v0.01 ALPHA: Expanded Civic System and Other Changes

[Aussie_Lurker]

Updated 17-02-06: Minor Update-solved the problem relating to State religions, with the assistance of the very talented A-G-you're a legend mate .

OK guys, my very first ever mod for a civ game (so please be gentle ). Also, please note that I still very much consider this to be at the 'PlayTesting' phase, so please play it and give me any and all feedback. So far, I have limited my changes solely to civics, but will add changes to other areas down the track.
I believe that the zip file I am providing should have all the files necessary to play with the modified rules but-if not-then please let me know.

OK, a couple of issues from the get-go. First, there were certain modifications I wanted to make to unit and city maintainance costs, but there appears to be some bugs in this section of CivicInfos.xml. Therefore I hope to come back to these when the bugs are fixed.
Second, there are a few things which I can really only change with Python, and this will take me a bit longer to do. Therefore, particularly in the case of religious civics, many of the effects are only of a 'placeholder' form (I want priests to generate certain commerce and yield benefits under certain religious civics).

Lastly, things to be done:

1) Overhaul of the Ancient and Classical tech tree, and the addition of a new religion (Shinto).

2) Addition of Farmers, Soldiers and Civil Servants to the list of Specialists.

3) Addition of a host of 'Civic-Specific' Improvements and Wonders via Python scripting.

4) Hope to incorporate elements of Mylons Mod, The Inquisition mod and the EE3 mod (assuming all the creators give me their permission).

Anyway, enough of me blabbing on. Hope you enjoy my first-ever mod .

Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.

 

[Aussie_Lurker]

Oh, forgot to mention what I have actually done in my mod.
I will include a full readme later on but, for the meantime, I have done the following:

-Added Rights and Organization as new Civic Categories.

-Totally overhauled both the effects and appearance of the various civic options.

In total, I believe that there are now a total of 56 civic options, in 7 categories, from which to choose. Economics, in particular, now has earlier options associated with it (Barter and Cash economy).
Lastly, I realise the civics screen will look a little messy, but I do plan to go back to the Civic titles and shorten them as best I can-so that they all fit within the various borders.
Anyway, as I said above, please enjoy.

Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.

 

[Colonel Kraken]

Hi Aussie,

I thought I'd be the first to comment in your thread because of all the great things you added to my thread "Civics: Need Modification?". Hopefully, I'll be taking some time to check out your civics mod. Unfortunately, right now I'm quite busy.

Lastly, things to be done:

2) Addition of Farmers, Soldiers and Civil Servants to the list of Specialists.

I believe there is a mod that already has done this, so maybe you could grab the proper pieces and put them in yours.

 

[Leif]

I really like your ideas on civics and whatnot, however due to whatever changes you have made it is impossible to adopt state religions even if you found one.

Also, I think you work in extremes, while human sacrifice may lower the population, it wouldn't cause starvation (from -health). I think you should tone down the benefits and drawbacks and use "no maintanance from capital" far less friequently.

 

[Civmansam]

Pretty impressive mod so far.
These are the little things that make the orginal game better than before

 

[Aussie_Lurker]

Hi Lief. First of all in regards to State Religion-I was afraid that this might be the case. I borrowed Arbitrary Guys modification of religion civics and thought this would work (its a long story, but having negative happiness values per non-state/state religion was conflicting with the State Religion boolean). Apparently it seems I was mistaken . This is quite strange, actually, because in the EE3 scenario I am playing, State religions can still be founded and adopted normally (I think I will chat to A-G about this).

As for the 'No Maintainance' issue, this is what I mentioned above-namely that there appears to be a bug in city maintainance. I want a modification to the maintainance cost-up or down-not no cost. This is something I plan to work on, possibly with python.
Lastly, your point regarding sacrificial is exactly the kind of 'play-test' advice I need. I will tone it down before I put out the next version-which will occur after I add the new specialists to the game.

Anyway, thankyou all for your feedback so far. I know that, with your help, I can make this a really good mod .

Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.

 

[spincrus]

Do you want help with graphics for custom specialists? I'll see what I can do.

Suggestion: let's change the name of Jail to Public Safety and in addition to the current bonuses, let's have it make a Policeman specialist available.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

Great work so far, keep it up!

 

[ToV]

I have a problem. I installed your mod, but when I load it, I see no changes made anywhere. What could be the problem? Did I unzip it in the wrong place or something?

 

[Aussie_Lurker]

Have you put it under Mods? Also, remember that you have to go to Advanced under the main screen, and then 'Load a Mod'-then choose Civic Mod. Unless.....check my Civic_Mod folder, is there a Civic_Mod.ini file? If not, I am REALLY sorry, and I will post a new version of the zip folder tonight.

Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.

 

[ToV]

Have you put it under Mods? Also, remember that you have to go to Advanced under the main screen, and then 'Load a Mod'-then choose Civic Mod. Unless.....check my Civic_Mod folder, is there a Civic_Mod.ini file? If not, I am REALLY sorry, and I will post a new version of the zip folder tonight.

Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.

I am currently searching for a Civic_Mod.ini file, but so far I have not found one. I did everything else right, as far as I can tell.

 

[Aussie_Lurker]

I am really, REALLY sorry ToV. When you mentioned the problem, I suspected that-in my haste-I might have forgotten to include the .ini file. I will rectify the problem at my earliest possible conveniance!

Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.

 

[Heav]

I played the mod, all was fine.
1 note: try to rebalance, for example whole game i was pantheic(religion) and it is huge bonus in science/commerce.

1 question: how can I declare state religion, i found 5 religions and I could not convert to any.

 

[Aussie_Lurker]

Well, Heav, that is the purpose of this Alpha version of the mod. I want people to try it out and tell me where imbalances are and-more to the point-how you think I should change it to make it more balanced. So, I see what you are saying regarding Pantheism, but can you think of a way of making it better?

Actually, I should point out that I hope to change the religion civics-using python-to attach the bonuses either to Priest Specialists or Cities with your State religion. In the meantime, though, any rebalancing ideas you have would be appreciated!

Lastly, have posted an updated version of the mod, with the problem regarding State Religions solved. Enjoy .

EDIT: Hang on, Heav, is Culture not important to you? This civic has a -25% culture penalty (due to the attraction of people of various cultures and faiths to cities practicing pantheism). Perhaps I will boost that penalty to -50% and see what happens. Will post the resulting mod tomorrow-but now its bedtime .

Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.

 

[dalwand]

I am testing a game and I cannot change religion. Does one of the early civics prevent choosing a religion or something?

 

[Roland Johansen]

Hi, Aussie. With all the comments you had before Civ4 was even out, you were bound to create a mod. Good work.

As for the 'No Maintainance' issue, this is what I mentioned above-namely that there appears to be a bug in city maintainance. I want a modification to the maintainance cost-up or down-not no cost. This is something I plan to work on, possibly with python.
Lastly, your point regarding sacrificial is exactly the kind of 'play-test' advice I need. I will tone it down before I put out the next version-which will occur after I add the new specialists to the game.

If you're playing with the cost factors in the game, then you might want to check out the strategy article on city upkeep costs. Especially now that Krikkitone has added a formula for city upkeep at the end of this thread. This formula seems to be a work in progress, but it looks good enough to be used for modding (see post 68 and onward). The modifiers used in this formula can be found in the xml-files.
The article can be found here.

I might also warn you that you've increased civic upkeep cost considerably by adding two more types of civics. This could change the costs versus income balance. I co-authored (with colony) an article on the civic upkeep cost which can be found here. Modifying the civic upkeep costs is something that is probably a lot easier than the city upkeep costs. Maybe you've already done so and then you can forget this warning.

Good luck with perfecting your mod.

 

[Heav]

Ok, my rebalance suggest for religion civic(other are quite balanced)

Pantheist: +25% science stay, no commerce bonus, -25%culture can stay(or 15%), and not in all cities, but in cities with state religion.
Sacrificial: add -25% science or -25% culture in cities with state religion, +food/hammers too in cities with state religion
Militant: +free units modul, -10->-25% science in cities with state religion
Organized Religion: -25% science(to negatiate +commerce bonus, so you get only +golds) in cities with state religion, or add +25% gold, not commerce
Orthodox: +2 in cities with state religion, -%science +%culture in cities with state religion, priests +2(3) culture or +1(2) gold, state religion church +2(3) priest, no-state churchs +0 priests, cathedral(state religion) +4(5) priests
Reformist: +1(2) in cities with state religion, +%science, -%food
Fundamentalist: -50% science reduce to -25%, add -25% commerce in cities with state religion
Pacifist: +25->50% war
Free Religion: no science bonus, +20% culture or +culture per non-state religion in a city, 1->2 in all cities

What I have not writen, that can stay.

Game: AI in middle age still convert to serfdom->big population-> great numbers of specialst, + other civic with -culture on specialist(republic?) => culture is dead for them.

 

[Aussie_Lurker]

@Dalwand. This might be the problem other people are experiencing with State Religions. This problem should have been solved in the most recent update, so re-download the above zip file, unzip it and try the game with that-you should now be able to change religion (I hope ).

@Roland. The Crux of my problem is more that the % maintainance modifier simply doesn't seem to work. i.e. either you pay maintainance or you don't. I, OTOH, want to have civics subtly alter the maintainance costs of cities. I do say that this MUST be a bug, because this is not a Boolean, but an Integer entry.

@Heav, those are very interesting suggestions, and I will definitely take them into consideration. Many of the suggestions you give, though, can only be done via python, as the tags do not currently exist in XML to change commerces or yields as a result of having your State Religion in a city. The question is, should I make yield and commerces changes contingent on a Priest, or the presence of the State Religion?

Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.

 

[Roland Johansen]

@Roland. The Crux of my problem is more that the % maintainance modifier simply doesn't seem to work. i.e. either you pay maintainance or you don't. I, OTOH, want to have civics subtly alter the maintainance costs of cities. I do say that this MUST be a bug, because this is not a Boolean, but an Integer entry.

I can't quite follow what you're saying. Are you talking about civic upkeep costs or city upkeep costs. The first are not noted specifically in each city as upkeep costs as they have an empire wide effect, while the second are dependant on the characteristics of a city and are noted in each city.

If you're talking about the civic upkeep costs, then I should advice you to take another look at the article that I linked to. There is no bug, but the civic upkeep costs are calculated for each civic first, rounded down and then added. So maybe, you're forgetting the effect of rounding down. Subtle changes in the civic upkeep costs are only noticable as being subtle when you have a large empire. Then the effect of rounding down is negligible. On the other hand, if you only have 1 or 2 small cities, then the effect of rounding down can mean a lot. Is that the effect that you are seeing?

Also, the city upkeep costs has some rounding down in the formula, but the details of this formula are not completely known as of yet.

Maybe, you could give an example or explain the phenomenon that you are seeing with a bit more detail.

 

[Aussie_Lurker]

@Roland. I am specifically talking about the City Maintainance costs (both distance and Number of Cities).
For example. I have a civic (Imperialism) which is supposed to reduce the Distance from Capital costs by around 25%. However, when I set the <iCityDistanceModifier> to -25%, it comes up in the Civic Screen saying 'No Distance Maintainance Costs'. The same happens when I try and change the Number of Cities cost as well. Do you see what I mean now?

Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.