Unlocking SPs

[civIII]

I think all the SPs should be available from the start. For example look at order. If you have a massive empire that really benefits from it, you wont get past unlocking the 1 or 2 abilities out of 6 on the order tree. Also lategame, stuff like +1 gold or +1 production is nothing for a late-game policy. If i'm having cities with factories, banks, and universities having 50+ production, gpt, and science, that bonus is nothing.

 

[etipton3]

stuff like +1 gold or +1 production is nothing for a late-game policy. If i'm having cities with factories, banks, and universities having 50+ production, gpt, and science, that bonus is nothing.

When you have 15+ cities that will add up

 

[PreLynMax]

When you have 15+ cities that will add up

Why would you have over 6 cities? My economy will literary DIE (not to mention, have -892,389,289 happiness) if I had more than that. But in your defense, having 15+ (urk!) cities, the bonuses will add up.

 

[etipton3]

Why would you have over 6 cities? My economy will literary DIE if I had more than that. But in your defense, having 15+ (urk!) cities, the bonuses will add up.

I've had 20+ cities and still be in the positive on happiness, just depends on how your playing. Taking over 15+ cities with war and not annexing...never.

 

[durian]

I've had 20+ cities and still be in the positive on happiness, just depends on how your playing. Taking over 15+ cities with war and not annexing...never.

Annexing is better than puppeting happiness-wise, as long as you save up money to purchase a courthouse immediately after annexing.

 

[PhilBowles]

Why would you have over 6 cities? My economy will literary DIE (not to mention, have -892,389,289 happiness) if I had more than that. But in your defense, having 15+ (urk!) cities, the bonuses will add up.

I rarely have more than that, but I've played a game today with 7 cities (5 Songhai, two annexed - Persepolis & Bucharest) and, due to trade route income, standard city income, trading posts, and Macchu Piccu, I'm earning over 100 gold per turn outside a golden age, without having opened the Commerce tree for the capital bonus, and only just having reached Banking. I also have excess happiness despite a 20-pop capital and several cities with more than 15 pop.

This is admittedly in a low-difficulty game as I'm playing MP with someone who's new to Civ V, but the same principles apply at all levels even if the numbers for income, smiley faces and population will tend to be lower; the major difference is in the Wonders you'll be able to get.

 

[joncnunn]

The main problem with the Order tree isn't that its bad; but that it opens too late in normal games.
It would indeed help this policy (& Autocracy as well) if they opened one era earlier.

 

[tetley]

I wrote about this in the War Academy. Freedom is available in Renaissance; Order and Autocracy aren't available until Industrial. Which causes you to almost always pick Freedom. The happiness bonus from Order needs more time to produce Golden Ages; United Front needs more time to gift more units. The +25% science bonus from factories wouldn't make a difference anyway. And you can pretty much forget about either the Order or Autocracy finisher SP changing the course of the game.