Brewing tensions between the Tea Party and GOP

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MANISTEE, Mich./WACO, Texas/WASHINGTON (Reuters) – Some Tea Partiers say they can pinpoint the precise moment when they made it clear to the Republican Party they had no intention of being its lapdog.

On a bright, brisk afternoon in mid-February, with snow still thick on the ground from storms that had battered Washington the week before, Republican National Committee Chairman Michael Steele met with more than 50 members of the Tea Party, the Twitter Age conservative movement that is reshaping the U.S. political landscape.

Steele, RNC chairman since January 2009, had invited them to the plush Capitol Hill Club, built as a clubhouse for the party's top brass next door to RNC headquarters.

According to several accounts, not long into the meeting JoAnn Abbott, an activist from Virginia who calls herself the 'Tea Party Grandma,' raised her hand to ask a question.

She asked about a web page on the RNC site where visitors could send their member of Congress a postcard with a tea bag. On the tag at the end of the string were the letters 'RNC.'

"Respectfully, sir, while we do not have a trademark on the tea bag, you are well aware that people associate it with the Tea Party movement," Abbott, 50, recalls saying to Steele. "If you co-opt that image, you damage our brand and weaken our movement."

Lest there was any confusion, she added: "It does not belong to you, it belongs to us as an independent movement."

Abbott said within an hour of the end of the meeting the page (www.teaparty.gop.com) was gone -- and the Grand Old Party was finally aware of conservative frustrations she and others felt with Republican leadership.

"The GOP now knows we're not asleep anymore," Abbott told Reuters. "The giant has been awakened."

RNC officials said Steele, who according to Abbott and others agreed at the time to hold regional meetings with Tea Party groups around the country, was traveling and unable to comment for this story.

But on Fox News the day after the meeting, Steele described the meeting as part of a "healing process" with people disaffected with Republican leaders. Part of the process includes "acknowledging where we have gone wrong, where we have made the mistakes in spending, in growing the size of government, in stepping away from those very constitutional principles and values that have certainly defined this party," he said.

CONSTITUTIONAL CONSERVATIVES

Accounts of that February 16 meeting challenge a common perception that the Tea Party movement was founded, funded and dominated by the Republican Party. Most of them are current or former Republicans -- up to 80 percent or more, with the rest split between Democrats, independents and Libertarians. And the movement has received help from conservative groups like FreedomWorks, which has provided training and logistical support to Tea Party groups and hopes the movement will boost fiscal conservatives in congressional midterm elections.

But Tea Partiers insist that they are not beholden to the GOP and warn that Republican candidates counting on an endorsement from them in November may well be disappointed.

Interviews with Tea Partiers across the country paint a picture of a genuine, amorphous, conservative grassroots movement united by three core principles: constitutionally limited government, free market ideology and low taxes. The American Constitution is a rallying cry and many now dub themselves "constitutional conservatives."

They are angry not just at what they describe as the socialist policies of U.S. President Barack Obama. They also feel Republican politicians have betrayed the party's ideals. For many in the movement, purging the party of moderate Republicans is a major goal.

"I used to be a dyed-in-the-wool Republican. Now if we have a Republican lined up to come to our meetings, I don't even want to go," said Nate Friedl, 41, a member of the Rock River Patriots, a Tea Party group in southern Wisconsin.

Following a first year marked by protests, the movement is evolving. The political novices of a year ago are forming coalitions and learning how to change things from the ground up.

After rallying against government bailouts and Obama's healthcare reforms, as well as mobilizing the vote for key electoral races such as Republican Scott Brown's victory in Massachusetts in January, many Tea Partiers feel empowered.

"Tea Party people have realized that you cannot change the system by protesting on the outside," said Richard Viguerie, author of 'Conservatives Betrayed: How George W. Bush and Other Big Government Republicans Hijacked the Conservative Cause.'

The movement is also debating whether to remain independent -- or stage a conservative takeover of the Republican Party. And some, a tiny minority, favor becoming a third party.

"The two-party system is too ingrained in America," said Rod Merrill, head of the Ludington Tea Party in western Michigan. "Every time someone has tried to form a third party, it has failed."

An Ipsos/Reuters poll shows that although a majority of Democrats and a plurality of independents voters would support Tea Party candidates, less than one third of Republicans would support them as a third party.

Regardless of the debate's outcome, Tea Partiers are targeting not just prominent Democrats in the midterms but also key moderate Republicans like Charlie Crist in Florida and former presidential candidate John McCain in Arizona. United as never before by the internet and weekly conference calls, conservatives are eyeing a few "national" primary races.

"The Tea Party movement needs champions," said Larry Sabato, a professor of politics at the University of Virginia. "They have to be able to say 'We're the reason they got elected.' Otherwise the movement may dissipate."

The Tea Party movement has resonated with many Americans, as demonstrated by a March 15 Rasmussen Reports poll putting Tea Party candidates in third place with 21 percent approval among voters behind the Republicans at 27 percent and the Democrats at 34 percent. A December poll had put the movement in second place ahead of the Republicans.

Some Republican politicians have actively courted Tea Partiers, whose fiscal conservative focus is close to the Republicans' stated principles. Democrat politicians have largely shunned the movement.

"This year the momentum is away from the Democrats as they're the party in power, so Republican candidates espousing Tea Party views in general have a better chance in the midterms," Sabato said. "But movements like this have come and gone before, so it's still too early to say if the movement will survive long term."

In the near term, the mostly white movement faces a possible showdown with the religious right over divisive social issues. But its biggest challenge lies in tackling its extremist fringe, including those who equate Obama with Hitler and the "birther" movement that doubts Obama's U.S. citizenship and the legitimacy of his presidency.

"The majority of Americans can agree with the core principles of the Tea Party movement," said Ned Ryun, president of American Majority, a conservative group that has provided training programs for Tea Party groups. "But if it allows itself to be defined by its extremist fringe, then it's lost."

THIS REVOLUTION WILL BE TELEVISED

Around 11pm local time on November 4, 2008, America's first black president-elect strode out onto a stage in Grant Park in downtown Chicago and told a cheering crowd of about 250,000 that "change has come to America."

Some 40 miles away in the suburb of Grayslake, local businesswoman Janelle Nagy sat up in bed watching Obama's victory speech in horror, her bedcovers tucked tightly under her chin.

"I told my husband how afraid I was for America," she said, her hands held close to her face as if still clutching a blanket like a scared child. "Obama said he wants to fundamentally change America. But I don't want to fundamentally change this country."

"I love America the way it is," added Nagy, now a leader of the Northern Illinois Patriots.

Tea Partiers across the country recall a growing sense of anger well before presidential election night in 2008, as outgoing President George W. Bush helped prop up the teetering U.S. financial sector amid the worst downturn since the 1930s and issued emergency loans to struggling automakers General Motors and Chrysler. Under Obama, the government took stakes in both companies.

"I remember just screaming at the TV," said Tanya Bachand, 35, a trial lawyer and Connecticut state coordinator for the Tea Party Patriots. "I was frustrated long before Obama came along because of how much the government grew under Bush. To me Obama was like Bush, only much worse."

The moment that launched the Tea Party came a shortly after Obama took office. On cable business channel CNBC, on February 19, host Rick Santelli launched into an impromptu tirade from his regular slot at the Chicago Board of Trade against plans to help struggling homeowners. Santelli proposed a tea party in Chicago in July to protest government bailouts.

This was a reference to the Boston Tea Party, an act of protest against the British government over taxation in 1773, a moment that has resonated throughout American history.

"The Rant," as Santelli's monologue has become known, struck a chord with conservatives.

"If we hadn't had all of those bailouts the economy would be back on track by now," said Tina Dupont, a founding member of the Tea Party of West Michigan. "The jobs would be back, companies would be coming back. If they'd let the banks and others collapse, we would have had a short, sharp downturn."

The consensus among economists is that had the U.S. government and Federal Reserve not propped up the markets, a global depression would likely have ensued. Yet Dupont and others profess an unshakable belief in the power of the free market. To them, government intervention makes crises only worse. They argue runaway government spending threatens America's future.

Tea Partiers say Santelli spoke to a deep-seated anger among conservatives who felt betrayed by the Republican politicians they had believed in. Many want big government spending programs like social security scrapped.

"Social security is socialism," said Jim Chase, 80, a retiree on social security, who is a member of the Ludington Tea Party. "If we don't stop all this spending, we won't have anything left for our grandchildren."

Chase said he would rather have a system where Americans were able to invest their social security payments themselves, an idea not unlike President Bush's proposal to privatize social security. So when Santelli let rip, fiscal conservatives were eager to answer the call.

"It wasn't like all of a sudden we woke up and said we need a Tea Party," said Amy Kremer, 49, one of the founders of the Atlanta Tea Party. "This came after years of rumblings through the conservative world. The fuel was already there and he (Santelli) just lit the fuse."

A small group of conservatives on Twitter instantly took up the Tea Party theme and in a conference call on February 20 they planned tea parties for the following week. On Friday February 27, 2009, a total of 48 tea parties were held around the country and coordinators estimated turnout at 35,000 people.

Mark Meckler, 48, a lawyer in Sacramento and independent who was a Republican until eight years ago, threw a party on February 27 thinking he would have six attendees. Instead, 150 people showed up.

"That inspired me to keep going," he said.

FreedomWorks, which is in frequent contact with up to 2,000 local leaders, estimates 3 million to 5 million people have participated in Tea Party meetings or donated money.

Martin said according to local organizers, on April 15 some 1.2 million people attended 850 tea parties. Martin and Meckler are now national coordinators of the Tea Party Patriots, a grouping of more than 1,200 local Tea Party groups.

Following the early rallies, the Tea Party movement evolved quickly, cheered on avidly by right wing commentators, above all Glenn Beck on cable channel Fox News.

"The past year has been like drinking out of a fire hydrant," Martin said. "Everything has moved so fast."

Early on Tea Partiers found an enduring target in the Obama administration's attempts to reform the healthcare system.

Highly publicized and frequently angry confrontations with members of Congress at "town hall" meetings in the summer became a hallmark of the Tea Party's first year.

"I WAS NOT ALONE"

A common thread to tales of Tea Partiers is that in the early months they discovered others felt the same and, all of a sudden, they felt empowered.

Tanya Bachand traveled to New York for the February 27 Tea Party event in New York and was surprised at how many conservatives there were in a liberal city. "I didn't even vote in the last midterm elections because I felt so disillusioned," she said. "But all of a sudden I felt I was not alone."

Bachand returned to Connecticut and started her own Tea Party group. She recalls an early meeting where a biker, a preacher and a businessman in a suit sat together on her living room couch.

"They had absolutely nothing in common, except they wanted to do what's right for this country," she said.

Bachand's group teamed up with others in the state -- from gun rights to anti-abortion groups -- to form the Connecticut Patriot Alliance. "Everybody in the alliance has their own particular bugaboo," she said. "But we all agree on the Constitution, so we work together on the big issues."

They focused on local Senator Chris Dodd, the Democrat chairman of the U.S. Senate Banking Committee. "Every time Chris Dodd set foot in the state, between us we had 50 to 100 people waiting to protest," Bachand said. "We made a real statement."

In Waco, Texas, the town's Tea Party group blocked a local bailout. According to local media reports, in October the Waco City council approved a $700,000 loan to keep a local high-tech firm afloat under new ownership. But when the Waco Tea Party got wind of the decision, they mobilized to prevent it.

"It made me mad," recalled leadership council member Lisa Dickison, a mild-mannered woman who looks incapable of anger.

Waco Tea Party head Toby Marie Walker said five or six members went to a county commissioner meeting, where the bailout was due to be approved. Walker said their presence alone led the commissioners to stop the bail out.

"We just had to show up and they knew why we were there," she said.

The healthcare debate is where conservative Tea Partiers feel they have had most impact. They are convinced they forced Republicans into opposing the reform and felt they were a crucial factor in getting Scott Brown elected to the Senate seat left vacant by the death of Ted Kennedy.

"On a conference call in December someone said maybe Brown could win and that we should get behind him," Meckler of the Tea Party Patriots said. "The idea gained momentum from there."

GETTING ORGANIZED

As the movement has grown, coalitions have formed. In Michigan, Tea Party groups have formed the Michigan Tea Party Alliance with supporters of Glenn Beck's 9.12 Project -- a conservative group that wants America to resume the spirit of unity of September 12, 2001, the day after the September 11 attacks.

"The movement is beginning to coalesce around a core set of principles -- constitutionally limited government, free market ideology and low taxes," said Tony Raymond, who was laid off at consulting company Accenture in March 2009 and is now a leader of the Northern Illinois Patriots.

The Tea Party Patriots now have two paid national coordinators -- Jenny Beth Martin and Mark Meckler -- whose salaries come from member contributions. "I only started getting paid last month," Meckler said. "I went through my life savings to get to this point and my family has really suffered."

"I was working for the movement 100 hours a week and they either had to start paying me or I'd have to go back to work."

There is a mentoring program to teach novice local leaders how to organize, as more than 200 new groups have joined them since the beginning of 2010.

Staff at FreedomWorks believe the movement's expansion is largely behind it, but American Majority's Ryun said "the Tea Party is going to continue to grow until the country gets back on the right track."

Other volunteer groups have stepped in to aid conservatives in their quest for ideological purity. Utah-based Independence Caucus, for instance, vets conservative candidates using a questionnaire containing 80 questions based on the U.S. Constitution. Candidates who answer yes to at least 70 percent of those questions are interviewed by local conservatives.

If they pass muster, Independence Caucus backs their candidacy. "But if we find someone is a chameleon and was lying, our policy is we'll work twice as hard to remove them from office as we did to get them elected," said Donald Jakel, the group's coordinator for Ohio and Michigan.

Independence Caucus has vetted at least one candidate in half the state and national seats up for grabs in Michigan.

CONSERVATIVE MACHINE

The efforts of Tea Party movement have also been backed by some well-funded conservative groups.

FreedomWorks, headed by former Republican House Majority leader Dick Armey, says it was involved from the outset. It helped political novices navigate the bureaucratic requirements of holding a protest, including insurance issues and permits.

The group has provided training for television interview, on meeting congressmen and public relations.

Spokesman Adam Brandon said FreedomWorks' budget in 2009 was $7 million, up to 70 percent from individual donations, up to 25 percent from foundations and the rest from corporations. The group does not name donors but said the foundations were those that typically give to conservative libertarian causes.

In 2006 to 2007 FreedomWorks had zero online donations; in 2009 they had 19,000 individual online donors who contributed more than $500,000 in total.

The group hopes to add up to 15 fiscal conservatives in the House of Representatives this year, plus four in the Senate.

Purcellville, Virginia-based group American Majority has also provided training. It was founded in 2008 with financial backing from the Chicago-based Sam Adams Alliance, which promotes free market principles. Individual conservatives have given as much as $25,000 or as little as $100 each.

The group's president Ryun said conservative donors are taking a fresh look at the RNC and wondering if their money would be better spent on grassroots conservative groups.

"The Republican grassroots operation is pretty much defunct," he said. "Conservatives are looking for a better bang for their buck. There is going to be more competition for money that has traditionally gone to the RNC and I for one am going to go after that money, hard."

FreedomWorks and Our Country Deserves Better, a political action committee that has formed Tea Party Express, have been accused of being GOP operatives, including by other Tea Party groups. But both groups say their money comes from conservatives. Tea Party Express is staffed by people from Russo, Marsh & Associates, founded by Sal Russo, who began his political career as an assistant to Ronald Reagan when he was governor of California. A review of the Federal Election Commission filings from Our Country Deserves Better shows mostly small donations of a few hundred dollars, many of them from retirees.

More recently, Wierzbicki said the Republican Party has belatedly tried to woo Tea Partiers.

Some Republicans have openly courted the movement, especially Sarah Palin, McCain's running mate in 2008. She gave the keynote speech at the Tea Party Convention in Nashville in early February. Organized by Tea Party Nation, the event was derided by some other Tea Party groups as being a GOP front.

"We like Sarah Palin, she's one of us and she speaks to us," said Tina Dupont of the Tea Party of West Michigan. "But she does not speak for us." Her views were echoed by many.

Most Republicans are not so popular. "The Republican Party would like to take over the Tea Party and use it to gain power," Tanya Bachand said. "It's the other way around and they don't know what's coming."

"Their reckoning is coming."

The GOP and individual Republican candidates are actively seeking Tea Party endorsements and votes. "At every meeting we have, we see local and state representatives of the Republican Party counting heads and trying to drum up support from our members," said Nighta Davis, organizer of the North Georgia Patriots. "For six years the Republicans controlled Congress and the White House under Bush and they could have solved this country's problems. But they did nothing of the kind."

"Now they want to co-opt us," she added. "But they just don't get it."

BATTLES AHEAD

Of the possible challenges ahead for the Tea Party movement the two main ones are not from the left, but from the right.

The first comes from social conservatives, or the religious right. The Tea Party movement is dominated by fiscal conservatives and leaders like Eric Odom of the American Liberty Alliance say social issues like abortion and gay marriage should be avoided.

When asked about abortion, for instance, Tina Dupont of the Tea Party of West Michigan says the group does not discuss it. "Most of us are probably pro-lifers," she said. "But we avoid the topic because it is so divisive."

This has been noted by some on the religious right. "At the national level you have people saying it is all about fiscal issues and not about social issues because they say they are divisive," said Tony Perkins, president of Christian lobby group the Family Research Council.

Chris Merrill said while Tea Partiers can avoid divisive issues at meetings, they cannot if they run for office. "Running a campaign is different," he said. "At some point they have to take a stand on social issues."

Some say a showdown between social and fiscal conservative groups may be inevitable. "Fiscal conservatives want to limit the size of government, social conservatives want to use government to further their agenda," Henson said. "That will likely cause problems."

The other problem is the extreme fringe of the Tea Party movement, which was evident at a demonstration outside the Detroit auto show on a snowy day in January. More than half of the 20 or so protesters held signs protesting government bailouts. The rest held placards with black and white pictures of President Obama's face, with a Hitler mustache added.

Within minutes, both groups had moved to opposite corners of their allotted patch of concrete. Andrew Moylan of the National Taxpayers Union said with evident discomfort he had tried unsuccessfully to get rid of the Obama-as-Hitler posters. "I oppose Obama's policies vehemently, I don't agree with what he is trying to do," he said. "But I believe that he is well-intentioned, even if he is dead wrong."

"Comparing him to Hitler is not only wrong on so many levels, it also reflects badly on us because all the pictures in the papers and on TV will be of them," he added. "Our message will get lost in that."

Those who argued here that Obama is like Hitler say that healthcare reform would grant doctors the power of life and death over patients, as under the Nazi regime.

The movement has also attracted members of the Council of Conservative Citizens, which supports some white supremacist causes, and from the John Birch Society and the LaRouchies. In a February 19 column in the Wall Street Journal, former Bush adviser Karl Rove described both as "fringe groups."

"If tea party groups are to maximize their influence on policy, they must now begin the difficult task of disassociating themselves from cranks and conspiracy nuts," Rove wrote. "This includes 9/11 deniers, 'birthers' who insist Barack Obama was not born in the United States, and militia supporters espousing something vaguely close to armed rebellion." (rofl)

Will this have a negative effect on the GOP in the 2010 or 2012 elections?
 
"If we hadn't had all of those bailouts the economy would be back on track by now," said Tina Dupont, a founding member of the Tea Party of West Michigan. "The jobs would be back, companies would be coming back. If they'd let the banks and others collapse, we would have had a short, sharp downturn."

Such utter fail.
 
tl;dr?
Yes, They love the constitution, the Teabaggers want to protect the Constitution by
1) Outlaw any ability to lobby for larger government, prevent the evil lies of the left by outlawing their newspapers, curtail the Code Pink protests and forcibly change the Muhammadines from being Islmaofascists
2) Prevent the Left from having guns because they will try to overthrow the constitution
3) Forcibly quarter soldiers in the evil communists houses
4) Give Homeland Security the ability to use warrantless wire tapping on the bad people
5) Keep trying the Islamofascists unit they get the death penalty
6) Terrorists have suspended habeus corpus
7) Military Tribunals
8) Waterboarding is Okay
9) You have no rights unless the constitution says you do
10) Drugs are illegal
 
tl;dr?
Yes, They love the constitution, the Teabaggers want to protect the Constitution by
1) Outlaw any ability to lobby for larger government, prevent the evil lies of the left by outlawing their newspapers, curtail the Code Pink protests and forcibly change the Muhammadines from being Islmaofascists
2) Prevent the Left from having guns because they will try to overthrow the constitution
3) Forcibly quarter soldiers in the evil communists houses
4) Give Homeland Security the ability to use warrantless wire tapping on the bad people
5) Keep trying the Islamofascists unit they get the death penalty
6) Terrorists have suspended habeus corpus
7) Military Tribunals
8) Waterboarding is Okay
9) You have no rights unless the constitution says you do
10) Drugs are illegal

Thanks for the tl;dr: I now :lol: at them even more than before.

:lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao: These people actually believe in this utter nonsense! :lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao:
 
Some of the tea-baggers aren't really that insane. The movement originates during the Bush II administration, not the Obama administration, but sorry tea-bagger grandma, the movement has already been co-opted by the lunatics and mass-media.
 
Interviews with Tea Partiers across the country paint a picture of a genuine, amorphous, conservative grassroots movement united by three core principles: constitutionally limited government, free market ideology and low taxes. The American Constitution is a rallying cry and many now dub themselves "constitutional conservatives."

They are angry not just at what they describe as the socialist policies of U.S. President Barack Obama. They also feel Republican politicians have betrayed the party's ideals. For many in the movement, purging the party of moderate Republicans is a major goal.

So lunatic fringe. :p But then we knew that. Interesting to see how it will play out. But looks like more freaks going marginal to me.
 
So lunatic fringe. :p But then we knew that. Interesting to see how it will play out. But looks like more freaks going marginal to me.

I mean, from their point of view though, I get why they are frustrated with the moderate conservatives. I mean, after looking at what Bush Jr. did in office, going completely in the opposite direction against the so called-"conservative values" (Bush increased government, etc.), I can see why they are upset.

But, they have to be pretty stupid to think that marginalizing their only probably allies is going to help them win in this year or 2012.

P.S. God help us if Ron Paul or Sarah Palin gets elected two years from now.
 
Why is this considered new??

It's been an age-old problem for both parties. There have always been tensions between radical and moderate factions of the liberal wing as well. That's what killed health care reform--arguments among factions of Democrats over how far to push it. Ironically HCR is getting a no vote from the far left because it "doesn't go far enough".

Ralph Nader has repeatedly caused Democrats to lose votes in elections, Ross Perot caused the Republicans to lose an election or two. This is nothing new.
 
I mean, from their point of view though, I get why they are frustrated with the moderate conservatives. I mean, after looking at what Bush Jr. did in office, going completely in the opposite direction against the so called-"conservative values" (Bush increased government, etc.), I can see why they are upset.

But, they have to be pretty stupid to think that marginalizing their only probably allies is going to help them win in this year or 2012.

P.S. God help us if Ron Paul or Sarah Palin gets elected two years from now.

That gets to the heart of the "what is a conservative?" question. And the reality is that a conservative is not just one thing according to one group. The post Reagan conservatives are a coalition of people, all calling themselves conservatives, and having many different agendas. Where this is breaking down is that Bush is seen so much as a failure to conservatism. Which is massively unfair to Bush, because he routinely did anything that "conservatives" claimed they wanted done to the best of his ability. But in the end he was caught between factions of conservatives, and was not specifically more one than another, and so pleased only really the Big Money interests. Well, he was elected specifically to serve the every whim of the big money interests. So all the other conservatives who voted for him got exactly what they voted for.

The teabaggers have not, to date, coalesced a specific part of the conservative agenda. They are combining a really weird view of small government with the lunatic fringe. Maybe they'll purge the lunatic fringe, maybe they won't. But either way, they are not what they think they are. They are very definitely not "fiscal conservatives". A fiscal conservative would be focussed on spending first! And taxes only after spending has been dealt with. The teabaggers demand that taxes go down first is exactly what caused the destruction of the nation's fiscal condition in the first place. If these people are actually opposed to debt, then they should be arguing for both spending cuts and tax increases.

Most American conservatives have been big government people from day one. They oppose economic regulation and welfare, but want all the other aspects of big government.

So this could be really bad for the Republicans. Because the Republican party is still dominated by the faction of conservatives that see conservatism as being lickspittles for the aristocracy. Torys, toadies, whatever. That's what they elected in Bush, and they got what they wanted.

If this gets big enough to hurt the Republicans, that would be the best outcome for everyone. But it might also move the Republican party to marginalize it's big government wing. And that wouldn't be bad either. That would weaken the social conservative "family values" crowd. And potentially weaken the lickspittles as well.

However, the real money, the Wall St money, and the money John Roberts just removed the restrictions on, favors the lickspittles above all other brands of conservatives. So potentially we could see a real schism that could weaken all the conservatives.
 
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