up taking one tenet in Order anyway; getting the key policies in Patronage was more important. One interesting thing happened that is unusual - the two Freedom AI revolted and joined Order, not sure I've seen that before.
Was a good game; turned out easy by Deity standards - even though I was worried in the early game! That was good because after the last few games it was nice having a fairly smooth journey. After I secured my continent and a city on the island to the south I started to relax. I got lucky though - I thought I was going to have to DoW Shaka when he sent a settler to my continent before I had gotten the last spot. But I was able to trap the settler and he was captured by barbs. Luckily I had left that barb camp there just for this possibility.
Played completely peaceful; no AI ever attacked me but I don't think that was going to last much longer if I hadn't won at this time. Spain was making rumblings of attacking me and my ideological opponents were getting peeved and denouncing me. I went Order, even though two AI already had taken it, just so I wouldn't run into happiness issues. It turned out well because 4 others also went Order. I only ended up taking one tenet in Order anyway; getting the key policies in Patronage was more important. One interesting thing happened that is unusual - the two Freedom AI revolted and joined Order, not sure I've seen that before.
Was a good game; turned out easy by Deity standards - even though I was worried in the early game! That was good because after the last few games it was nice having a fairly smooth journey. After I secured my continent and a city on the island to the south I started to relax. I got lucky though - I thought I was going to have to DoW Shaka when he sent a settler to my continent before I had gotten the last spot. But I was able to trap the settler and he was captured by barbs. Luckily I had left that barb camp there just for this possibility.
It didn't come into play this game but I don't think this is accurate. The AI doesn't realize that you eliminated another AI if you haven't met them. (It may also require the AI you killed to have not met other AI either, not sure about that part; it would be nice info if anyone knows for sure?). That is the reason, in a Continents game, people talk about clearing the continent before meeting AI on the other continent.
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