Unbelievable battles

[aronnax]

The Germans had a battle cruiser named Deutschland at the start of the War. But Hitler had them change the name because having a ship of that name go down would be a big blow to German morale.

That would be most demoralising if the ship sank in 1944-45.

Radio Report:The Allied attack on Normandy Beaches was a huge setback to Germeny..... Paris falls to Allied hands as German troops get butt kicked..... Russian infantry repels Germans at Stalingrad......Italy surrenders, joins war on Allied side..... Germany is sinking and is slowly going down into the sea.....

 

[Steph]

Radio Report:The Allied attack on Normandy Beaches was a huge setback to Germeny..... Paris falls to Allied hands as German troops get butt kicked..... Russian infantry repels Germans at Stalingrad......Italy surrenders, joins war on Allied side..... Lutzow is sinking and is slowly going down into the sea.....

Yes, replacing "Germany" by Lutzow in the last sentence is much better for the morale. You just have to ignore all the previous sentences.

 

[aronnax]

opps, left out the word "most"

 

[PrinceEugene_]

sorry edit

 

[Eran of Arcadia]

You probably meant a different thread . . .

 

[Antilogic]

Well, German ships are mostly named after cities or states. Nevertheless if there is a new Leipzig that can give some quarrels with France. Anyway to name a ship after a battle is not done so in German main warships since the Weißenburg class predreadnoughts. Only coincidentally there might have happened a battle at these places. At this moment btw only the SSBN HMS Trafalgar is named after a battle in these forces.
However you can have ships in a European fleet named Emden, Surcouf and Edninburgh. Germany is atm not naming ships after persons because of political correctness. Some idiot will still be found to say why the person is not such a good choice. I would not evade such conflicts though...

Adler

That's what the United States was doing for battleships before they building them--now, they use states and locales mostly for submarines, I think (like the Ohio and the Los Angeles class submarines). I wish we still named carriers after historical battles and figures, though...the modern convention of naming them after presidents, especially ones that had nothing to do with the navy or maritime matters, doesn't strike me as interesting. Why they are naming the new class of supercarriers after Gerald Ford is beyond my comprehension.

Whatever. I like the WW2 convention better.

@Rossiya: Okay, I'm kind of seeing what you were talking about...but every country likely has a history of civil conflict (I say likely because I do not claim to know every country's complete history, but from what I know this is true). Sorry, it must be that I can't think late at night.

 

[GeneralMatt]

Up here in Canada we name our ships after Cities and stuff. HMCS Kingston, HMCS Halifax..

There is a certain battle I am looking for, it was a certain Penninsular one..

I think this is it.

http://www.britishbattles.com/peninsula/Albuera.htm

I read about it and what happened was the Spanish and Portuguese all fled leaving the British alone to face this huge Cavalry attack. Even though the odds were extremely against them, they fought back and it was the French leaving the field in retreat.

And Waterloo itself, as Wellington so aptly put is "was a near run thing". If the French had attacked with there Cavalry and infantry together, bye-bye British. The British squares (best defense vs Cavalry) would have been decimated by the French infantry who would form into lines..

 

[Adler17]

At the moment the Prussians appeared Napoleon might have won the battle of Waterloo but his troops would have been too exhausted to win the battle of Belle Alliance.

Adler

 

[privatehudson]

Barossa is also pretty unusual, but then again so was the British commander at the battle - Thomas Graham. Rather ironically Graham was in favour of the French revolution in its early stages but this changed abruptly. His wife died in France during that period and her coffin was treated with considerable disrespect by a French mob. Outraged by this he returned home to Scotland and raised a regiment of foot at his own expense, joining the army for the first time in his life at aged 45. He went on to be an outstanding commander of men and Wellington's second in command throughout much of the Peninsula campaign.

And Waterloo itself, as Wellington so aptly put is "was a near run thing". If the French had attacked with there Cavalry and infantry together, bye-bye British. The British squares (best defense vs Cavalry) would have been decimated by the French infantry who would form into lines..

Easier said than done frankly given the cramped nature of the terrain, the early mauling of the I corps, the way Hougomount dragged much of the II corps away, the deployment of VI corps to face the Prussians and the reluctance of Napoleon to committ the Guard infantry.

As for the Prussians winning La Belle Alliance after seeing the British defeated that rather depends on whether they'd fight at all if the British had been forced to withdraw. Gneisenau wasn't exactly overflowing with confidence in Wellington's promise to stand and fight after all. Then again knowing old Blucher he'd probably have pitched into Napoleon come what may.

 

[GeneralMatt]

Easier said than done frankly given the cramped nature of the terrain, the early mauling of the I corps, the way Hougomount dragged much of the II corps away, the deployment of VI corps to face the Prussians and the reluctance of Napoleon to committ the Guard infantry.

Yeah..

Though
I have been playing a oldish game on the battle (Waterloo; Napoleon's last Battle, based on Mr Meier's Gettysburg and Antiem engines) and when I played the first few hours of the battle, my whole right wing (Hougemont) was rolled up by a massive Cavalry and Infantry assault.. It was quite scary considering I had I think it was Ponsonby's brigade and they wouldn't charge the flank of the charging French cavalry and so my troops were just run over.

But either way, if the Old Guard had been sent in support of Ney's attack, it would have been extremely tight..

 

[privatehudson]

Ahhh the technical problems with old computer games, they never cease to amuse.

I don't think Boney would send in the Old Guard unless he absolutely had no other choice, after all they were not even directly involved in the final French attack. Three batallions of Old Guard did advance but were held in reserve whilst the middle guard made the main assault. I guess he could have thrown his middle guard into the engagement but Boney was always wary of using his guard infantry.

 

[GeneralMatt]

Yeah, but it is still an amazing game, especially the smaller focused maps were the "what if's" are negligent.

Yeah, I don't think it was much of the Old Guard in the Cavalry/Infantry assault. Napoleon had a lot of troops that day (Not enough to beat both the Brits and the Germans together probably though) and if he didn't underestimate the British (He never fought Wellington personally before, and was sick I think) it could have went the other way.

I really love the British in all history, and really admire there sticking power.
I was reading in the historical bits on the battle in the game (Quite amazing definitely) and basically he just plain though a cavalry charge could have made them run, hah.