Turn 130

I'd like to suggest to move the Javalin Thrower from Khazad-Dum to the C3B right now and attack it the next turn. I find 70% chance of winning to small as a GA in advance of the fireworks gives a huge advantage!

I also want to repeat that the chance of getting Monotheism from C3B or CDZ is very very slim. Let's research use our money to research it. C3B will not have a response to knights.
(Especially since C3B has lots of hills we can move to. Knights, with a defense of 3 and able to retreat, can stand a good chance against immortals.)

Another option I thought of is upgrading lots of warriors to medieval infantries. This does not have my preference, but it's worth considering. Note that we have a lot of galleys. If we'd load them all with MI's and AC's we can already give them a big beating, I think.
 
We want out GA when we discover Chivalry, imo. Knights, while very handy, cost a lot, and the extra production and gold can help us rush and procuce Knights at a faster pace, and upgrade some of our units. But do we find some way for them to attack us for we would get war happiness, or do we want to get our GA when we want it, but facing war weariness?

Also, for the cities on the iron island: I would move the one in the east SW one to get on the coast. Why would you want it 1 tile inland?
 
Matrix, remember when we were saying that once we had feudalism that a win against C3B was assured? Now it's once we have Knights a victory will be assured?

For once, let us build what we have and use what we can to win. The longer we wait, I fear the slimer our chances become.
 
Ginger: We want it before. We can use it to fuel our research to Chiv and then accumulate cash for cahrushes and upgrades. If we get it when we have Chiv we had to do the research the hard way.

Goonie: We thought Feud was enough, before CDZ traded C3B into the Middle Ages. Chivalry is the end, for sure. There is no way C3B can get horses; thus we have the advantage over them till Infantry. And I don't see Infantry present in this game.
 
@Goonie: the longer we wait for war the better off we are, at this point. C3B builds a 4/2/1 infantry with 30 shields, we build one with 40 shields; but if we can hold on until we have Monotheism, then we can quickly research Chivalry (while at war) and then start producing knights. a 4/3/2 unit will crush any advantage that C3B thought they once had.

Because of this, I expect C3B to attack prior to our obtaining knights...but not necessarily prior to our obtaining Monotheism. Since they have that tech, they know that we are not reasearching Chivalry yet (else they could not 'trade' it to us). This may be the point they are waiting for. Thus...we could possibly wait until one turn before Monotheism to start the war...and C3B may allow us that waiting period. During that time, we can produce a lot of Medieval Infantry and horsemen. The horses for mp's and the MI for heavy strike force.

@Ginger Ale: Reason for city placement is that we would not have to destroy roads in order to keep the cities out of the trade network. We want to be able to produce cheap mp's.
 
At least 3 more cities can be built on the Iron Island.

@GA: What war weariness are you talking about? We are in Monarchy and hopefully will remain in Monarchy.

IMO, building macemen is a good alternative to horsemen since attack 4 units actually rule the world until cavalry. And they are rather inexpensive though C3B gets them at a discount price of 10 shields.

The longer we wait, the more of these discounted macemen C3B gets. Therefore, accelerating research to Chivalry (triggering Golden Age) should be essential for the attack plans. Previous turn has been good and this turn might be good either especially since their warrior is still on its place.
 
Well, if waiting until we research Monotheism is the precursor to war, why not take the time to head into Feudalistic government now? It delays the war, but gives us the benefit of more upgrade cash.

Feudalism = more unit support = more available gold = faster upgrades = more macemen at the ready.

The talk of feudalistic government has already been shelved by our military establishment by preaching the evils of war weariness. Yet in another thread, our CoMA has a hunch that C3B may go on the defensive for the time being. Now it appears we may be on "cold war" alert until we get a stab at researching Chivalry.

This is the time to change to a government that will line our coffers and give us plenty of troop support. This sounds like a must since our military strategists are banking more on building the powerful units than upgrading them. And at 75 units and counting, we will be in the poorhouse without the right government to fund these desires. Where do we hope to get all this cash, plus fund the "growth" in our unhappy cities?

Unlike RL, we aren't allowed to run a deficit in this game, you know. ;)

EDIT: You can join the Feudalistic govenment discussion here
 
After taking a closer look at the save:

Our military is a bit oversized, and we cannot accumulate too many additional units since we are already close to choking our budget and research with the military. Time to go to war apparently and dispose of a few extra units we have. It might be a good idea to move the second JT near the C3B warrior ready to attack next turn.

@DZ: May be just poll your proposal and end this discussion once and for all? Most of the citizens have played a game or 2 of C3C and might know the drawbacks and advantages of Feudalism. IIRC, it has been introduced into C3C specifically to provide for a suitable government for Sengoku scenario. And has remained in the complete list of governments by some mistake of some Breakaway developer who likes "diversity" and thinks that "the more options the better" even if these options are very far from optimal. :)
 
"Far from optimal?" Feudalism seems to have been developed for the very situation we find ourselves in today:

1. We have access to one luxury in the foreseeable future, nullifying the quick happiness fix of Marketplaces.
2. We have to set the Lux rate to 10% just to get most cities to Size 6!
3. To get most cities to Size 7, we will need to build an Aqueduct and a Temple.
4. We have a woefully obsolete military, and possess the techs to modernize it.
5. We are willing to attack with this motley band to start a war we are not ready for.
6. Every new unit we build will put us further in the hole.

Plus, if I am not mistaken, unit support for Feudalism under the Sengoku scenario is modified to be more like Monarchy. So the makers of this game must have had some reason for supplying the game with this type of government.

They made it for us! We are the embodiment for why Feudalism was created. No domestic policy or future? Stuck with small cities? Then create a mighty army by turning a negative aspect into a positive one.

I will try to create a poll later today.
 
akots said:
IIRC, it has been introduced into C3C specifically to provide for a suitable government for Sengoku scenario. And has remained in the complete list of governments by some mistake of some Breakaway developer who likes "diversity" and thinks that "the more options the better" even if these options are very far from optimal. :)
Click to expand...

There's a difference between remembering correctly and making things up. Us large group of beta-testers liked that fuedalism was introduced for starters, and we definitely helped shape it. It wasnt some breakaway developer doing his thing.

Secondly, have you played Sengoku? Why do I even ask... Fuedalism in Sengoku is essentially a perfect government, as its designed to be the only government you'll play as after the very beginning. It's radically different from the main game.

Rarr I'm being mean today.
 
@Ginger Ale: Reason for city placement is that we would not have to destroy roads in order to keep the cities out of the trade network. We want to be able to produce cheap mp's.
Click to expand...

then the city between Uxmal and cobá is not an option since it will be connected regardless of whether it is on the coast or one tile inland, withg the road on the BG.
 
I must agree with akots: we have 31 units that need upkeep.
We also have four galleys in the north, four in Khazad-Dum and two next to Kamina.

Should we destroy the galley next to the other four in the north? Or will they know we're coming that way anyway? If we destroy it they will at least not know with how many galley's we come.

@Goonie: you were unhappy that certain ministers didn't do their job. I'll have very little to do, when we attack C3B. To me it is clear that CDZ does not want to get involved. And now that we know they don't have Feudalism it's also highly unlikely they have Astronomy, so they're not a threat anyway.
 
When we attack C3B you will have alot to do. More than you do now.

Make sure the world knows we were doing this out of self defence. You need to sell the war.

I hope you don't think the war on C3B will be a vacation for you!
 
Turnplayer needs quick advise on:

Revolt or not ?
I guess the poll will tell me. I do feel entitled to interpret the poll if there are 2 or more options close.

Research or refrain from researching ?
Not a biggy; we can always stop research ones begun or start later. I think I'll start research for Mono this turn. It will take about 15 turns (I guess)
 
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