When do you pick the God-King Pantheon?

[Gothic_Empire]

I'm giving it a shot in a multiplayer spain game, where I intend to conquer the world. My thinking is that, since I'll never have competing religions, and most of my cities are going to be puppets, I'll be able to stack a decent amount of yields in my capital as the game goes.

 

[CrazyG]

I think its pretty bad for everyone except Spain. So I would choose it as Spain, but not every time.

The AI does really well with it though.

 

[tu_79]

Byzantium has a guaranteed religion and lots of faith points from its ub. If you ever intend to spread Byzantium religion, God King sounds good enough, since it's weaknesses are covered.

 

[Enginseer]

India pretty based with it since the downfall of God-King is that your yields only grow with the number of followers. Since India starts with a pantheon all of her cities will already form followers and contribute toward that number.

 

[Stalker0]

If I’m playing Persia, and the 300 soundtrack comes on my headphones...well then it’s the only pantheon for me

 

[Kim Dong Un]

I don't think I've ever chosen it, post nerf.

 

[CrazyG]

India pretty based with it since the downfall of God-King is that your yields only grow with the number of followers. Since India starts with a pantheon all of her cities will already form followers and contribute toward that number.

God King is a pointless pantheon to get on turn one because you don't have enough followers to get a bonus yet. When you choose a pantheon, any cities you've already founded will get that pantheon. And any cities you found afterwards get the pantheon too, India's UA doesn't add any benefits.

 

[Enginseer]

God King is a pointless pantheon to get on turn one because you don't have enough followers to get a bonus yet. When you choose a pantheon, any cities you've already founded will get that pantheon. And any cities you found afterwards get the pantheon too, India's UA doesn't add any benefits.

Oh right the bonuses only works in owned cities now...

 

[TranceBlossom]

I tried using the God-King pantheon as Spain in two standard Emperor games with the following results:

1) Tradition, four cities, rushed shrine first every city
Result: scraped by, founding the absolute last religion, but had really awful choices for beliefs. I discovered the coast i was on was blocked off from the ocean by ice and thus had no real naval connection and restarted.

2) Progress, six cities, rushed shrine first every city
Result: Was beaten to founding a religion by the AI

I'm not sure what civs were in the second game, the two on my continent were Denmark and Germany. Neither game had ancient ruins turned on or religious CSs nearby.

At the risk of coming across as "I lost and therefore the game should be changed to accommodate me"...it seems kind of silly to me that Spain, a Civ with faith AND food bonuses, can't found consistently and definitely not easily with God-King, a pantheon that seems to me to be geared toward civs with early growth. I suppose from a balance perspective, the benefits scale over the game and thus a weak/risky start might be the trade-off, but if Spain can't consistently found a religion with this pantheon, there's no way in hell a non-religious civ would ever be able to. The faith output is just way too low. I really want to play Spain with this pantheon because it seems like it'd have great synergy, but it looks like building Stonehenge is the only way to make it happen consistently, which for a religious civ like Spain seems just plain silly.

 

[CrazyG]

I suppose from a balance perspective, the benefits scale over the game and thus a weak/risky start might be the trade-off, but if Spain can't consistently found a religion with this pantheon, there's no way in hell a non-religious civ would ever be able to. I really want to play Spain with this pantheon because it seems like it'd have great synergy, but it looks like building Stonehenge is the only way to make it happen consistently, which for a religious civ like Spain seems just plain silly.

What is interesting to me is that the AI gets religion with it pretty often as non-religious civs, and the AI tends to perform extremely well with it.

The best way to found with it is probably getting tribute from religious city states or a faith wonder. However, just because you can get a religion with it doesn't mean that you should. I've tested it with Ethiopia and Byzantium, and I found that the missing early yields really impacted my early game.

 

[Minh Le]

I've tested it with Ethiopia and Byzantium, and I found that the missing early yields really impacted my early game.

Agree. Thats why GOAC is so good .

 

[TranceBlossom]

What is interesting to me is that the AI gets religion with it pretty often as non-religious civs, and the AI tends to perform extremely well with it.

The best way to found with it is probably getting tribute from religious city states or a faith wonder. However, just because you can get a religion with it doesn't mean that you should. I've tested it with Ethiopia and Byzantium, and I found that the missing early yields really impacted my early game.

If it's hard to found with without tributing even as Spain, and yield-wise it isn't that strong anyway, should it be buffed? But then would the AI get out-of-control OP with it? Or is it just high-early game risk for high mid-late game reward?

I'm curious what exactly the AI is doing to succeed with it that humans (or at least me) aren't doing.

 

[Gothic_Empire]

Yeah, Spain is the one time I've looked at God-King and said, "this will work" -- and it was really underwhelming in an otherwise stellar game.

 

[BiteInTheMark]

I don't think it's so easily possible to make a judgment that God king picking civs are overperforming. I see it picked often by religious civs, which can compensate the relative low faith output by their UA. Civs, which found a religion regularly and with it, definitely have an advantage over civs which doesn't found.
You need a lot of population to get enough benefits from it and playing it with only 4 cities its the best way to fail with it. It's one of the best pantheons if you want to go wide warmonger with lot of puppets, cause puppets would decrease other, local benefit pantheons. I see God-king as a pretty good pantheon for India, the effect is immidiatly there and doesn't need any improvements or buildings (you have to research first). The extra growth by the UA can create more follower and the high pressure deny the access of other religions to your cities. Pretty good in mid and late game.
I think an additional tiny buff like +2 faith in capital instead of +1 would be nice.

 

[Jarula]

God-King is totally my fave pantheon if it turns into a religion.

 

[chicorbeef]

I think God-King needs a bit of a kick-off, it scales nicely but it takes forever. Like if I got 2 of every yield it provides off the bat in my Capital or something. We could even adjust the scaling to be 1 per 6 again that way.

 

[BiteInTheMark]

I think God-King needs a bit of a kick-off, it scales nicely but it takes forever. Like if I got 2 of every yield it provides off the bat in my Capital or something. We could even adjust the scaling to be 1 per 6 again that way.

I think changing the scaler back from 1:5 to 1:6 but count the population instead of the follower would help for the early stage, cause you always have 1 or 2 less follower than population in your cities. This gap is in early stage with only 4-8 population cities relative big, while it's only minor in late game. This would push the early game a bit while it should stay the same for the late game.

 

[Stalker0]

I think changing the scaler back from 1:5 to 1:6 but count the population instead of the follower would help for the early stage, cause you always have 1 or 2 less follower than population in your cities. This gap is in early stage with only 4-8 population cities relative big, while it's only minor in late game. This would push the early game a bit while it should stay the same for the late game.

This makes good sense to me. And besides, your the god-king....whether your people "follow" you or not is irrelevant, you still own them!