Vampire Castle = Feitoria?

[Ticio]

As I have been reading the forum, I found a post that stated that the new vampire castle could be the precedent for the portuguese feitorias (I do not remember the post nor the person, apologies in advances).

As it seems from the patch notes;

The Vampire castle:

-Can be placed on empty tiles in player-owned or neutral territory.
-Grants defensive bonus to any unit on the tile.
-Vampires can remove the player's Castles, and any unit can pillage Castles.
-Vampire Castles grant yields to their owner's capital equal to the yields of all adjacent tiles.


To be honest, that sounds pretty much that it could feet the role of a portuguese feitoria. Maybe an extra bonus to coast tiles and luxury ressources and there you have it.

It would feet incredible well if they allowed Portugal to snipe luxury/strategic ressources to their capital through this tile improvement.

They also could help replenish naval and ground units and give them the defense bonus.
This way, they would allow the portuguese to make a very spread economic empire with tiny, very rich and very strategic outposts that could make the capital an absurdly tall city (like Lisbon was).

What do you think?

We do not know yet if they will make a Portuguese tag, but I'm starting to think that this castle is to check if a "feitoria" improvement is possible (the same I think that the zombies and aliens are the tests for something we will see in the future!).

And thanks again to the person to first have noticed this similarity.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

You're welcome!

Another potential piece of the puzzle is the Great Merchant Colaeus, who can copy any luxury resource in your capital. That might be something a Feitoria can do.

 

[8housesofelixir]

A civ of very spread economic empire with an tall capital will be a really nice addition to the game. Currently we don't have that many trade-focused civs, especially a sea-based one.

 

[PhoenicianGold]

Is this how players are justifying vampires in their heads now lol? That the devs were just beta-testing Portugal?

I'm not sure why the devs would create fun mechanics available to all civs only to obviate the work put into making Secret Societies unique by lazily reappropriating it for Portugal.

Furthermore, I doubt this concept of feitorias would work in practice. It's fairly OP to be able to build improvements outside of your territory, which is why you can only build four vampire castles. Allowing Portugal to plop down as many feitorias as it wanted would be broken, and setting any sort of arbitrary limit for how many they can build would be unfun and generally a lazy solution.

I would be quite surprised if this happened. I would imagine a feitoria being more simple like a IZ/CH UD that can only be built on coasts.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

Is this how players are justifying vampires in their heads now lol? That the devs were just beta-testing Portugal?

I'm not sure why the devs would create fun mechanics available to all civs only to obviate the work put into making Secret Societies unique by lazily reappropriating it for Portugal.

Furthermore, I doubt this concept of feitorias would work in practice. It's fairly OP to be able to build improvements outside of your territory, which is why you can only build four vampire castles. Allowing Portugal to plop down as many feitorias as it wanted would be broken, and setting any sort of arbitrary limit for how many they can build would be unfun and generally a lazy solution.

I would be quite surprised if this happened. I would imagine a feitoria being more simple like a IZ/CH UD that can only be built on coasts.

There would probably be fairly restrictive placement rules. Like, only on coasts in city-states or something.

 

[Alexadamz]

Feitorias could be built on top of the luxury ressources, working as a replacement of the regular tile improvement. Maybe with some restriction of distance from coast - 2 tiles is ok, I guess. And also some defensive bonus.

 

[Ticio]

You're welcome!

Another potential piece of the puzzle is the Great Merchant Colaeus, who can copy any luxury resource in your capital. That might be something a Feitoria can do.

OH! it was you! I remember!

Is this how players are justifying vampires in their heads now lol? That the devs were just beta-testing Portugal?

I'm not sure why the devs would create fun mechanics available to all civs only to obviate the work put into making Secret Societies unique by lazily reappropriating it for Portugal.

Furthermore, I doubt this concept of feitorias would work in practice. It's fairly OP to be able to build improvements outside of your territory, which is why you can only build four vampire castles. Allowing Portugal to plop down as many feitorias as it wanted would be broken, and setting any sort of arbitrary limit for how many they can build would be unfun and generally a lazy solution.

I would be quite surprised if this happened. I would imagine a feitoria being more simple like a IZ/CH UD that can only be built on coasts.

I just bought the pass becasue I find this mode quite interesting (apocalypse not so much). I do not think the developpers need to justify anything they do, but I though the point that Eagle Pursuit made was original and very interesting.

I do not think they did the vampire castle just for the feitorias, but maybe they will take some of these features to add on new civs.
After all, it seems a pretty interesting feature, that seems to fit more than well to the idea that were the portuguese Feitorias.

And focusing on the idea of feitorias, I assume they would be good but not overpowered. If they can be pillaged (with extra outcome for the pillager), and their number caped (+1 per new continent discovered, for example) I think it would be possible.

I really hope they will do something new! I prefer they try to do a civ with an innovative tile improvement such as this even if it has is problems...that another "spetial building in substitution for market" as the dozens we already have.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

I think that rather than the Vampire Castle being a forerunner for the theoretical Feitoria, they probably designed the Feitoria first then found inspiration in it for the Vampire Castle, and it just so happens that the VC arrived first.

 

[Ticio]

I think that rather than the Vampire Castle being a forerunner for the theoretical Feitoria, they probably designed the Feitoria first then found inspiration in it for the Vampire Castle, and it just so happens that the VC arrived first.

I have the same thought, the Vampire castle seems to have too specific bonuses meanwhile the other new bonuses from the patch are more regular.

I sincerely think they are looking if the idea works.

I hope it does

 

[lotrmith]

There would probably be fairly restrictive placement rules. Like, only on coasts in city-states or something.

That would be underwhelming and quite frankly practically useless a majority of the time.

You'd have to find a city state on the coast, suzerain it, send a builder there,, hope it has good tiles, and also get a portion of them as basic coast yields. Bleh.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

That would be underwhelming and quite frankly practically useless a majority of the time.

You'd have to find a city state on the coast, suzerain it, send a builder there,, hope it has good tiles, and also get a portion of them as basic coast yields. Bleh.

I don't think the Feitoria would copy the adjacent tile yields. It would probably copy luxury resources or just send back a hefty sum of Gold per turn.

 

[8housesofelixir]

Is this how players are justifying vampires in their heads now lol? That the devs were just beta-testing Portugal?

No, I don't think this is "justifying", this is just a normal civ forum post speculating about a future civ and its abilities. It's not like every single post which doesn't treat vampire negatively is "justifying".

I do agree that be able to build an unlimited amount of improvements outside of your territory is OP. On the other hand, a feitoria as UD is adequate as in-game mechanics goes, but are not really historical accurate, since lots of the Portuguese feitorias were small fortified posts devoted to treating (as the name suggests, "factory"), rather than a permanent established settlement/city. Maybe feitorias can be implemented as a special ability of Portuguese trade posts.

Edit: Oops, I realized that the Hansa is also originally a trade post (Kontor) but get implemented as a UD in the game, so if the Portugal civ does have the feitoria it's highly likely that it will become a UD.

 

[PhoenicianGold]

No, I don't think this is "justifying", this is just a normal civ forum post speculating about a future civ and its abilities. It's not like every single post which doesn't treat vampire negatively is "justifying".

For the record I am quite happy with the vampires. This just feels like dissidents trying to make peace with the vampires, as if Portugal will somehow obviate or erase them.

I do agree that be able to build an unlimited amount of improvements outside of your territory is OP. On the other hand, a feitoria as UD is adequate as in-game mechanics goes, but are not really historical accurate, since lots of the Portuguese feitorias were small fortified posts devoted to treating (as the name suggests, "factory"), rather than a permanent established settlement/city. Maybe feitorias can be implemented as a special ability of Portuguese trade posts.

So maybe it's a replacement for the fort that can only be built on coasts? Although that feels like such a waste of land tiles.

Edit: Oops, I realized that the Hansa is also originally a trade post (Kontor) but get implemented as a UD in the game, so if the Portugal civ does have the feitoria it's highly likely that it will become a UD.

Those were my thoughts. It would be nice to have a fortified commercial hub as a sort of coastal partner to the Hansa and Seguba.

 

[8housesofelixir]

Those were my thoughts. It would be nice to have a fortified commercial hub as a sort of coastal partner to the Hansa and Seguba.

A UD act as a combination of encampment and commercial hub would be really interesting in the game. Or even a UD that is basically a harbor but has the flavors of commercial hub & encampment; a "lonely" oversea trading settlement needs a new way to defend itself.

 

[Uberfrog]

Feitorias open up some really interesting opportunities for the devs to get creative with how to work an improvement/colony in or near someone else's terriory. It would really miss a trick to restrict them to city-states as in Civ 5... the Portuguese (and the Dutch, and English, and French...) built factories within the Mughal Empire, having been given permission to trade there.

 

[Kmart_Elvis]

I'm not sure why the devs would create fun mechanics available to all civs only to obviate the work put into making Secret Societies unique by lazily reappropriating it for Portugal.

They've literally already done this, though. They used the "generate science and culture from faith per turn" mechanic in both the Voidsingers secret society and Ethiopia's leader ability. So it's not much of a stretch to assume that a Feitoria could have similar mechanics to a vampire castle.