Minor Leaders
- Thread starter Valkrionn
- Start date
Valkrionn
The Hamster King
That works. 
The Malakim have Three Leaders, two full leaders (Kane and Varn) and one Weird Leader (Decius). I felt that maybe Talia would be a good fit for the Malakim as a leader.
Talia Gosam
Civilization: The Malakim
Traits
If Normal Leader: Philosophical/Defender
If Minor Leader: Philosophical/Minor
If Emergent Leader: Influential/Emergent
Inspiring Trait
Reasoning (Influential) Essentially a variant of the Philosophical trait, Influential is designed to give Talia's influence in the Malakim Councils a boost, helping her generate more GPP and as cities develop, specific types, as Talia uses her influence to sway the direction of the councils.
Religious Weights
OO +10, Empyrean +50, CoE +20, AV -50, Order -10, RoK +30, FoL +20, Ordo Mechanos -10, White Hand -20
Play Style
Like Varn, Talia is a builder. While she will produce an active military focus, her unit focus is a bit more diverse than Varn's disciple spam. She, like other "Good" leaders, is Honorable, and wont declare at pleased. However, military will always be secondary to Wonderspam for her.
Favored Civic Pacifism
Favorite Wonder Seems like the Resplendent Minaret (which I have never seen in game) fits with the Malakim rather well. Otherwise, the Hall of Kings would be a good fit.
Diplotexts Coming soon
Image
Talia Gosam
Civilization: The Malakim
Traits
If Normal Leader: Philosophical/Defender
If Minor Leader: Philosophical/Minor
If Emergent Leader: Influential/Emergent
Inspiring Trait
- +15% GPP
- +1 Free Specialist in all cities
Reasoning (Influential) Essentially a variant of the Philosophical trait, Influential is designed to give Talia's influence in the Malakim Councils a boost, helping her generate more GPP and as cities develop, specific types, as Talia uses her influence to sway the direction of the councils.
Religious Weights
OO +10, Empyrean +50, CoE +20, AV -50, Order -10, RoK +30, FoL +20, Ordo Mechanos -10, White Hand -20
Play Style
Like Varn, Talia is a builder. While she will produce an active military focus, her unit focus is a bit more diverse than Varn's disciple spam. She, like other "Good" leaders, is Honorable, and wont declare at pleased. However, military will always be secondary to Wonderspam for her.
Favored Civic Pacifism
Favorite Wonder Seems like the Resplendent Minaret (which I have never seen in game) fits with the Malakim rather well. Otherwise, the Hall of Kings would be a good fit.
Diplotexts Coming soon
Image
Spoiler :
KillerClowns
Emperor
- Joined
- Oct 6, 2007
- Messages
- 1,139
Oh, boy. First and foremost, if you haven't read it yet, Ms. Gosam is explicitly described as being pagan in the intro to Lord of the Balors, and never did convert. I'd suggest giving her the biggest pluses towards FoL as a result, except that from a gameplay perspective that's a bad idea; Malakim deserts don't support forests. Personally, I'd leave it all level so far as religion weights go, save some minuses towards AV and maybe a slight pro-Empyrean bonus.
Artwise, I like Aurora the best of your lot, but I think Talia is a GP and thus, has a pic selected for that purpose... I'm to lazy to hunt it down, though.
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
Talia is a Druidess and a witch, and was considered a great magical prodigy among her people although her abilities are far less than those of Auric. The Arcane Trait might fit her better than Philosophical.
While most elves prefer forests, the Fellowship of the Leaves is not limited to supporting this one biome. We see in the scenarios that Talia has come to love the Oases in the Malakim desert even more than the forests, as the barren lands around them highlights the value of what does live there. (Hmm...I wonder if it would be worth it to create an Ancient Forest equivalent for Oases.)
FoL does fit her best, but she is rather open to listening to other spirits too, unfortunately including the Demoness Lethe.
Also, note that her people are not Once-Elves like Varn; she is a Ljosalfar whom Haerlond Gossam granted access to their Library, until Gosea the Dwindling stole the Heartstone and Talia was falsely accused of being involved and so was imprisoned.
Most of those seem far too fair skinned. I would lean towards the second Desert Queen, although Talia should be curvier.
While Varn may not have succeeded in leading Talia to follow Lugus, it was his love for her that lead the god to choose him as his messenger.
Talia would definitely need to be of Neutral Alignment, not Good. Her sexual infidelity alone would tend to lead to that conclusion, but it is strongly backed up by her words too. In the scenarios, Talia makes it clear that she does not care for the idealism and unyielding nature of "Good," but prefers the much more prudent moderation of "Neutral."
While most elves prefer forests, the Fellowship of the Leaves is not limited to supporting this one biome. We see in the scenarios that Talia has come to love the Oases in the Malakim desert even more than the forests, as the barren lands around them highlights the value of what does live there. (Hmm...I wonder if it would be worth it to create an Ancient Forest equivalent for Oases.)
TXT_KEY_WB_WAGES_OF_SIN_TALIA_1_MALAKIM said:
FoL does fit her best, but she is rather open to listening to other spirits too, unfortunately including the Demoness Lethe.
Also, note that her people are not Once-Elves like Varn; she is a Ljosalfar whom Haerlond Gossam granted access to their Library, until Gosea the Dwindling stole the Heartstone and Talia was falsely accused of being involved and so was imprisoned.
Most of those seem far too fair skinned. I would lean towards the second Desert Queen, although Talia should be curvier.
(Hopefully this is too short for Kael to mind me sharing this description of Talia. Note that this is after spending several days if not several in the sunless Wall of Shadows, and certainly before moving to the sunny Desert of Myhr, so she probably only got tanner.)Ashes of Brigdarrow. said:
While Varn may not have succeeded in leading Talia to follow Lugus, it was his love for her that lead the god to choose him as his messenger.
Talia would definitely need to be of Neutral Alignment, not Good. Her sexual infidelity alone would tend to lead to that conclusion, but it is strongly backed up by her words too. In the scenarios, Talia makes it clear that she does not care for the idealism and unyielding nature of "Good," but prefers the much more prudent moderation of "Neutral."
TXT_KEY_WB_WAGES_OF_SIN_TALIA_1_MALAKIM said:
TXT_KEY_WB_WAGES_OF_SIN_TALIA_2_CALABIM said:
Valkrionn
The Hamster King
I'm not too sure about using Talia... Mostly because the majority of the new leaders (in my mind) come from a time AFTER the scenarios... Whereas Talia is dead by that point.
I like the basic idea for it though... Especially the Emergent version. The Malakim need an Emergent leader anyway. Might just toss a different name on her.
Actually... Any specific lore on whether or not Varn and Talia had kids? Could claim she's the daughter.
Also, about to start the poll. Only have two entries, sadly.
I like the basic idea for it though... Especially the Emergent version. The Malakim need an Emergent leader anyway. Might just toss a different name on her.
Actually... Any specific lore on whether or not Varn and Talia had kids? Could claim she's the daughter.
Also, about to start the poll. Only have two entries, sadly.
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
There is no reference to then having children, and I presume they did not. It is clearly shown that Varn has not been having sex with Talia for quite a while due to his focus on his religious duties, which could make it more difficult for her to conceive a child.
I have no real evidence for this, but I like to think that Talia was pregnant with Decius's child when she killed herself. The child probably died with her, as the scenarios don't mention Varn having to cut it from her dying flesh. Also, the responsibility of raising her son or daughter would probably have dissuaded him from heading out to avenge her so recklessly. It seems more likely that she committed suicide only a few weeks into the pregnancy, either without knowing it or in order to stop the birth of a child that would forever remind her and her husband of her indiscretions.
(I also baselessly like to think that Eve was pregnant with the child of the man with whom she cheated on Kylorin, whom I like to think was his Magister Equitum and the greatest Hippus hero of that age. (I like to call him Mealthiel, and claim Altheriol-ta- means something like "tomb of.") I imagine Eve dieing in childbirth, after making Kylorin swear to raise her son as his own. I imagine Kylorin begrudgingly adopting him and treating him well, although remaining rather distant from the boy who looked remarkably like his real father. I picture this ending on the day he asked for permission to marry. His bride to be would of course turn out to be first reincarnation of his mother, whom he found before Kylorin could. The bond between a mother and son who had never met and were of the same age was misinterpreted as sexual attraction, and he may have impregnated his mother by the time he introduced her to the Emperor. The homicidal rage that followed would be the stuff of legend. After a brief civil war, the king who had until then still appeared benevolent would become an absolute tyrant, he would seek apprentices rather than keeping his powers a secret, and the worship of Ceridwen would go from a secretive cult with just a few practitioners among the most elite to the de jure state religion.
Do you think that is dark enough for Erebus?)
I have no real evidence for this, but I like to think that Talia was pregnant with Decius's child when she killed herself. The child probably died with her, as the scenarios don't mention Varn having to cut it from her dying flesh. Also, the responsibility of raising her son or daughter would probably have dissuaded him from heading out to avenge her so recklessly. It seems more likely that she committed suicide only a few weeks into the pregnancy, either without knowing it or in order to stop the birth of a child that would forever remind her and her husband of her indiscretions.
(I also baselessly like to think that Eve was pregnant with the child of the man with whom she cheated on Kylorin, whom I like to think was his Magister Equitum and the greatest Hippus hero of that age. (I like to call him Mealthiel, and claim Altheriol-ta- means something like "tomb of.") I imagine Eve dieing in childbirth, after making Kylorin swear to raise her son as his own. I imagine Kylorin begrudgingly adopting him and treating him well, although remaining rather distant from the boy who looked remarkably like his real father. I picture this ending on the day he asked for permission to marry. His bride to be would of course turn out to be first reincarnation of his mother, whom he found before Kylorin could. The bond between a mother and son who had never met and were of the same age was misinterpreted as sexual attraction, and he may have impregnated his mother by the time he introduced her to the Emperor. The homicidal rage that followed would be the stuff of legend. After a brief civil war, the king who had until then still appeared benevolent would become an absolute tyrant, he would seek apprentices rather than keeping his powers a secret, and the worship of Ceridwen would go from a secretive cult with just a few practitioners among the most elite to the de jure state religion.
Do you think that is dark enough for Erebus?)
Valkrionn
The Hamster King
That's definitely dark enough.
After I made the post I actually thought about Talia/Decius having a child... I'd be willing to tweak the lore enough for a child to be born first. Say she gave her to a hand-maiden, so Varn wasn't aware of the birth when he went to avenge her?
After I made the post I actually thought about Talia/Decius having a child... I'd be willing to tweak the lore enough for a child to be born first. Say she gave her to a hand-maiden, so Varn wasn't aware of the birth when he went to avenge her?
thats all well and good ... but it doesnt explain how Kylorin dissapeared after the age of ice, if he instead decided to kill the Amurite/Hippus subnation under Melathiel's son. Which by the way, I love the combo idea of hippus and amurites xD
Jabie
Wanted in Monte Carlo...
That's definitely dark enough.
After I made the post I actually thought about Talia/Decius having a child... I'd be willing to tweak the lore enough for a child to be born first. Say she gave her to a hand-maiden, so Varn wasn't aware of the birth when he went to avenge her?
Hiding him in a basket down by the river is a tried and tested way of producing great historical figures...
DarkReborn
Dancing Mad
I see you're lacking ideas on on Sheaim leaders (or so it seems in the first post), so here's an entry of mine, I had tough of him as an ambiguous Balseraph and Sheaim leader (much like... the leader who's both Bannor and Calabim, I forgot his name), and he's based on a popular RPG character:
Kefca Zalapo (I know it sounds weird, it's intended
)
Evil
Balseraph/Sheaim
Traits:
Insane (same as Perpentach, maybe toned down a bit, because there's one trait from the list he must keep for lore purposes)
Treacherous
And I was thinking of a new trait (the one that mustn't change)...
Nihilist- something to do with accelerating the Armageddon counter, a bonus on chaos mana, or similar. It won't work in games where the AC is disabled, that's what the chaos mana bonus is for.
Kefca Zalappo is the sometimes ambassador, sometimes executor, of the Momus' court, a quite mad and sadistic man. Legend says, that Kefca one was a normal person, a mage, who had the misfortune of crossing paths with a Sheaim warlock. The warlock promised Kefca unimaginable power, if he agreed to partake in a experiment relating Chaos mana energy. Indeed, the experiment infused raw Chaos mana in his body, giving him incredible and destructive power. The setback was that it left his mind quite unstable. Once a reserved, serious man, Kefca started to wear strange, buffoon-like robes, and makeup that resembled that of a clown and speak in a high pitched voice, in a pattern that was weird to hear.
He then realized it, nothing was forever, everything that the races of Erebus strived for, would eventually wither and die. There were legends of that, given the right circumstances, even the Gods could die. Every thing, every life, every feat, in that world was worthless, as they will be but a mere footnote in the book of existence.
He would become a mere tool of Armageddon? -No- He would become Armageddon Incarnate, the God of Apocalypse, the Architect of non-existence. Everything should, and must eventually be destroyed. But first, he needed pawns for his diabolic chess game. Using his eccentric charisma, he charmed the Balseraph population, and preaching his ideal of doom, he enslaved the Sheaim. He didn't care about Os-Gabella or Perpentach, as both leaders were mere hindrances on his plan, and eventually would be destroyed too.
Dreams, life, hope, all is doomed.
(possible artwork, subject to change if Valkrionn wants so)
(is not that a blatant ripoff, after all, Guybrush Threepwood is in game and it is really him)
Kefca Zalapo (I know it sounds weird, it's intended
)Evil
Balseraph/Sheaim
Traits:
Insane (same as Perpentach, maybe toned down a bit, because there's one trait from the list he must keep for lore purposes)
Treacherous
And I was thinking of a new trait (the one that mustn't change)...
Nihilist- something to do with accelerating the Armageddon counter, a bonus on chaos mana, or similar. It won't work in games where the AC is disabled, that's what the chaos mana bonus is for.
Kefca Zalappo is the sometimes ambassador, sometimes executor, of the Momus' court, a quite mad and sadistic man. Legend says, that Kefca one was a normal person, a mage, who had the misfortune of crossing paths with a Sheaim warlock. The warlock promised Kefca unimaginable power, if he agreed to partake in a experiment relating Chaos mana energy. Indeed, the experiment infused raw Chaos mana in his body, giving him incredible and destructive power. The setback was that it left his mind quite unstable. Once a reserved, serious man, Kefca started to wear strange, buffoon-like robes, and makeup that resembled that of a clown and speak in a high pitched voice, in a pattern that was weird to hear.
He then realized it, nothing was forever, everything that the races of Erebus strived for, would eventually wither and die. There were legends of that, given the right circumstances, even the Gods could die. Every thing, every life, every feat, in that world was worthless, as they will be but a mere footnote in the book of existence.
He would become a mere tool of Armageddon? -No- He would become Armageddon Incarnate, the God of Apocalypse, the Architect of non-existence. Everything should, and must eventually be destroyed. But first, he needed pawns for his diabolic chess game. Using his eccentric charisma, he charmed the Balseraph population, and preaching his ideal of doom, he enslaved the Sheaim. He didn't care about Os-Gabella or Perpentach, as both leaders were mere hindrances on his plan, and eventually would be destroyed too.
Dreams, life, hope, all is doomed.
(possible artwork, subject to change if Valkrionn wants so)
(is not that a blatant ripoff, after all, Guybrush Threepwood is in game and it is really him
)
Valkrionn
The Hamster King
Hmm... I like it, though I miss the game reference.
A toned down insane, huh? I could do that... would only give one trait at a time rather than three, and would allow preservation of a different trait. Essentially a forced Adaptive. Could be useful for other leaders/modders too... But what to call it?
A toned down insane, huh? I could do that... would only give one trait at a time rather than three, and would allow preservation of a different trait. Essentially a forced Adaptive. Could be useful for other leaders/modders too... But what to call it?
Secret_Squirrel
Chieftain
- Joined
- Jun 19, 2009
- Messages
- 76
Whimsical? Capricious? Impulsive?
Quetz
The Tallest Lilliputian
Reference, one of the most brilliant villains ever imo:
http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Kefka_Palazzo
At least read the part on Ascent to Godhood, and Symbolism... I'd find it hard to believe he didnt inspire Perpenatach at all XD
And ofc, play the theme bits and his giggle under music... man does that bring back memories.
And if interested, Sydney symphony orchestra performing his battle theme, sure to give a chill or two...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BK7ROzLVl8&feature=related
Would love to see him in.
http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Kefka_Palazzo
At least read the part on Ascent to Godhood, and Symbolism... I'd find it hard to believe he didnt inspire Perpenatach at all XD
And ofc, play the theme bits and his giggle under music... man does that bring back memories.
And if interested, Sydney symphony orchestra performing his battle theme, sure to give a chill or two...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BK7ROzLVl8&feature=related
Would love to see him in.
lemonjelly
Modding For Ethne
I like impulsive
x
x
DarkReborn
Dancing Mad
I'm glad you liked the idea
Whimsical then for the toned down Insane, it sounds archaic enough
And yes, he's a reference to the mad dancing wizard, Kefka Palazzo, there's a lot of FF references in the Grigori faction, why not one outside of them?
He's like... a more destructive Perpentach.
EDIT:
His possible diplomacy theme:
http://www.newgrounds.com/audio/listen/178518
I know it's Kefka's normal theme, but Dancing Mad if just too awesome to waste it in such way
Whimsical then for the toned down Insane, it sounds archaic enough
And yes, he's a reference to the mad dancing wizard, Kefka Palazzo, there's a lot of FF references in the Grigori faction, why not one outside of them?
He's like... a more destructive Perpentach.
EDIT:
His possible diplomacy theme:
http://www.newgrounds.com/audio/listen/178518
I know it's Kefka's normal theme, but Dancing Mad if just too awesome to waste it in such way
Valkrionn
The Hamster King
Ah, Final Fantasy... No PS2/3, so I've never really been able to play them. Of course, nowadays I have a PS2 emulator but started with FF10.
I love the theme music.
Going to have to use it.
Hmm... I like whimsical and imbalanced.
I love the theme music.
Going to have to use it.Hmm... I like whimsical and imbalanced.
Opera
Deity
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2008
- Messages
- 4,643
Unfortunately, FF6 is a SNES game! So, shame on you!Ah, Final Fantasy... No PS2/3, so I've never really been able to play them. Of course, nowadays I have a PS2 emulator but started with FF10.
KillerClowns
Emperor
- Joined
- Oct 6, 2007
- Messages
- 1,139
I love a good reference, even to a game I only know of through cultural osmosis, though I'd be tempted to drop the first name and just go with "Zapalo." I'd also propose a minor change to his lore for a better fit with Erebus, whose leaders are pretty sharp individuals. Make him only believe he's outwitted/mastered Os-Gabella when, in truth, she's entirely aware of his schemes, fully aware that he hasn't the slightest hope of mastering Armageddon like he dreams of (Ceridwen would have his skull for trying), but completely willing to let him believe that if it helps push the world and, by extension, her own life, closer to its end. Perpentach, being a master mind reader, would also know Zapalo's plan, but I can see him finding it so fascinating he'd willingly play the fool just to see how it turns out.
