Why is a medieval unit beating the crap out of my guerrilia?

[Lonkut]

Why is the guerrilia beign beaten by a 4.2 (attack and deffense) medieval unit? I know about the battle probabilities in the manual but isn't this a little extreme? A guerrilia should not loose not even a bar against the 4.2, so what might be the reasons?
And whats the point in fortifing units?

 

[genghis_khev]

Scan the forums and you'll see many a thread about the Random Number Generator and weird combat results!

 

[ronok]

Spearmen are known to beat Mechanized Infantry, anything can happen in this game.

 

[zurichuk]

my worst was a few days ago in the WW2 conquest, i lost a 4hp 13-6 (?) tank to a 4hp 1-2 (?) flak, i had the save ready to post here as evidence and guess what, preserve random seed is switched off in the Conquests

 

[Lonkut]

I understand once or twice, but every single turn? they should really make some adjustments. Because whats the point in researching units when ancient and the less powerful can beat them.

 

[MSTK]

No, it's completely random.

Go to the Combat Calculator and see your chances on winning. There are slim chances, and you just rolled a bad dice

 

[Pfeffersack]

About WW2 conquest...tanks are here not as powerful as in standard games...there attack value(especially of light tanks) is much closer to the defense valuesof the other units.Add rough terrain or a fortified defender or a river...

Generally its just bad luck...however there is an easy way to reduce the influence of luck with the editor - simply doubling the hitpoints of every rank (conscript=4, regular=6 and so on) .The only thing to adjust for balance is to double all so the ROFs for every unit capable of bombardment.

I have tested this in one version of my modified WW2 pacific conquest,which can be found here (just if anyone wants to see the effects of doubled hitpoints):

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=85902

 

[socralynnek]

Lonkut, would you be happy if the "newer" units win all of the time; when you are alittle backward than BANG the game is over?
And the RNG is perfect, because if something is supposed to happen 10% of the time than it will happen 10% of the time.
One can discuss if the stats are good, so maybe Guerrillas should have 8.8 instead of 6.6...
The reason for weaker units being able to beat newer ones is playability!

And fortifying increases your chances by 25 %. (And it works!)

 

[Siv]

If attacking a unit that is inside a city - the defending unit recieves a bonus depending on the size of the city. The bigger the city the bigger the bonus

 

[Masquerouge]

I understand once or twice, but every single turn? they should really make some adjustments. Because whats the point in researching units when ancient and the less powerful can beat them.

What do you mean, every turn ? Are you implying that you lost guerrilla to med. infantry for several turns in a row ? That's unlucky.

Do you have a save, by any chance ?

 

[warpstorm]

Did you save and reload? Did you have preserve arndom seed on? Were you the attacker or the defender? If they were the defender, were they fortified in a city?

 

[Dell19]

A guerrilla has 6 attack and 6 defence so its not that suprising that a unit with 4 attack would win a reasonable amount of times when attacking and on defensive terrain it might win occasionally as well.

 

[Lonkut]

They kill one every several turns but they make some serious damage. I can't even attack because they beat my troops. And no random seed is off.

 

[Dell19]

If you have a stack of say 10 guerillas and send them out to attack 10 medieval infantry you will win overall. You cannot expect one reasonably modern unit to wipe out medieval units just because its from a different era and alsowhen comparing stats they really aren't that strong so using cavalry with defensive units is probably a better strategy since cavalry and guerillas have the same attack strength but cavalry have 2 extra movement points and can retreat.

 

[Lonkut]

I guess I have to deal with it and try to become a better player. And as somebody put it the game would be unbalanced if modern units can bead medieval units all the time. It would be too easy. THNX guys for your responses.

 

[Dell19]

At least you are not losing guerillas to spearmen...

 

[genghis_khev]

But you will loose at least one MA to a spearman!

 

[waldoa]

I see it differently than a lot of you. No spearman or medieval unit should be beating mech inf. because 1)a machine gun, properly supplied with ammo, will mow down hundreds of people before being overrun if the other side has no firearms and 2)the weapons of spearmen and med inf., a metal tipped spear and a ball and chain respectively, would have absolutely no effect against the reinforced armor of a mech inf. You couldn't even get it through the window of one of these vehicles. And as for the guerilla- it's feasible that he may eventually be overrun, but med inf. have to be at point blank range and I assume any half decent shot should be able to kill a guy moving slow in heavy metal armor with an AK before he got to him.
For those reasons, I'm really in favor of adjusting the combat scaling so that it is much more unlikely for units from a lower era to effectively compete with those above.
Hey, it's why horses weren't much used after WWI- they died too easily and motorized transport and weaponry basically made them obsolete

 

[Dell19]

Are you putting too much emphasis on realism rather than gameplay? Sure in practice modern units would almost always win, there might be exceptions with stolen weapons and asking what a spearmen unit really represents in the modern age, but in a game it wouldn't be much fun to be the first to research a powerful unit and then be able to take over the world. Wouldn't that be even more unrealistic? Also whilst you may be comparing machine guns against other weapons we could also compare organised armies like legions. Shouldn't the Roman UU have double the stats of all other units of the era so that the Romans can show how amazing their armies were?

 

[dgfred]

Everyone should know the Medieval Infantry can all!!! . Look

at my avatar! . Fear the ball and chain!