Brave new World's New Civilizations - REVISED AGAIN!

[VoiceOfReaon]

Canada has a better chance in general. It's not in BNW, but between Canada and Cuba, Canada is the more likely to get in at some later time. Its history is longer, its world significance is greater (Missile Crisis notwithstanding), it has more iconic leaders to choose from who are not still living people (Macdonald, King, and Trudeau all spring immediately to mind), and--not that this has stopped them before--it would be a lot less gimmicky.

From my pov Canada has no chance at all. What significance do they have in the modern world? They don't have that much impact on geopolitical decisions imo. With full independence in 1931, I also wouldn't call it's history that long.
I don't know where you get the idea from it has 'better' iconic leaders than Cuba. I can assure you that the vast majority of people know Castro, know his face, and have some knowledge of who he is and what he has done while only a very small amount of people will able to do the same with the 3 people you just summed up.

Hence I believe Cuba would have a bigger chance. I don't overall enjoy modern countries in civ, but if you have to have them, I think Cuba would be a good candidate.

edit: I've been doing a quick skimming and I'm surprised that Belgium has been named as a potential European civ and added to the poll but no one has named Flanders? What does Belgium have going for them? It's only 180 years old and the biggest thing I can see it have going for them that can be translated into the game is the very difficult political scene where 2 cultures that are roughly the same size (being Flanders and Wallonia) have lived in relative peace with each other for the entire time.
Flanders on the other hand, was an economic power during the middle ages with a very strong textile/cloth industry. Thx to this, it has a history of warfare, oppression and occupation. All of these elements can be easily translated into the game.

 

[trexeric]

Castro is still alive, so no chance of him getting in. I think that Canada would be more likely for two reasons:
1) It's really big.
2) There's a lot of Canadian fans that would go nuts over Canada.
Although there's no change of them getting in anyway, so whatever.

 

[ImperialChaos]

How come they don't use leaders that are alive? Is it a legacy issue?

 

[trexeric]

Probably so they don't offend anybody.

 

[codepoet]

From my pov Canada has no chance at all. What significance do they have in the modern world? They don't have that much impact on geopolitical decisions imo. With full independence in 1931, I also wouldn't call it's history that long.
I don't know where you get the idea from it has 'better' iconic leaders than Cuba. I can assure you that the vast majority of people know Castro, know his face, and have some knowledge of who he is and what he has done while only a very small amount of people will able to do the same with the 3 people you just summed up.

Hence I believe Cuba would have a bigger chance. I don't overall enjoy modern countries in civ, but if you have to have them, I think Cuba would be a good candidate.

edit: I've been doing a quick skimming and I'm surprised that Belgium has been named as a potential European civ and added to the poll but no one has named Flanders? What does Belgium have going for them? It's only 180 years old and the biggest thing I can see it have going for them that can be translated into the game is the very difficult political scene where 2 cultures that are roughly the same size (being Flanders and Wallonia) have lived in relative peace with each other for the entire time.
Flanders on the other hand, was an economic power during the middle ages with a very strong textile/cloth industry. Thx to this, it has a history of warfare, oppression and occupation. All of these elements can be easily translated into the game.

"Stupid Flanders"

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

Because when leaders are still alive it can be easy to mistake a cult of personality for true legendary status.

 

[God of Kings]

Castro is still alive, so no chance of him getting in. I think that Canada would be more likely for two reasons:
1) It's really big.
2) There's a lot of Canadian fans that would go nuts over Canada.
Although there's no change of them getting in anyway, so whatever.

...and Sid Meier (that name on every box of the Civilization games) is born in Sarnia, Ontario. Without Sid Meier, this website would not exist.

 

[VoiceOfReaon]

"Stupid Flanders"

hm?

Because when leaders are still alive it can be easy to mistake a cult of personality for true legendary status.

Like those Canadian leaders the majority of people haven't heard about?

Wasn't aware of that policy though, but it's correct that in that case there is virtually no chance of a Cuban civ.

 

[codepoet]

hm?

TV show... The Simpsons. Homer's neighbor is named Flanders. Homer grumbles "Stupid Flanders" when he's annoyed at something he does.

 

[spacedinosaur]

With full independence in 1931, I also wouldn't call it's history that long.

Quick Canadian history lesson: Canada was given autonomy in 1867. In 1931 Canada was given "independence" with a constitution that remained in the UK but could only be altered with Canadian consent. The country wasn't granted what I consider full independence until 1982 with the passage of the Canada Act, with the patriation of their constitution and full rights to self-governance.

I wouldn't mind a Canadian civ. I have family that's been in Ontario over 200 years. I'm unsure what they could offer the game to make gameplay enhanced in any way. Iconic Canadian leaders are iconic to Canadians, yet the average American couldn't name you one Canadian PM if they tried. That being said, the same could be said about other civs that already made it into the franchise. The Iroquois would need to get rid of Montreal; I'm okay with that, though.

I also wouldn't mind Cuba. I don't understand the adversity to "modern" civs, especially if they have a history that lasts hundreds of years prior to self-determination. I do understand the discomfort for using an iconic leader who is still alive (albeit almost dead and out of office). If you don't like Castro, you could always go for Che Guevara. He's a very iconic figure for the revolution and remained a key political figure in Cuba until his death. His influence extends from the Caribbean to Argentina where he was born, his photos are everywhere (more so than of Castro) and he trained the militia that repelled the US Bay of Pigs invasion.

In the end, I think both are unlikely to be in the game, despite how much I like both.

 

[God of Kings]

The Iroquois would need to get rid of Montreal; I'm okay with that, though.

No they don't. The Iroquois and the United States share Buffalo. The United States and Egypt share Memphis. The Iroquois and Spain share Salamanca. Russia and the Aztecs share Tula. The United States and Polynesia share Honolulu.

 

[spacedinosaur]

I stand corrected

 

[seancolorado]

Who wants to hop on the "Kongo for DLC" bandwagon with me?

Not that one civ represents an entire area, but I can't help but feel the one major missing hole geographically is in Sub-Saharan Africa.

I would really love to see a Kongo, or another popular civ in the region, from anywhere below Ethiopia but above Zulu

 

[cybrxkhan]

Who wants to hop on the "Kongo for DLC" bandwagon with me?

Not that one civ represents an entire area, but I can't help but feel the one major missing hole geographically is in Sub-Saharan Africa.

I would really love to see a Kongo, or another popular civ in the region, from anywhere below Ethiopia but above Zulu

I'd support you. We got plenty of interesting candidates:

- Kongo
- Ashanti
- Benin
- Hausa
- Kanem-Bornu
- Zimbabwe
- Swahili
- Somalia
- Angola

Probably others I forgot too.

 

[phaethon16]

A Kongo DLC would be very cool. If not another expansion, we need a DLC run with Kongo getting priority.

 

[seancolorado]

I'd support you. We got plenty of interesting candidates:

- Kongo
- Ashanti
- Benin
- Hausa
- Kanem-Bornu
- Zimbabwe
- Swahili
- Somalia
- Angola

Probably others I forgot too.

Plenty indeed. You also have some solid civs in and around the Kalahari desert:



But since Zulu has that area covered (I mean, not really at all, but we can't be picky with our civs that don't have a market) then it's likely it would be something further North in and around the DRC area

 

[phaethon16]

I do not really want the Swahili, because they make such good city-states. If we get another African civ, Benin or Kongo should be in.

 

[seancolorado]

And here's a reminder to everyone of that gaping hole around the DRC area:



I mean, it's not going to be hard to get CivFanatics to rally around a civ to represent this area, amirite?

The only question is if more casual outlets get behind it

 

[seancolorado]

But it's going to happen. We're going to get some civ from this area - probably Kongo - if not in another expansion then in a last hoorah of DLC(s).

 

[teriaky]

I'm all for an african DLC with Kongo, Benin and Swahili. Somalia, Kanem-Bornu and Zimbabwe are also cool.