"you attacked our friend" threshold

[Inkling]

i apologize if this has been suggested before, i know the problem has been brought up before and is present in native civ4, but i've never heard any solutions.

Would it be possible to add a friendship/enemy threshold value to diplomacy, you have to be positive so much to actually be considered a friend and negative so much to really be an enemy. As it stands even a small plus is a friend and small minus an enemy, and it makes for truely ridiculous diplomacy and actions.

To explain, I declared war on one of the clan embers guys and was kicking his butt when faeryl(spelling) i believe it was, sent an army of hidden nationality troops to attack me. A truely stupid move that cost her dearly and benefitted noone, but beside the point. when i looked at my relations to see why she felt the need to harrass me, i discovered she was pissed at me for declaring war on her friend. Friend? noone had even discovered basic diplomacy yet, their friendship amounted to both being evil while i was neutral, and them not being at war with eachother. This infact makes them friends from the very moment they meet.

I'm sure everyone has seen this happen in their games, and I've heard much more ludicrous situations, but this illustrates the point. Is it possible to modify diplomacy so you are only hit with these kinds of diplomatic modifiers when two nations can truely be considered friends or enemies.

Thanks for your time.

 

[Honor]

that is not the worst of it. when two AIs are at war, they can bug you to death with their constant attempts at getting you to declare on their opponent. like every 10 turns or so. when their war is over they realize now that YOU are the root of all evil and decide to go after you because "-10 You refused to help us during war time!".

ugh.

 

[mimic]

Faeyrl's a moron, in my last game I had a defensive pact with 4 other civs, she was "cautious" to me and my army was twice the size of hers...she declared war on me and was promptly wiped out.

 

[Vorpal+5]

I don't think Faeryl is more a moron than any others AI, because I don't think the AI have civilization-specific war-plan/situational analysis algorithms code for now (for lack of better term).

 

[Humakty]

Are you sure ? It seems to me Faeryl was especially crafty and inconstant. She tends to betray her allies very often. But maybe I'm mistaken.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

yep, some AIs are more prone to backstabbing than others, it's the same in vanilla, every leader has its own personality. Faeryl is the Queen of Mischief

 

[MaxAstro]

Personally I've always felt Faeryl should be more likely to declare war on you the friendlier she is with you.

 

[rocklikeafool]

Of course. If she hates you, it's like she loves you. She is pretty much the Queen of Lies. Also, Faeryl=boobs.

 

[Inkling]

that is not the worst of it. when two AIs are at war, they can bug you to death with their constant attempts at getting you to declare on their opponent. like every 10 turns or so. when their war is over they realize now that YOU are the root of all evil and decide to go after you because "-10 You refused to help us during war time!".

ugh.

Well, if you can define when someone is a friend and an enemy, and limit effects based on that, then you should be able to further limit the AI's actions based on whether you are a friend or enemy.

Thats not nearly as clear as i meant, so let me explain. In your situation, people are asking you for help in a war until they despise you, if you can state that you would only ask a friend for help in a time of war, and define what a friend is, then the worst possible outcome of this situation would be that you are no longer friends, because each time you refuse you may drop below the threshold and not be a friend, then they would stop asking.

Or, if you wanted people to be able to ask for help when not friends, you could atleast make the assumption that as a neutral party you are not expected to help, and therefore shouldn't suffer penalties like you would as a friend.

anyways if it can be done, and without burdening the system too much, i think it could be used to seriously improve the Diplomacy of the game.

Thank you for your time.

 

[iceboy103]

I believe that snarko's mod fixes some of these problems. Maybe it should be added to FFH?

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=226635

 

[zup]

I don't understand why the AI does not get the hint the first time. And why does it not offer me something to spike my interest? Also, after you declare the war, about 10 turns later they sign peace. Or even sooner.

 

[onedreamer]

The real problem here is that you THINK she declared war because she was friends with the Clan, but did she actually said so in the declaration of war ? Most likely she was looking at backstabbing you while you were already involved in a war. I don't think the AI is a monster of intelligence, but here you are highly underestimating it... actually you haven't made any esteem.

 

[zup]

Faeryl will backstab you if you don't manage to get a permanent alliance with her first. Or possibly dominate the rest of the world in military power and score by a factor of ten.