[R&F] What class of ship is De Zeven Provinciën really is?

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

Is it Ships of the Line? or Is it Galleon? surely it is mighter than Frigate (which Firaxis called Ships of the Line that way while in reality the two ships are different, Ships of the Lines are slow but strong and mighty) but the rigging looks alot like Renaissance Galleon rather than Enlightenment Era warships.
And what's the name of warship designs commonly seen in the Enlightenment Era?

 

[Naeshar]

I am no naval enthusiast, but the game considers it a replacement of Frigate. A stronger and not very earlier one.

Quick Wikipedia search resulted in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Zeven_Provinciën-class_cruiser however this leads to a modern cruiser. More likely the Civ6 version refers to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_ship_De_Zeven_Provinciën_(1665) . Apparently the ship was supposed to be one of many ship-of-the-lines, however as it was the flagship it is known best and a replica stood in the Batavia docks.

 

[Uberfrog]

The real ship was an early ship of the line. By the 1660s, the Dutch and the English were blasting each other's ships to pieces in lines of battle, and ship designs developed with those tactics in mind.

By the later British Royal Navy rating system, with 80 guns she would have been a third rate ship-of-the-line.

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

The real ship was an early ship of the line. By the 1660s, the Dutch and the English were blasting each other's ships to pieces in lines of battle, and ship designs developed with those tactics in mind.

By the later British Royal Navy rating system, with 80 guns she would have been a third rate ship-of-the-line.

Which means De Zeven Provincien was evolved from Galleons because it looked like Galleons elongated.?

 

[Uberfrog]

Which means De Zeven Provincien was evolved from Galleons because it looked like Galleons elongated.?

Someone with a superior knowledge of maritime history and ship construction should swoop in here with the details.

But yes, insofar as galleons and ships of the line represented the heaviest warships in the early and late part of the Age of Sail respectively, I think one can argue for an evolution of one into the other, with DZP being an early example of the latter design.

The adoption of lines of battle as the predominant tactic led to a a shift away from the characteristic image of a galleon towards a longer ship with shorter castles to maximise the power of the broadside.

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

Someone with a superior knowledge of maritime history and ship construction should swoop in here with the details.

But yes, insofar as galleons and ships of the line represented the heaviest warships in the early and late part of the Age of Sail respectively, I think one can argue for an evolution of one into the other, with DZP being an early example of the latter design.

The adoption of lines of battle as the predominant tactic led to a a shift away from the characteristic image of a galleon towards a longer ship with shorter castles to maximise the power of the broadside.

^ That person is gonna be Boris.

 

[Naeshar]

There was a heavy "world of warships" discussion in this forum thread: https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/enlightenment-era.651890/

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

^ I never have enough of it. since Wikipedia might not provide correct informations towards unit lists and modding potentials. also the discussion isn't 'complete' yet, nor De Zeven Provincien joined the discussions yet.
In 'Warfare Expanded For Moar' mod there were four class of warships;
- Naval Melee
- Naval Ranged (Which cruiser belongs to)
- Naval Bombard (More correctly 'Battleships') since the actual (dreadnough) battleship is here, also available is 'Pre Dreadnough', also Ships of the Line is generic unit of this class. (did the 'bombardment damage' (raw, non upgraded) deals more damage to ships than ranged ones?
- Naval Raider

This concepts along with promotions is being ported into my mod (second version) as well though it is still WIP (Since I choose the class name 'Battleship' instead with the final upgrades planned to be a 'Near future Battleship' (being Battle Carrier with railgun and missile capability, also comes AFTER Missile Cruiser, this unit will have more futuristic designs beyond final upgrade Iowa.

http://www.shipschematics.net/yamato/images/edf/battleship_yamato.jpg

Something that looks like Leiji Matsumoto's Yamato but not a spacefaring vessel , Zummwalt hull had a stability problem so I ain't gonna use it

oh this went abit too far of my focus. particularly in the fields of Age of Sail Ships of the Line designs (And some disagreements where should this unit appears? Late Renaissance (De Zeven Provincien) or Early Industry (First Rate Three Deckers like HMS Victory) )

De Zeven Provincien didn't have these front triangle sails YET, nor it is so distince to Galleons. (and galleons were BIG!, English defense fleet intended to meet up with Spanish Armada had fifty gun galleons--the race built that's not only faster but packs more and heavier punch than Spanish galleons built a decade earlier)

 

[Uberfrog]

^ I never have enough of it. since Wikipedia might not provide correct informations towards unit lists and modding potentials. also the discussion isn't 'complete' yet, nor De Zeven Provincien joined the discussions yet.
In 'Warfare Expanded For Moar' mod there were four class of warships;
- Naval Melee
- Naval Ranged (Which cruiser belongs to)
- Naval Bombard (More correctly 'Battleships') since the actual (dreadnough) battleship is here, also available is 'Pre Dreadnough', also Ships of the Line is generic unit of this class. (did the 'bombardment damage' (raw, non upgraded) deals more damage to ships than ranged ones?
- Naval Raider

This concepts along with promotions is being ported into my mod (second version) as well though it is still WIP (Since I choose the class name 'Battleship' instead with the final upgrades planned to be a 'Near future Battleship' (being Battle Carrier with railgun and missile capability, also comes AFTER Missile Cruiser, this unit will have more futuristic designs beyond final upgrade Iowa.

http://www.shipschematics.net/yamato/images/edf/battleship_yamato.jpg

Something that looks like Leiji Matsumoto's Yamato but not a spacefaring vessel , Zummwalt hull had a stability problem so I ain't gonna use it

oh this went abit too far of my focus. particularly in the fields of Age of Sail Ships of the Line designs (And some disagreements where should this unit appears? Late Renaissance (De Zeven Provincien) or Early Industry (First Rate Three Deckers like HMS Victory) )
View attachment 548175

De Zeven Provincien didn't have these front triangle sails YET, nor it is so distince to Galleons. (and galleons were BIG!, English defense fleet intended to meet up with Spanish Armada had fifty gun galleons--the race built that's not only faster but packs more and heavier punch than Spanish galleons built a decade earlier)

Judging from the available drawings and models, De Zeven Provinciën seems to resemble the Prince Royal most in design. Indeed, both ships fought in the Four Days Battle of 1666 when the Dutch captured and destroyed the 56-year-old Prince Royal, which by this time had been refitted as a first-rate ship of the line.

 

[Cerilis]

Someone with a superior knowledge of maritime history and ship construction should swoop in here with the details.

Damn I thought you made a pun there, but I messed up swoop with sloop.