C2C _ Unhealthiness Mod

[Dancing Hoskuld]

I am just not sure if that is a good way to model most diseases.
Consider using differential equations and the strength of the disease as how spread the disease is on this plot, city or unit. The spreading might be slower than it really happened but we have that with several gameplay mechanics already

I am not modeling most diseases only the different ones. Smallpox is the archetype for pandemics, Malaria is a not contagious etc... These are special cases. I was going to use the property system to make them visible, it is better than using the religion or corporation system which is where the original source for the mod comes from.

 

[AIAndy]

I am not modeling most diseases only the different ones. Smallpox is the archetype for pandemics, Malaria is a not contagious etc... These are special cases. I was going to use the property system to make them visible, it is better than using the religion or corporation system which is where the original source for the mod comes from.

While Smallpox had some serious pandemies it also never went away. It was a continuous disease in e.g. the 19th century.
Malaria on the other hand is a disease that is best modelled based on plots and diffused between plots.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Add Moon Rocks
Add disease property

Is this a general Disease property or a specific one?

In other words could we start adding generic diseases based on tech/building/resouces etc? Such as ...

Anthrax
Req Tech: Livestock Domestication
Req Resoce: Sheep or Cow in City Vicinity
Disease Threshold: ?
Obsolete Tech: Smart Drugs

Special Abilities

• +1
• +1 from Sheep
• +1 from Cow

I did not want to step on your toes if you had something else in mind.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Do what you like. It is obvious I don't have the ability to do what I want to do with diseases using anything in C2C at the moment. I can't understand the property system or how it works at all. I was going to use it to at least display information about the diseases I wanted to model rather than use the religion/corporation system that the original used.

I will remove the two properties I added.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

double post

 

[Hydromancerx]

@Dancing Hoskuld

I had an idea of how to do some of your idea with systems we already have. One was making units sick. What if different diseases gave "free" anti-promotions that gave you penalties. Thus any unit produced in the city would get like a Small Pox promotion or Plague promotion.

Thus "sick" cities would not be able to produce as strong of units compared to other
"healthy" cities.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

@Dancing Hoskuld

I had an idea of how to do some of your idea with systems we already have. One was making units sick. What if different diseases gave "free" anti-promotions that gave you penalties. Thus any unit produced in the city would get like a Small Pox promotion or Plague promotion.

Thus "sick" cities would not be able to produce as strong of units compared to other
"healthy" cities.

Except that the fact that cities that are sick have a harder time producing units anyway. There is no evidence that a unit produced in a city with sickness would itself be sick since most armies only use young healthy recruits.

Perhaps for conscripted or emergancy draft units?

 

[Hydromancerx]

Bump.

 

[Hydromancerx]

A question about the Disease property: What does it represent compared to unhealthiness? Will it get some epidemic behavior?

Well that's one of the reasons why I have not added them yet. I have though about a few ways to implement it. Buildings can do a lot of things such as slow growth, trigger events, unlock units (ex plague victims), provide a resource, provide a free building to each city (ex like the goods system use to be), even prevent a building from being built in a city. They can also replace or be replaced by buildings such a cure for a disease could replace a disease. They could also gives negative promotions to units such as any unit in the city gets X disease. It can also stop resources from being in the city such as a corn disease prevents you from having corn in the city.

There is a lot of potential in how each disease could work. I do not see them all just being or , however certainly the majority of them will have some of that.

Note that I would like to use the disease rate as how contagious/dangerous/rare a disease is. Diseases the common cold would be low on the scale so most every city would have it, but it would do like only -1. Things like latitude of your city should play a factor such as diseases that only are in the tropics. Resources in the city vicinity and buildings will also play a factory in what diseases you get. Such as Mad Cow is obviously linked to the Cow resource or bird flu to the poultry resource.

Tech will play another factor such as modern diseases or future diseases. Some diseases will have cures or even cure wonders made such as Cancer. If you guys have ideas too please say so.

Posting here since this is the more appropriate topic.

 

[AIAndy]

Posting here since this is the more appropriate topic.

Right, I move over a post by me as well:

I would like to see some wave behavior on the disease property (so it is not the same as crime, which stays somewhat constant when sources and decays balance out).

That could be implemented with an Immunity property that increases more if Disease is high and reduces Disease which then stops Immunity growth and when it has decayed enough the next wave can come. Especially with spreading to trade route cities and some events that cause a strong increase in the Disease property as a kind of outbreak that would result in interesting behavior.

 

[Thunderbrd]

@Dancing Hoskuld

I had an idea of how to do some of your idea with systems we already have. One was making units sick. What if different diseases gave "free" anti-promotions that gave you penalties. Thus any unit produced in the city would get like a Small Pox promotion or Plague promotion.

Thus "sick" cities would not be able to produce as strong of units compared to other
"healthy" cities.

This would be MORE than possible soon. And if we want a chance for the unit to be sick based on the disease rate, I can set that up later too.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Now that we have auto build buildings I can get on with some of my implementations of disease. Most require me figuring out how to save data from python - last time I tried everything went pear shaped. I will have a quick version of Malaria soon.

 

[Koshling]

Now that we have auto build buildings I can get on with some of my implementations of disease. Most require me figuring out how to save data from python - last time I tried everything went pear shaped. I will have a quick version of Malaria soon.

Given the property system and auto build what state needs saving from Python? The need to do this is slightly sounding warning bells with me - can you clarify?

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Given the property system and auto build what state needs saving from Python? The need to do this is slightly sounding warning bells with me - can you clarify?

I think I was posting at 3am and got two ideas mixed when I typed that. I don't need it for Malaria or Small Pox which are the two diseases I want to get in. I don't understand the spread mechanism yet/still.

One reason is I need to know when a religion was founded (because of Choose Religions and Divine Prophets) to figure out when to drop the number of missionaries available for the religion.

I also need a way of keeping track of how you have interacted with the Indigenous Peoples through actions and events. Can I store that as a nation property? I then need to use it in events both as triggers and modifiers to outcomes.

Which reminds me @AIAndy I have created a couple of variables in A_New_Dawn_GlobalDefines.XML for escorting animals back to the city or not. However when I use the variable in the killoutcome outcome subdue I get an error.

			<KillOutcomes>
				<Outcome>
					<OutcomeType>OUTCOME_SUBDUE</OutcomeType>
					<iChance>10</iChance>
					<UnitType>UNIT_SUBDUED_AARDVARK</UnitType>
					<bUnitToCity>ESCORT_SUBDUED_LAND_ANIMALS</bUnitToCity>
				</Outcome>

 

[AIAndy]

Which reminds me @AIAndy I have created a couple of variables in A_New_Dawn_GlobalDefines.XML for escorting animals back to the city or not. However when I use the variable in the killoutcome outcome subdue I get an error.

			<KillOutcomes>
				<Outcome>
					<OutcomeType>OUTCOME_SUBDUE</OutcomeType>
					<iChance>10</iChance>
					<UnitType>UNIT_SUBDUED_AARDVARK</UnitType>
					<bUnitToCity>ESCORT_SUBDUED_LAND_ANIMALS</bUnitToCity>
				</Outcome>

What error do you get?

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

What error do you get?

I think I may have had an old schema file before. I also have the variable backwards. I am testing it again now.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Link to video.

So with the new diseases do you think it will end up like this?

 

[Thunderbrd]

I'll have to reply when I can hear it... no sound at the moment.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

IIRC Pandemic the game is a multi player board game where the players cooperate to try and stop the game killing the world's population.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Thanks for explaining DH!

BTW: I'll be posting full details on the tags and dynamics on the disease mechanism from the Combat Mod hopefully by end of day tomorrow. I've been spending some of the evening planning out how to present it all for the mod team. I discussed the potential in the second Combat Mod introduction but not enough about the technical details of the tags. I'm open to further discussion on how things can be tweaked as well so please make sure to read and comment and ask questions on anything you want clarified.