why no Iron man setting?

[Fabio1701]

I saw alrwdy that people are sharing saved games to collect all the steam achievments. This is severely depressing. What is the point of them if its not a way of comparing players progress? when I discovered this was going on in civ5 after working really hard to get all the achievements i simply quit playing. (I got to 80ish %).

CK2 has an iron man mode so that this kind of achievements cheating doesn't happen, and that game is much more complex than civ6. so why cant it be included in civ6? as it stands I really have trouble caring when I got an achievement which is a terrible shame of an entire dimension of the game.

 

[Leyrann]

Well, you know that you got all your achievements the honest way, while those other guys, yeah, they just cheated their way there. I'd feel proud instead of annoyed...

 

[Zuizgond]

You seriously think steam achievements are a way to show how good people are at a game?

 

[kamex]

If people want to cheat or use exploits that's up to them. For example some people loved using the now deprecated Scythian horse economy. Some people like to use the Kongo Reliquaries bug that's still present. I look down on those players personally but each to their own, all you can do is not take advantage of it yourself. Its mostly a single player game so if you cheat you're only cheating yourself long term.

 

[4N4C0ND4]

The only time I cheated on civ v was for a religious achievement that was bugged...

Btw does the op consider using other map seeds in civ6 cheating or not?

 

[youngsteve]

I always though achievements were set up so people could challenge themselves in getting targets. It is very sad people need to cheat to achieve them, so they can show off. Unfortunately, this is true on all game forums.

As for Ironman, you only need to look at the Paradox game EU4 to see the effects of only having achievements for it, with the easiest achievement, getting a RM, only achieved by 22% of players, as the vast majority don't use it.

 

[johnnyfoodstamp]

I can never understand why people think they have to micromanage how other people play video games. We all paid our money and we can play the game any way we want. Pretty simple concept.

 

[kamex]

I can never understand why people think they have to micromanage how other people play video games. We all paid our money and we can play the game any way we want. Pretty simple concept.

I think the OP is saying he thinks that achievements are designed or should be used to "compare player skill" - although this isn't true of Civ VI nor most other games with achievements. If you want to play something 'competitive' try League of Legends or something.

 

[johnnyfoodstamp]

I think the OP is saying he thinks that achievements are designed or should be used to "compare player skill" - although this isn't true of Civ VI nor most other games with achievements. If you want to play something 'competitive' try League of Legends or something.

Yeah, I never thought of the achievements as something competitive. I hardly pay attention to them myself. If I happen to unlock one in a game Im playing I'll check it out after the round but that's about it.

 

[Browd]

If you want to measure player skill, achievements are (for the reasons discussed above) irrelevant. Either play MP (to test your skill vs. other human players head-to-head) or, for single player comparisons, participate in the Game of the Month and Hall of Fame competitions.

 

[FurballRocker]

Achievements are simply a cheap way to add replay-ability to games by playing on the kleptomaniac in us or to add an extra challenge if you want it to fulfill your own need to achieve goals. Games companies want to make them into a big thing though as it helps to sell their products and even include the silly limitation that you can't gain them using mods to make them seem more 'elite' and pander to some peoples need to prove their own self worth. The limitation is simply a marketing strategy especially when considering you can just download a save to get them.

About the only thing actually they tend to prove, assuming you haven't just downloaded a save, is how bored you were or how shallow the actual game is.

At the risk of sounding insulting, when it comes to uproar about people downloading saves to get achievements i always wonder who to feel the most sad for. The person who feels the need to take the time to download a save to get a set of meaningless achievements or the person who feels that someone 'stealing' their achievements somehow affects their own self worth.

No one really cares what achievements you do or don't have as it is not going to change the world or even your life and in the vast majority of instances they aren't even going to change the game.
In the few instances where game play features are gated behind achievements i applaud people who share there saves because they hopefully enjoyed doing them and are passing them on to improve the enjoyment of the game for people who don't want to be forced to do them to get the full game play experience..

Having said all that i am not saying achievements are necessarily a totally bad thing and i have enjoyed the challenge of getting some of them in games but i only do the ones i enjoy doing and suit my enjoyment of the time spent on them because i play games to enjoy them, not to prove myself to anybody else and if there is some game play aspect gated behind an achievement i don't want to do because i find it boring or not fitting of my enjoyment of the game then i will download a save or use a mod to get it.

 

[Lynnes]

Iron man mode, disabled achievements in modded or in MP-games (how it unfortunately was the case in Civ5)... all of this is completely useless when it comes to preventing people from cheating achievements.
There are tools out there that easily let you add or remove any achievement to your steam account with a single click. You don't even have to start the game, let alone playing it.
So yeah, the savegame-collectors should be the least of your worries.

That's why I'm glad that Firaxis refrained from deactivating achievements under certain circumstances (Mods, MP) this time, because as it usually is the case: It would only hurt the honest players, while cheaters get them anyway.
I enjoy achievements a lot, for me they add a lot of replay value, especially for a game like Civ, where you don't have any other kind of progress between the game sessions (no campaign, story or whatever).

 

[c4c6]

In the few instances where game play features are gated behind achievements i applaud people who share there saves because they hopefully enjoyed doing them and are passing them on to improve the enjoyment of the game for people who don't want to be forced to do them to get the full game play experience..

I don't care about such "achievements". And the idea I, as a free man, "could be forced" to download obscure saves in order to get any regular game play feature makes me infinitely sad.

 

[FurballRocker]

I don't care about such "achievements". And the idea I, as a free man, "could be forced" to download obscure saves in order to get any regular game play feature makes me infinitely sad.

The concept of being forced can often be taken too literally and in the context it obviously means having no other choice but to do something you won't enjoy if you want to obtain the feature rather than having no other choice, period.

With that in mind people do have a choice which is go to the effort of obtaining it and not enjoying the experience or not and in such cases if there is an easy option then that only serves to increase the enjoyment of the game or really to prevent the lack of enjoyment of the game from the only option to obtain it being not enjoyable.

In cases where there is no other option than to partake in the not enjoyable content to get to the feature then it is considered none content to me and a lesson learned in the sense that i likely won't buy further games from the franchise and possibly won't buy further games from the game creator as such (uninteresting to me) concepts often get passed from one game to another.

 

[iammaxhailme]

I used a game save to get a few civ 6 achievments because the achievments are bugged and don't trigger half the time.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

In the current state of the game, creating an "ironman mode" would be disingenuous. It's disingenuous in the Paradox games too (and ironman is trivially cheated in those games btw), a one-way covenant to punish you for the game's myriad bugs, hidden rules, and broken UI.

Bringing that into civ 6 before bringing the gameplay out of pre-beta to beta levels would be extra salt inducing.

If someone cheats to get an achievement they're missing the point. If them doing that cheapens it for another player, that second player is also missing the point.

 

[c4c6]

Playing and modding walked for me hand in hand since the beginning (on Commodore PET computers). The possibilities to modify civ4 via Python were for me nothing less than a dream. Such provides endless real achievements for me! I have simply ZERO interest in artificial "achievements".

Until I read this thread, "ironman mode" meant to me playing without reload etc. ... playing, not handling "achievements" ... sorry, that I'm so missing the central point of this thread, too.

In cases where there is no other option than to partake in the not enjoyable content to get to the feature then it is considered none content to me and a lesson learned in the sense that i likely won't buy further games from the franchise and possibly won't buy further games from the game creator as such (uninteresting to me) concepts often get passed from one game to another.

Yes, THIS consequences are what would make me sad.

 

[FurballRocker]

"ironman mode" meant to me playing without reload etc.

That is the way i play ironman mode also because you almost always encounter some sort of bug which can destroy your game or can break the rules (such as xcom where it was common that aliens in cover which should be visible couldn't be seen due to 'angles issues' but could see you and fire on you) or even simply be down to poor UI design such as the way civ likes to jump around while selecting units so it can easily happen that you end up moving the wrong unit.

 

[Victoria]

GOTM runs on trust, a great concept but having seen some of the plays, style and turns someones gotta be cheatin coz there is just way too much luck going on.

The best thing about steam acheivements is the idea behind each of them... So barely jokey thats what they are.

I hate the idea of better and best... They mean jack
I just play and enjoy, knowing you are not the greatest is in my small opinion nicer than thinking you are

I do believe in personal best as a way to drive yourself though

 

[Zaarin]

Wait, you stopped playing...because other people cheated? Reminds me of my college professor who gave the entire class a 0 on a test because two students cheated...

Just enjoy the game: who cares what other people do with it?