[R&F] When will we get a AI overhaul mod?

[ThunderLizard2]

Holding off until someone fixes the AI. Any progress on getting an overhaul mod like Vox Populi?

 

[AmazonQueen]

Holding off until someone fixes the AI. Any progress on getting an overhaul mod like Vox Populi?

Judging by Civ V over a year after the 2nd expansion if there is one. I think its poremature to expect a major overhaul mod yet.

 

[Gedemon]

Holding off until someone fixes the AI. Any progress on getting an overhaul mod like Vox Populi?

You'll have to wait some months/years after the release of the source code for that.

Source code which is not released yet, and no ETA has been given from Firaxis.

 

[Aristos]

You'll have to wait some months/years after the release of the source code for that.

Source code which is not released yet, and no ETA has been given from Firaxis.

Something tells me they won't this time around... call it intuition if you want. (I would call it something else, given that my personal observation is that modders put Firaxis to shame, especially in the AI department... and who likes to be ashamed?).

 

[tzu]

I'm uncertain, whether bringing up the category of shame helps to provide the source code to the community.

(I also don't like the shown priorities personally.)

call it intuition if you want

No, I don't want to call it intuition. If you are right, I want to call it 'self-fulfilling prophesy'.

 

[Leyrann]

When people start making it.

I'd say, go ahead.

 

[Ryika]

Be the change you want to see in the world.

 

[ThunderLizard2]

So maybe 2021?

 

[Ryika]

Well if you start now, then you've got a bit more than 2 years 'till 2021, I'd say that's more than enough time to get some actual improvements.

Moderator Action: Please do not troll the forums. leif
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[ashendashin]

Be the change you want to see in the world.

Did you read the above posts? Do you want this guy to force access to the source code? I think that's a tad bit more involved.

Firaxis is well aware of the desire for its release. They said they've done so in the past...a year or 2 ago.

 

[Aristos]

Did you read the above posts? Do you want this guy to force access to the source code? I think that's a tad bit more involved.

Hacker-modders, the new breed. I like your idea.

 

[Ryika]

Did you read the above posts? Do you want this guy to force access to the source code? I think that's a tad bit more involved.

While DLL-access is required to make changes to core AI behavior, it is not required to begin making AI improvements. There were very popular mods for Civ V that did nothing but to make changes to AI Flavors to make them prioritize things better.

 

[ashendashin]

While DLL-access is required to make changes to core AI behavior, it is not required to begin making AI improvements. There were very popular mods for Civ V that did nothing but to make changes to AI Flavors to make them prioritize things better.

Nothing on VP's scale. Flavors aren't a good way to tune an AI that barely works in the first place (or at all in many cases). For Civ6 there's AI+ and that guy wanted a DLL too. Back when he was working on it anyhow.

 

[Aristos]

While DLL-access is required to make changes to core AI behavior, it is not required to begin making AI improvements. There were very popular mods for Civ V that did nothing but to make changes to AI Flavors to make them prioritize things better.

Naahh... Civ 6 AI is in ICU, and the only hope for saving it is access to the dll. No amount of "flavor-magic" can save it. I will give you one simple, yet almost-game-breaking example: the standard Wide-Spaceport AI strategy. They build spaceports everywhere, a clear wide strat, and I can destroy them all, one by one, with my super-spies, while I build my SV in my one and only, well defended SP in my Magnus centralized industrial powerhouse. Every-single-time. Their SP-wide strat makes it impossible for the AI to defend them all, so they loose them all, while I cruise to victory. Has never failed me, not in Deity nor any other level.

That type of disaster cannot be "flavor-fixed". Some genius at FXS thought a SP-wide strat was undefeatable, so they hard coded that into the dll. Well, guess what?

 

[Leyrann]

Nothing on VP's scale. Flavors aren't a good way to tune an AI that barely works in the first place (or at all in many cases). For Civ6 there's AI+ and that guy wanted a DLL too. Back when he was working on it anyhow.

RF Flavor Deity does a lot to improve the AI.

 

[ashendashin]

RF Flavor Deity does a lot to improve the AI.

I'm sure it helps give them less chaotic build orders and such so their insane bonuses get put to use, yeah. Can't say I find that interesting though.

 

[tzu]

Firaxis is well aware of the desire for its release.

Of course they are! Being mute doesn't mean being deaf ...

2K published on Jul 19, 2018 :
"""Firaxis Games and 2K are committed to making Civilization VI the best experience possible and will continue to support the title. [...] Stay Civilized!"""

Maybe I am naive, but for me, being 'committed to making Civilization VI the best experience possible' simply implies (finally) the release of the DLL source code to the community. Beyond all flaws of the official version the best experience needs full access for modders - one of the greatest, if not THE greatest, strengths of Civilization is its traditional ability to be modified to the likes of each customer.

For Civ6 there's AI+ and that guy wanted a DLL too. Back when he was working on it anyhow.

As I understand it, Siesta Guru still wants it and is just waiting for its arrival. Cf. also to "None of the pathways modders have to make units move using lua work well. This isn't relevant for the base game, but heavily limits what modders can do"

 

[Leyrann]

I'm sure it helps give them less chaotic build orders and such so their insane bonuses get put to use, yeah. Can't say I find that interesting though.

So do you want a better AI or not? Because RF Flavor Deity shows that the AI really isn't all that bad; it just builds stuff it shouldn't build and doesn't build stuff it should build.

 

[ashendashin]

So do you want a better AI or not? Because RF Flavor Deity shows that the AI really isn't all that bad; it just builds stuff it shouldn't build and doesn't build stuff it should build.

Not about to get into that again with you. Strictly speaking this thread is about getting the AI fixed. Adjusting flavors is akin to putting a band-aid on it.
There's a long partial list Siesta Guru made about the AIs faults if you wanna see if any bits were crossed off yet. I don't give enough attention to Civ6 to go beyond my observations in the community.

 

[Ryika]

Not about to get into that again with you. Strictly speaking this thread is about getting the AI fixed. Adjusting flavors is akin to putting a band-aid on it.

DLL changes are also nothing but band-aids, just stronger ones. It's not like you're suddenly magically free from all resource limitations; you're making an artificial distinction where there is no actual distinction.