UN & The Peacekeepers!

[Schuesseled]

This post is to describe my hopes for the UN building, this isn't in anyway confirmed to be in the game.

The Unit Nations like normal is available at the later eras, constructing the UN brings the UN Council into existence.

Upon building the wonder every civ and "free" city state is offered membership, this membership is optional, it can be accepted or declined.

The Council President is able to draft policies for the attention of the members of the council, there are two basic types of policies, internal and external. Internal policies only affect the members of the UN, external policies can affect everyone.

When a policy is presented to the council for vote, the voters have three options, vote yes, vote no, and Defy Policy. The majority of votes determines the outcome of the vote, the votes are yes and no. Defying the policy, involves terminating your membership with the UN (opting out as I call it) or can have other consequences as ill mention later. Its important to note though that your defiance won't simply negate the vote proceedure like in civ 4 it will simply remove you from it, if the vote was for example open borders between members, then none would have open borders imposed on you or from you on them, and you would have to join the council again later when a period of greivance expires before you can vote again.

Internal policies are simple and won't involve much hardship, if you disagree you can walk away, but external policies imply policies that the UN are voting to have imposed on civs, pretty much whether they like it or not. And these can be deadly.

When an external policy is voted yes on by the majority it is then presented to the non-members, giving you a choice of sumbitting to the policy or preparing for war, but not with the UN members but with UN itself and its Peacekeepers!

The Council Leader has the ability to propose a policy to set up a peacekeeping force, to impose its policies on non-co-operators and defend the peace it was set up to preserve.

After creation, the peacekeepers act very much like thier own civ, except they do not have thier own cities and are completley dependent on the Council members for maintenance and recruitment for thier armies.

The peacekeepers are seperate from the UN members, they do not answer to them (without a council vote) and are not required to protect or help them in anyway unless the council gives them the orders. But thier usefullness comes with thier large numbers (being fueled by every member) and thier great lopgisitics, peacekeeper troops can march through any members territory.

They are the UN's sword and they are sharp!

Now lets get to some specifics!

Policies

Here are some examples:

Internal

Grant Liberation - Liberates all captured City States controlled by members.

Grant Freedom - Liberates all Puppet States owned by members.

Puppet States are set up as mini-civs with thier own council vote unless a member has rightful claim for settling them, and then they are returned.
If made into mini-civs, they will have peaceful relations with most UN members, maybe not thier previous tormentors, and will set up alliances with other little mini-civs.

Grant Emancipation - All annexed cities within members territory are returned to thier rightful owners (settled based) or if not applicable become mini-civs like above.

Assemble UN Peacekeeping Force - UN Peacekeeper formed from member's armies (includes all members city states and mini-civs included)

Essentially 10% of all units (of all miltary types) are gifted to the peacekeeping force, however the troops you give away by voting yes will still take up your resource limit, and maintenance costs will be spread out among all members for the entire cost of these armies.

The peacekeepers will then move the troops as they see fit, probably forming several battle groups along troublesome areas, ready for when they are needed

The oeacekeepers don't have the ability to declare war on thiewr own but can be declared war on, a aggresive civ may try to eliminate peacekeeper forces, not declaring war on members but on the UN army. Which of course brings negative modiferes to future diplomacy, and the peacekeepers may also ask for help from individual memebrs (please go to war close by civ!) or from the council (help need reinforcements, join me in battle pls!)

Reinforce Peacekeepers - Additional 10% of current forces given to the peacekeepers.

Continued requests for military support may be seen as too much from members and may simply opt out of the council at that point taking with them any units already given over to the peacekeepers, so don't ask too much, or you could get less.

Elect Council President - Unlike other policies this one may be proposed by any member at any time, a cooling off period exists after this vote is called. The majority vote in a new leader to set policies.

Elect World President - Diplomatic Victory!.

Unlike all other policies this one offers votes to all civs and city states, and mini-civs, if a large majority vote for the same person then its game over baby! (members and non-members)

External Policies

After being successfully voted by council members, the policy is then presented to non-membners, they ahve the choice of submitting to the will of the council of facing the wrath of the peacekeepers. If they choose to refuse the peacekeepers will attempt to force it upon them for example if they won't liberate thier city states then the peacekeepers will role in and rip them out of thier greedy fingers.

Enforce Liberation - Liberates all captured City States controlled by all civs.

Enforce Freedom - Liberates all Puppet States.

Puppet States are set up as mini-civs with thier own council vote unless a member has rightful claim for settling them, and then they are returned.
If made into mini-civs, they will have peaceful relations with most UN members, and submitters of the will, maybe not thier previous tormentors, and will set up alliances with other little mini-civs.

Enforce Emancipation - All annexed cities are returned to thier rightful owners (settled based) or if not applicable become mini-civs like above.

Defend Member - Peacekeeper troops are order to defend the territory of member under attack by non-member.

Crush Enemy Civ/Barbarian - Peacekeeper troops are order to attack and destroy the UN's foe.

The peacekeepers will attmept to liberate non-native cities rather than destroy, it will however burn a whole through native cities of the enemy until there all dead, or the council votes to stop military action.

Cooler diplomacy with the UN, throw in your ideas.

 

[Tylerryan79]

You forgot abstain

 

[Schuesseled]

Why would you want to abstain, if you simply don't care pick randomly.

 

[Mercade]

Why would you want to abstain, if you simply don't care pick randomly.

Because you should have the right not to have an opinion.

 

[muhtesem insan]

You forgot abstain

in practice no and abstain is same. Only yes votes are counted.

 

[Ddude97]

But no counts against you

 

[Tylerryan79]

Abstain is for when you don't care, but don't want to influence the vote. If you vote no then it could turn the tide of the vote. If you abstain the the vote could still win.

Say a vote comes up to return a city to civ x. I personally don't care. I'll abstain, rather than influence the vote.

 

[bestrfcplayer]

That's a really great idea you have there Schuesseled.

 

[Schuesseled]

Thank you, you have just surpased my life long friend on my buddy list. well i wouldnt go that far, but thank you.

 

[Never]

Some of those ideas aren't bad but in reality would anybody ever allow annexed cities or captured city-states be returned to their rightful owners? That's pretty much tantamount to retiring the game.

 

[Schuesseled]

Some of those ideas aren't bad but in reality would anybody ever allow annexed cities or captured city-states be returned to their rightful owners? That's pretty much tantamount to retiring the game.

just an example of some of the policies, you could have others like equal distribution of city-states, the peace keepers go out and capture them for you. Another could be break-up an empire into smaller section for each member to have control over, the possibilities are endless really.

And there is a reason for accepting those policies, if it doesn't cripple you then it can make a lot of new little civs to interact with, and of course if it affects an enemy more then theres always a reason to do it.

 

[Tylerryan79]

Some of those ideas aren't bad but in reality would anybody ever allow annexed cities or captured city-states be returned to their rightful owners? That's pretty much tantamount to retiring the game.

I remeber in one game of iv I played where I had a city that was captured far away from my main cities, and the ai who was in charge of the vote would constently put it up for a vote to return it to me. Then I'd get it back, and the civ would attack that city only, and recapture it. This happened about five times, it was pretty annoying. I was stretched so thin I couldn't defend it. Anyways, it does happen. I used to do it for civs that I tool under my wing also.

 

[Never]

Yeah but you had the choice to give away one city, what the OP is suggesting is that all conquered territory would be handed back to the original settling nation. I just can't see anybody willing to do that. Sure maybe three or four select cities but imagine handing back all conquered territory. In most games I play that represents 90% of my landmass... So yeah you'd pretty much be forfeiting the game.

 

[rocketsfan05]

Sounds great, but what do you think of this: In addition to what you have for all external policies there is a defy resolution button this wouldn't kick you out of the UN but rather let you break, at your own risk of course. Let's say the external resolution is to ban nukes. You could vote defy. A defy would count as a no, but if the resolution passed you would be able to build nukes. However you would receive cumulative penalties if discovered(50% chance of getting caught) starting with economic sanctions(-1 international trade route in all cities), then maybe tougher sanctions(anything from losing another trade route to losing all deals with other countries) then maybe peacekeeping(all nations in the UN would declare war on you, however members would be allowed to "defy" declaration of war and not fight).

 

[Verenti]

There would have to be a security council too, giving a permenant veto to the top five players, and trying to disrupt someone's sphere of influence should generate diplomatic heat, and cause affected civs to opt to withdraw. Also, it should be much less than 10% of the military.

There should also be a "Disband UN" motion, if the power is abused. However it should be able to be reformed, maybe a different name than "United Nations" like "Transnational League", or maybe have a series of names like "League of Nations" etc. etc.

I miss council from SMAC.

 

[migkillertwo]

This post is to describe my hopes for the UN building, this isn't in anyway confirmed to be in the game.

The Unit Nations like normal is available at the later eras, constructing the UN brings the UN Council into existence.

Upon building the wonder every civ and "free" city state is offered membership, this membership is optional, it can be accepted or declined.

The Council President is able to draft policies for the attention of the members of the council, there are two basic types of policies, internal and external. Internal policies only affect the members of the UN, external policies can affect everyone.

When a policy is presented to the council for vote, the voters have three options, vote yes, vote no, and Defy Policy. The majority of votes determines the outcome of the vote, the votes are yes and no. Defying the policy, involves terminating your membership with the UN (opting out as I call it) or can have other consequences as ill mention later. Its important to note though that your defiance won't simply negate the vote proceedure like in civ 4 it will simply remove you from it, if the vote was for example open borders between members, then none would have open borders imposed on you or from you on them, and you would have to join the council again later when a period of greivance expires before you can vote again.

Internal policies are simple and won't involve much hardship, if you disagree you can walk away, but external policies imply policies that the UN are voting to have imposed on civs, pretty much whether they like it or not. And these can be deadly.

When an external policy is voted yes on by the majority it is then presented to the non-members, giving you a choice of sumbitting to the policy or preparing for war, but not with the UN members but with UN itself and its Peacekeepers!

The Council Leader has the ability to propose a policy to set up a peacekeeping force, to impose its policies on non-co-operators and defend the peace it was set up to preserve.

After creation, the peacekeepers act very much like thier own civ, except they do not have thier own cities and are completley dependent on the Council members for maintenance and recruitment for thier armies.

The peacekeepers are seperate from the UN members, they do not answer to them (without a council vote) and are not required to protect or help them in anyway unless the council gives them the orders. But thier usefullness comes with thier large numbers (being fueled by every member) and thier great lopgisitics, peacekeeper troops can march through any members territory.

They are the UN's sword and they are sharp!

Now lets get to some specifics!

Policies

Here are some examples:

Internal

Grant Liberation - Liberates all captured City States controlled by members.

Grant Freedom - Liberates all Puppet States owned by members.

Puppet States are set up as mini-civs with thier own council vote unless a member has rightful claim for settling them, and then they are returned.
If made into mini-civs, they will have peaceful relations with most UN members, maybe not thier previous tormentors, and will set up alliances with other little mini-civs.

Grant Emancipation - All annexed cities within members territory are returned to thier rightful owners (settled based) or if not applicable become mini-civs like above.

Assemble UN Peacekeeping Force - UN Peacekeeper formed from member's armies (includes all members city states and mini-civs included)

Essentially 10% of all units (of all miltary types) are gifted to the peacekeeping force, however the troops you give away by voting yes will still take up your resource limit, and maintenance costs will be spread out among all members for the entire cost of these armies.

The peacekeepers will then move the troops as they see fit, probably forming several battle groups along troublesome areas, ready for when they are needed

The oeacekeepers don't have the ability to declare war on thiewr own but can be declared war on, a aggresive civ may try to eliminate peacekeeper forces, not declaring war on members but on the UN army. Which of course brings negative modiferes to future diplomacy, and the peacekeepers may also ask for help from individual memebrs (please go to war close by civ!) or from the council (help need reinforcements, join me in battle pls!)

Reinforce Peacekeepers - Additional 10% of current forces given to the peacekeepers.

Continued requests for military support may be seen as too much from members and may simply opt out of the council at that point taking with them any units already given over to the peacekeepers, so don't ask too much, or you could get less.

Elect Council President - Unlike other policies this one may be proposed by any member at any time, a cooling off period exists after this vote is called. The majority vote in a new leader to set policies.

Elect World President - Diplomatic Victory!.

Unlike all other policies this one offers votes to all civs and city states, and mini-civs, if a large majority vote for the same person then its game over baby! (members and non-members)

External Policies

After being successfully voted by council members, the policy is then presented to non-membners, they ahve the choice of submitting to the will of the council of facing the wrath of the peacekeepers. If they choose to refuse the peacekeepers will attempt to force it upon them for example if they won't liberate thier city states then the peacekeepers will role in and rip them out of thier greedy fingers.

Enforce Liberation - Liberates all captured City States controlled by all civs.

Enforce Freedom - Liberates all Puppet States.

Puppet States are set up as mini-civs with thier own council vote unless a member has rightful claim for settling them, and then they are returned.
If made into mini-civs, they will have peaceful relations with most UN members, and submitters of the will, maybe not thier previous tormentors, and will set up alliances with other little mini-civs.

Enforce Emancipation - All annexed cities are returned to thier rightful owners (settled based) or if not applicable become mini-civs like above.

Defend Member - Peacekeeper troops are order to defend the territory of member under attack by non-member.

Crush Enemy Civ/Barbarian - Peacekeeper troops are order to attack and destroy the UN's foe.

The peacekeepers will attmept to liberate non-native cities rather than destroy, it will however burn a whole through native cities of the enemy until there all dead, or the council votes to stop military action.

Cooler diplomacy with the UN, throw in your ideas.

I think the UN Secretary general should be the one who controls the units, and that civs contribute already-existing units to the peacekeeping operation.

Also I think that civs should be allowed to retract their peacekeeping forces after a certain amount of turns.

 

[Ddude97]

I think the UN Secretary general should be the one who controls the units, and that civs contribute already-existing units to the peacekeeping operation.

Also I think that civs should be allowed to retract their peacekeeping forces after a certain amount of turns.

Might be nice, but that's just asking to be abused

 

[awesome]

yeah, should be one city at a time.

 

[Schuesseled]

Yeah but you had the choice to give away one city, what the OP is suggesting is that all conquered territory would be handed back to the original settling nation. I just can't see anybody willing to do that. Sure maybe three or four select cities but imagine handing back all conquered territory. In most games I play that represents 90% of my landmass... So yeah you'd pretty much be forfeiting the game.

The point is to use the policy to reduce a enemy who has a really big empire, without actually having to go to war with them, in return you and everyone else gives up thier empires, and let the peacekeepers give it a shot.

If your the one with the biggest empire, you'd either simply never put it through to the vote, or if an AI is the council leader, then you simply opt out of the UN at that time, taking your forces from the peacecore, and preparing for the fight of your life.

 

[Peng Qi]

I just want the UN to be more realistic. That is to say, unless its members actually choose to enforce the resolutions, the resolutions should be meaningless. Iran defies the UN all the time and nothing bad happens to them and they still get to be members, I don't know why defying a resolution should make you leave the UN or cause any unhappiness or penalties in your cities (if anything, the Iranian people get a sense of nationalistic pride that they can just do whatever they want and laugh in the face of the UN).