want to set deeply friendly allies in a scenario, but can't seem to

[allan]

I have encountered another problem with scenario creation. No matter what attitude you give one civ toward another in a scenario--even 0 for total "like", with an alliance--when you test play that civ, it seems the other civ either tells you to "begone" when you talk to them, or wants to cancel the alliance without negotiation. Is the MGE's characteristically hostile diplomatic posture so deeply ingrained in the program that you can't modify it with the attitude settings, or what?

 

[kobayashi]

The attitude is only a starting value. It by definition must change depending on actions and geographical dispostions of the various tribes.

The most optimal way to render what you want is to set to alliance and best attitude (both ways) and then prevent negotiation between your allies. However, this means you cannot trade techs.

Also try to have the AI leaders' tendencies amenable to alliances (you know rational, perfectionist etc.)

Reputation is also important and must be reset to best.

Finally, make sure the allies do not have cities in each other's continents (as defined when the map was created) - that's a sure fire way to break an alliance.

Hope that helps.

 

[H Tower]

let me guess, you have MGE. f!rax!s made the ai much more aggresive in MGE than it was before. so if you want even a slim chance for the ai to like your civ, you should program in FW. or you could turn off talking in your scenario, that way they could never break the alliance.

 

[Morten Blaabjerg]

Turning off negotiation events-wise is a very bad way to do it. Not only do you risk turning the "fixed" alliance into a fixed war, if "valid pretext" is given, i.e. one of either sides diplomats do something dirty, but you also spoil any multiplayer potential your scen might have. -Believe me, there are people who play mp scenarios! And without negotiation, there isn't much fun in playing mp.

But what koba said was right. Especially the different continent part. Also bigger civs tend to ally with lesser, advanced civs, while they quickly turn against their immediate competitors.

 

[kobayashi]

Yeah. I always do my scenarios in FW. Besides HTower's comments, you get a wider audience. MGE users can still play FW, even in multi-player games. And you don't have to keep sticking the CD in everytime you run Civ2.

What do you lose in FW?

1. Terrain civpedia entries - a shame
2. Description files - practically nobody bothers to update these and they just use the civpedia files anyway.
3. Some space in the events file.

 

[Andrew Livings]

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?threadid=10377

 

[H Tower]

it was only an option, besides, most scenarios have a multiplayer events file attached to them now so that they can be played as a mulitplayer game.

oh yeah, that link doesn't work for me, but it might be that poly is down right now

 

[allan]

Thanks. Now how do you forbid negotiations? I can't seem to figure that one out....

It's a pity I have to resort to that, but the nature of my scenario experiment (a large civ empire on a random map split into parts in the age of stealth, with two very vengeful formerly-conquered civs (Vikings and Romans), and former "colonies" (newer-founded cities of the original empire) allied with the original empire (the Spanish) against these revitalized and very aggressive civs (the conquered Viking empire was very large and was now revitalized in a fundy revolution, and the Romans are their democratic proxy)) requires that these civs share continents. Could I make negotiations available by event only (say when a specific city is captured), but not at any other time?

BTW, this is merely an experimental scenario, nothing I'd bother to release, since it springs from my first really succesful game at king level.... I wanted to split my huge Spanish empire into parts and see what would happen.

Another question: is there a possible action that could make cities change hands by revolution, or do I need to set up the cities as they would be post-revolution at the scenario start? I thought it might be cool to show the Vikings revolting in the first turn of the game (they still had one city previously, so the player could choose to play them if he wanted to). Government switching would be prohibited btw.

 

[oryx]

Use the NEGOTIATION trigger. This is the standard method of keeping tribes at war or in alliance perpetually. It prevents all contact between the tribes, so they can't make peace or break alliances. Note that you have code it in both directions.

EXAMPLE

@IF
NEGOTIATION
talker=Frenchmen
talkertype=Computer
listener=Mission Indians
listenertype=Computer
@THEN
@ENDIF

@IF
NEGOTIATION
talker=Mission Indians
talkertype=Computer
listener=Frenchmen
listenertype=Computer
@THEN
@ENDIF

The listenertype and talkertype have 3 values

• Computer
• Human
• HumanorComputer

That way you can partially allow or block contact depending on whether the tribe is played by a human or computer.

 

[Morten Blaabjerg]

I posted the whole lot of the Civ2 events guide in this forum not so long ago, if that's any additional help. I s'pose it's a little down on the list now.