[Vote] (6-43) City Garrison Damage

[Stalker0]

Realistically, once cities get walls I never see garrisons take more than 5 damage per hit. Its almost clockwork.

Looking at this proposal in the info era, we are going from the garrison taking 5 damage per hit to 12 (for a typical 30 damage attack). That means that garrison once could take 20 attacks before dying (maybe a few more if it gets to heal a bit in between), to 9 attacks. that is NOT a small change.

I can respect wanting garrisons to take a little more damage....but that is waaaaaay too big a jump to me.

 

[Tekamthi]

/agree as well with the sentiment but that proposal is too big a jump. The more garrisons need to be shuffled around and positioning optimized, the more advantage to skilled human over AI.

Possible compromise to me is to have it tied to city's % of total dmg. When city at 100% hp, minimal dmg is incurred to garrison -- as it drops to <50% city hp, a larger portion of dmg passed to garrison, perhaps as much as in OP

 

[Rekk]

Looking at this proposal in the info era, we are going from the garrison taking 5 damage per hit to 12 (for a typical 30 damage attack). That means that garrison once could take 20 attacks before dying (maybe a few more if it gets to heal a bit in between), to 9 attacks. that is NOT a small change.

How much does a Garrison heal in the Information era? With Hospital etc. I thought it was like 30+?

 

[Stalker0]

How much does a Garrison heal in the Information era? With Hospital etc. I thought it was like 30+?

might be right, in which case this is even more a gap between cities now and after this change, as a dead garrison heals nothing.

 

[Zuizgond]

Moving damage from city to garrison means more turns to reduce city HP, which already takes an eternity as cities have far too many HP.

 

[Tekamthi]

Moving damage from city to garrison means more turns to reduce city HP, which already takes an eternity as cities have far too many HP.

Aye a skilled player with large enough army can rotate the garrisons to keep city up much longer, without other adjustments.

I imagine the AI will blunder this rotation frequently (as it kind of does already)

 

[DoveCDog]

Moving damage from city to garrison means more turns to reduce city HP, which already takes an eternity as cities have far too many HP.

So long as the garrison lives, but the garrison taking more damage means it will die faster, dropping the city hp and having it take much more damage.

 

[adan_eslavo]

So long as the garrison lives, but the garrison taking more damage means it will die faster, dropping the city hp and having it take much more damage.

Now it sometimes happens that Garrison heals faster than you damage it even having bunch of units around.

 

[DoveCDog]

Now it sometimes happens that Garrison heals faster than you damage it even having bunch of units around.

Yes, this and other similar situations are what inspired me to make the proposal. Garrisons are far too tanky.

 

[Tekamthi]

The concern is very valid to me, it's just the solution I don't like. Too flat.

In past civ games, and possibly 6 from what I understand, walls and fortifications could be attacked and destroyed via various means. I don't recall exactly how it was done, but in our case here, where defensive buildings add hp directly to city, once that hp is lost, why not lose the building entirely?

In the case of walls, they add 125hp or whatever amount -- once city loses its first 125hp, walls should be gone imo.

 

[Zuizgond]

So long as the garrison lives, but the garrison taking more damage means it will die faster, dropping the city hp and having it take much more damage.

Garrison can be easily replaced before dying.

 

[Rekk]

Garrison can be easily replaced before dying.

They can be more easily replaced right now. What this proposal allows is to kill a unit in one turn before the enemy has a chance to replace it, then use the remaining attacks that turn on a city that has no garrison.

It's so difficult to kill a garrison late game that we hacked in an ability for missiles to ignore the city and its defensive structures and only attack the garrison

 

[Rekk]

anyway if we want to use CS for distributing damage we should also think about the garrisons' impact on the city CS. double dipping doesn't make sense.

I agree that it's awkward that the example/proposal uses the City's CS (including the garrison) to compare against the Garrison's CS.

I don't agree that it's weird that the combined CS is used to determine incoming damage, and then the individual CS are used to determine the damage is distributed. If the unit has higher CS than the city, then it seems reasonable that the unit takes the brunt of the damage.

Note that, while used in the example, a melee unit as a garrison in a city under siege is not exactly the standard. Generally a ranged unit or siege unit is preferred (and their CS is much lower than the contemporary melee unit). In this case, the city takes more damage overall, but a lower proportion of it is sent to the garrison.

 

[Anarcomu]

Alternatively (up to next congress), we could have made units inside blockaded cities unable to heal, and cities unable to produce/buy unit.
A fully surrounded city should fall more quickly than now.
Maybe Hospital still work and heal units by a tiny bit each turn regardless.

 

[adan_eslavo]

Alternatively (up to next congress), we could have made units inside blockaded cities unable to heal, and cities unable to produce/buy unit.
A fully surrounded city should fall more quickly than now.
Maybe Hospital still work and heal units by a tiny bit each turn regardless.

That could be a solution.

 

[CppMaster]

Alternatively (up to next congress), we could have made units inside blockaded cities unable to heal, and cities unable to produce/buy unit.
A fully surrounded city should fall more quickly than now.
Maybe Hospital still work and heal units by a tiny bit each turn regardless.

Good idea!

 

[azum4roll]

Alternatively (up to next congress), we could have made units inside blockaded cities unable to heal

That's... how it already works?