What to build at the start

[JanissaryRush]

Worker, than settler if Civ has Minning.
Warrior than worker, than settler if not.

 

[killmeplease]

i play at marathon speed too
in BTS there are 'forest starts' occur frequently so workers usually have a lot of job. in addition to this, there is no point in city growth when there are only forest tiles surrounding. so building worker, than chopping worker and then some warriors and a settler is most productive tactics.
of course if there is a seafood available, building workboats is preferable.

 

[Balderstrom]

@ MikeUK: As you can see from the various responses, what to build at the very beginning varies on nearby resources, Leader and gamespeed (to a lesser degree).
* Seafood: Workboat
* Gold: Worker
* LandFood: Possibly Worker

The Leader/CIV will vary what your starting tech's are.
1) Look at what you need to improve
2) Do you have that tech yet?
3) If not how long will it take to get?

Answering those questions will help you decide whether a Worker or Warrior/Scout should be next.

If you've explored and know where you want to place your second city,
1) Is it close enough that the Settler doesn't need an escort?
2) Is it far enough to risk sending the Settler without an escort?
3) Approximate how many turns before you will have another settler
4) If you deem it should have an escort, build the warrior first.

Honestly I really don't believe there is an absolute right and wrong way to start, but there is definitely a set of good practices to follow.

 

[AfterShafter]

You know, the poor guy has so many mixed messages on what to build first from this thread... The moral of the story? Experiment a bit and find your groove. Seems everyone prefers something a bit different.

 

[Gumbolt]

Erm usually worker worker settler. If i have a good food tile nearby providing 3 food i grow city to size 2 and build a warrior or something till city reaches size 2.

I think in some cases with imperialist leader its worth settler straight off.

Having looked at one of Mikes previous saves I think his growth was staunted by lack of workers and settlers early on. Plus a lack of bronzeworking tech early on and chopping of forest.

I wouldnt worry about too many workers or settlers early on. I try to have 6 workers to 4 cities early on before 1800bc ish. The excess workers can then be used to work on new cities you build.

if your worried about city growth set one city to pump out settlers so the rest can grow. on the flip side theres no point having fast growing cities if you dont have the workers to chop the forest, work the food resources and build cottages so your cities can make the most of the land they have.

End of day find the quickest way to develop 3-5 cities. Then develop the land and if you can keep science above 30-50% keep building settlers or try to attack a neighbouring AI for cities.

Why dont you start a game. Post starting year here. Play game to 2000bc then ask for a critique!!

 

[ShadyCharacter]

I agree with AfterShafter and Balderstorm, it comes down to player style, experimenting, and who you're playing. For example, if you're playing as the Romans and don't start on the coast, then building a worker first would be the best route in order to utilize the imperialistic trait by building mines. If you happen to start on the coast with a seafood resource, then it's basically up to you to decide on a workboat or a worker. I usually go with workboats since the commerce helps, too.

 

[DrewBledsoe]

I play marathon too...and well it depends. If you have an improvement that can be made immediately,then a worker really is generally best. If you have work boats to build, then one of those first is the order of the day, but often working say a plains/forest hill with no growth for a very fast workboat is far better than using say a grassland/forest (work it out yourself, but you have to take into account that you may be then using said seafood resource to get a fast worker (while picking up a nice bonus early commerce), still at size 1...trust me it gets a bit complicated, but hey thats why Civ is so replyable

After a worker (well definitely before a settler) I always build a barracks in the cap (sometimes swapping to a worker at size 2 or so). Its just a personal rule, I don't believe you should be able to build troops without a barracks and never do so myself. It works quite well though, as playing at high lvls, the promotions give you the edge over the barbarian hoard which will very soon be on its way

To the OP, experiment. Play to the civs strengths. If anyone tries to state that a certain starting build order is ALWAYS the best, they are talking out of their ass, and don't really understand Civ...

 

[omnimutant]

As mentioned Earlier the Bets thing to do is fined what fits your play style the best. Also everything usually changes (and should) Based upon your Start location/Starting Techs/ and Resources available.

I do try and strive for a system though.(I play Marathon as well)

When ever Possible I like:
Worker/Workboat (depending on coastal tiles)
Worker
Worker if I can chop yet / Warrior if Not
Warrior Until BW then Worker
Settler

I like to get a bit more established and work my first city before starting the next. My second city I strive for an Ideal location, which usually requires More techs to uncover Horses/Elephants Iron etc. So I get more time to find the right spot before planting that second city.

Of course everything changes if I pop a worker/warrior or some crazy tech which changes my direction. If I pop Mysticism within the first few turns, I might go for an early religion instead. This would cause me to drop a worker and the extra warriors and build a Monument/Stonehenge.

So as you can see some much is situational, that it's probably best to have a basic idea In mind and then build whats appropriate for each situation.

 

[ICNP]

Good Discussion Guys

1.Worker
2.Warrior

After that it's variable. I tend to just stick to this. It is a lot to think about if you start thinking about tech times and build queues to the turn.

And remember growers! You only get one extra hammer per pop for delaying that worker.

 

[AfterShafter]

And remember growers! You only get one extra hammer per pop for delaying that worker.

Not *entirely* true. The increased knowledge of your surrounding area and likely more tribal villages found (more units, more exploration, more villages) is very tough to gauge the value of. Depending on the area around you, you may end up getting an extra hammer and commerce per turn per square. If you're aiming for Stonehenge too, on higher difficulties, the extra bit of production you have in by the time you're able to chop is sometimes vital to getting it. And if that worker is going to spend a majority of his early existence twiddling his thumbs anyways...

Also, if you're going to do a stasis lock type thing (something I've visited in a thread I did a while back, which I'm a huge fan of, and will revisit again soon in the forum) the extra super early military is absolutely necessary. The extra hammer is just gravy that helps mitigate the time lost

 

[TheMeInTeam]

This guide assumes 30 hammers for chops at Normal speed. Unless you start the game with Mathematics (or get ridiculously lucky with goody huts) then the conclusions drawn by it are not necessarily true any more. Chopping out the second worker and settler will take longer and will be much more detrimental in the long term. Also don't forget that if you lose the settler you're pretty much out of the game. Guarding it with your starting warrior/scout (if he's even alive at that point) won't save him from a bear attack unless you are on a low difficulty level and get a guaranteed win.

I can usually keep the initial guy alive. Anyway, where are you settling that first settler exactly? Unless you're playing deity or something you can expand pretty decently even if that first city is close. Also, if the ai's are really close animals are less of a concern.

Workers and settlers early are almost always optimal, though its good to get a fogbuster out there to know the settling path is safe...

 

[Clam Spammer]

I can usually keep the initial guy alive.

You can't possibly guarantee that. Unless you keep him at home, of course. If you're Aggressive and start with a warrior then you have a better chance, but inevitably sometimes he will get eaten by a bear (or other animal if the RNG favours it).

Anyway, where are you settling that first settler exactly? Unless you're playing deity or something you can expand pretty decently even if that first city is close.

My settler usually goes to a strategic resource spot, depending on availability, early strategy and quality of land. I'm not a big fan of axe rushing but if the opportunity is there I'll go for it. If there is a good grassland river / flood plain / coastal site then that will often take priority over stone/marble/horses. Obviously I won't go too far afield for this - about 7 to 8 tiles max (possible exceptions).

Also, if the ai's are really close animals are less of a concern.

I play with the default number of AIs - they aren't really close.

 

[DrewBledsoe]

You can't possibly guarantee that. Unless you keep him at home, of course. If you're Aggressive and start with a warrior then you have a better chance, but inevitably sometimes he will get eaten by a bear (or other animal if the RNG favours it).

Perfectly put, if you play huge maps marathon, anything Emp or above (probs Monarch even) the odds of your initial scout/warrior surviving to explore a "decent" area are virtually negligable. One game in a few you may get lucky. If Im playing "honest Joe"(i.e. absolutely no reloads whatever) often my scout gets killed by the first lion/panther it gets caught in a non forested tile. Then its click end turn for around 40 turns (after ordering the worker), which is a tad annoying.

Its by then almost pointless building another scout (too many animals, soon to be barb archers etc.), and I wont bother exploring until I have a spare chariot or axe handy....there is a huge amount of luck with that first "explorer unit", excaberated by a marathon time frame , and a huge map.

 

[jackdog]

Worker, settler, warrior (I too like to live dangerously) and then second city often the same with the extra warrior from capital to defend when it gets there. I often only build 3-4 cities and then its, barracks and all axes and swords to take the rest from anyone silly enough to settle next to me. Its very rare I get trounced by a very early barb archer, as the odds from even a single defending warrior ain't too bad, and you can usually quickly whip or chop one, temporarily delaying your settler, if things start to look bad.

 

[Levgre]

Most often

1. Worker
2. Settler
3. Worker

Other times

1.Worker
2.Settler
3.Settler

This tends to be the case if my capital doesn't have a ton of nice tiles to work, and there are cities nearby with nice productive tiles to work.

Sometimes

1.Worker
2.Worker
3.Settler


I build 2 workers first if I have a lot of forest, or if I am playing it safe with expanding.

 

[Rhyshaelkan]

Does playing marathon have any effect on how many resources are generated by chopping?

If unit turns on marathon = 2 then that is hammers = 2
If forest chop on marathon = 1 & chop turns = 3
then start = slow with more forests chopped for less gain

 

[oranges]

Does playing marathon have any effect on how many resources are generated by chopping?

Yes, I think you get 60 hammers from a forest within BFC before math and 90 after, less if it is outside.

 

[Rhyshaelkan]

Sweet, then many of the chop/start strategies would still work.

 

[Balderstrom]

I generally prefer Epic, the numbers seem more in line.
Whereas Marathon seems a bit squirrelly with what is x2 or x3 or x4
Pretty much everything in Epic is 1.5, except Golden Ages 1.25

 

[Rhyshaelkan]

The nice thing about epic and marathon games. Wars, wars, wars!! Movement rate vs. turns is finally at an acceptable level in my opinion.