Wonders

steviejay

Now in Black and White!!
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ok, you're playing away peacefully and all of a sudden you research a tech and a beautiful looking Scientific Great Leader appears. Now, the question is..... what to use him on??

Leo's Workshop, Bach's, Smiths Trading, Shakespear, Newton and Magellans are all available so which one to go for?

Playing huge map, archipeligo, got 23 cities (20 on my mainland, 3 on other continents) so what do you's think?

which one would you go for?

Steviejay
 
depends on the situation (ie happiness issues etc), but personally i would go for Smiths to save some cash
 
hmmmmmmm.......... money is always good, especially so since I'm not a commercial Civ.......... and I'm sticking to Monarchy cause I'm opening a can of whoop on all the lowly civ's so war weariness ain't really a problem.......... but then...... I'm a seafaring civ so +1 movement would be nice............... :hmm:
 
Depends on situation, but usually choosing like this, i say Bach's.

If you are getting science leaders, that means you are not playing deity/sid since there you cant research yourself. If you are researching yourself, you probably dont have banks (universities instead) and maybe not even market places everywhere. That makes the trading company not needed.

Newtons is nice if you have 1 huge science city, but usually i prefer the wonders that give nation wide benefits.

Shakespeares i dont like at all.

Bach's and sistine i like very much. But hey depend a bit on your city spacing, with small city spacing and thus smaller cities, they are less important.

Leo's depends on how much gold you are spending on upgrades so dunno

Magelans depends on the map, and a huge archipellago is just where you want it. Unless you have severe difficulties with hapiness (then bachs) my vote goes for this one.

Magelans is important in more ways than you might think.
-It increases the speed at wich you conquer the world
-It gives you more tactical options in naval combat including the ability to outrun ships with your transports.
-It lowers upkeep by shortening your units life cycle*

Every unit has the following life cycle:
-being produced
-moving to battle
-fighting
-dying

During this life cycle, your units cost upkeep, so shortening it is good.
If you are so high on upkeep that you slowdown your unit production for it, this is even more important as the shorter life cycle will enable you to produce some more units and thus have more millitairy power.

(this theory is not so obvious in civ3, but more so in strategy games where you have a unit limmit like in starcraft. It is then very important to make travel time as short as possible (in starcraft you do so by moving your production area closer to the enemy) While it is not so obvious in civ3, it IS a basic rule of strategy games and does make a difference.)
 
It depends on which one is the longest build; but I'd go for Leo's workshop first. All those lovely unit upgrades at half price. :goodjob:

Second I'd go go for the money, Smith's trading post. Especially if I was having financial difficulties.

Third I'd go for Magellans an extra movement would be nice.

Lastly, as I said above I'd have to look and see which ones I thought I could complete on my own before deciding. :confused:
 
I'd go with Smith's, all other things being equal, no maintenance on marketplaces, banks and stock exchanges is really powerful IMO. Remember marketplaces also help out with happiness if you have enough luxuries and plenty of money lets you buy the luxuries you don't have.
 
With my style of play, I'd definitely pick Bach's. But, the question is, which wonder will benefit you most and helps with your style of play.

When rushing wonders, I normally pick an expensive one. Leo's, Bach's & Smith's cost 600 shields while the other 3 cost 400 shields. Then I check the cultural effect per turn. Leo's = 2x, Bach's = 6x & Smith's = 3x. So, my decision would be between Bach's and Smith's.

Bach's would be good if you don't have many luxuries, lower lux slider setting, war wearniess and it influences all cities. Smith's would be good if you expect the game to last a while since you can get massive GPT towards the end of the game by switching cities to wealth.

If you had planned ahead, you probably have a palace being build that you can switch over to one of these wonders also (probably Magellan's) .
 
Oh yes, the price might make a difference of course if you plan to build others yourself. In this case, what also makes a difference is how close the AI is to beating you to a wonder.

If you want to build magelan yourself and there is no risk the AI beating you to it, then rush bachs.

I don't understand why everyone values smiths so high. If you are researching yourself, you are supposed to have tech to 80+ %, and have universities rather than banks. If you only have marketplaces, it only pays one gold per city.
 
WackenOpenAir:
At warlord level I generally have two crisis in a game. The first is military; not enough units to keep the AI Civs off my neck. The second is financial. I've had to drop research as low as 20% to keep from going negative. Banks and Smith's help here. That is why I build them. I also build stock exchanges when they become available. :)
 
Smiths. No question. And it's not only Markets, it's Harbors, Airports, Stock Exchanges, Commercial Docks, Banks a well, a lot of those you'll have on Archipelago maps.
Bach's is great on Pangeas only. Leo's is good, but not that important late in the game (a killer wonder for Horse -> Knight).
The other Wonders are fairly cheap, you should be able to build them by yourself.
Shakespear is outstanding, but you want that for your best city, which should be able to build it in a couple of turns anyway.
 
Hmmm............ Smiths it is guys. I could never say no to money :lol:
 
It depends on two things.

1. Which wonder is the best. Normally I'd prefer Smith's, then Bach's.
2. This is the most important part: which wonder AI has access to now. Can you rush a wonder and end all the cascade, thus still get all the wonders you want? For example, if AI has still a long way to get Economics, you don't need to rush Smith's. Bach's might be a better choice, and you can switch your Bach's build to Smith's.
 
I'd definitely go for Smith's first, and as second choice, Shakespeare's Theatre so I can grow one city to be ultra big looong before sanitation hits. Big city = $$$ + production.

As for comments saying smith's isn't that good since at that point in the game not that many marketplaces and banks and so on.. think for the future too. These things WILL be built (and in fact in my style of play every city usually has at least a marketplace by that point).
 
My first choice: Smith's. Because as Doc said, it pays the maintenance of several city improvments. Smith's and the Internet are the most powerfull GWs for the modern era.

Just a "but". However you should think in one point:
How leading you are in tech research (can you made by yourself the Bach's and Leo's?)

Regards:

RR
 
I agree to Smith, it's imo anyway a "must have". There are not many wonders I really struggle for, but if pyramides, smith, bach, hover and INTERNET! UN of course because otherwise Ghandi makes it :P
 
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