Voting Instructions
Players, please cast your votes in the poll above. Vote "Yea" for every proposal you'd be okay with if it were implemented. Vote "Nay" if you'd be okay if these proposals weren't implemented. You can vote for any number of options.
All votes are public. If you wish, you can discuss your choice(s) in the thread below. You can change your vote as many times as you want until the poll closes.
VP Congress: Session 5, Proposal 25
Proposer: @Stalker0
Current Austria UA
+50% bonus from CS quests. May arrange marriages with allied CS using gold (not explicitly noted, cost: 500 gold, +100 per previous marriage). While at peace with CS, marriages increasing resting CS influence by 200, grant 1 vote, and boost GP generation in the capital by 15%.
Proposal
Rationale
Austria is commonly cited as one of the most "oppresive" Civs, as her vote bonus from marriages can give her such an overwhelming WC advantage that the only way to stop her is extermination. This is further backed up by the AI results data, which shows Austria routinely in the top 3 civs version after version. Austria's need for a nerf is clear.
This proposal removes her vote bonus, the source of her oppression. Her quest bonus has been increased to make this the focus of her diplomatic playstyle. The bonus has now gone from a nice bonus to something that will help shape her play and so keeping the CS "happy" by completing quests will now be a core part of Austria's strength....rather than a sideshow. Her general GP bonus has been further weakened, to make her quest bonus more of the focus.
The change to her resting influence is meant to provide a strategic tradeoff between how fast she chooses to marry a civ. She can marry early at a lower influence rate, or push influence higher to get a really strong resting influence rate with the civ.
VP Congress: Session 5, Proposal 25a
Proposer: @Solic
Discussion Thread: (5-30a) Counterproposal Austria UA Change
Current Austria UA:
+50% bonus from CS quests. May arrange marriages with allied CS using gold (not explicitly noted, cost: 500 gold, +100 per previous marriage). While at peace with CS, marriages increasing resting CS influence by 200, grant 1 vote, and boost GP generation in the capital by 15%.
Proposal:
+50% bonus from CS quests. May arrange marriages with allied CS using gold (not explicitly noted, cost: 500 gold, +100 per previous marriage). While at peace with CS, marriages increasing resting CS influence by 200, grant 1 vote per 3 marriages, and boost GP generation in the capital by 15%.
Rationale:
It's agreed upon here that Austria requires a nerf based on player experience and a consistently highly placed spot in a set of AI only games (although I would say that humans would be able to more easily fight against a diplomatic victory threat as opposed to other victory pursuits, so results would not necessarily transfer to human games and could overstate Austria's dominance).
This nerf is straightforward and curbs one of the more oppressive visible components of the UA, while still giving a noticeable edge in the most important victory pursuit of Austria.
It differs in the original proposal by being more straightforward to implement and not altering the way Austria has played before. I would disagree with the original proposal that +50% bonus from CS quests is a sideshow. In fact it is already quite powerful and sufficiently nudges Austrian players to care more about quests and go more out of their way to try and complete them. The tauted "more strategic" choice in choosing when to marry and then decide what resting influence is kept on there overcomplicates an already complicated unique mechanic to this civ. I don't think that Austria needs to be shown to be even more diplomacy focused in gaining 1 diplomat point and losing 5% GP generation. Lastly, increasing WC votes in some manner is an unique mechanic that makes Austria stand out and frankly I'd say that at least one diplomatic civ should have such a kind of an ability.
VP Congress: Session 5, Proposal 25b
Proposer: @azum4roll
Discussion Thread: (5-30b) Counterproposal: Austria UA nerf
Current Austria UA:
+50% rewards from
City-State Quests. May arrange Marriages with Allied City-States using 
Gold. While at peace with the City-State, Marriages increase resting 
Influence by 200, grant 1 Extra World Congress Delegate, and boost 
Great People generation in the 
Capital by 15%.
Marriage cost:
500 Gold + 100 per previous marriage (including dead CS), scaling with game speed.
Proposed Austria UA:
+50% rewards from City-State Quests. May arrange Marriages with Allied City-States using Gold. While at peace with the City-State, Marriages increase resting Influence by 200 and boost Great People generation in the Capital by 15%.
Marriage cost:
200 Gold + 200 per previous marriage (including dead CS), scaling with game speed.
The cost breaks even at 6 marriages.
Rationale:
Austria only needs a nerf. Removing the extra vote and increasing the later marriage cost (so it costs more to marry later on) are the only things that need to be changed.
VP Congress: Session 5, Proposal 25c
Proposer: @Anarcomu
Discussion Thread: (5-30c) Counterproposal : Austria UA Change
Current Austria UA :
+50% rewards from City-State Quests. May arrange Marriages with Allied City-States using Gold. While at peace with the City-State, Marriages increase resting Influence by 200, grant 1 Extra World Congress Delegate, and boost Great People generation in the Capital by 15%.
Marriage cost : 500 Gold + 100 per previous marriage (including dead CS), scaling with game speed.
Proposed Austria UA :
+50% rewards from City-State Quests. May arrange Marriages with Allied City-States using Gold. While at peace with the City-State, Marriages increase resting Influence by 75, scaling with era, and boost Great People generation in the Capital by 15%.
Marriage cost : 200 Gold + 200 per previous marriage (including dead CS), scaling with game speed.
Rational:
There were complains about Austria having its influence slowly increasing back to 200 in the early game (well, no more) ; plus, the loss of that extra vote is strong enough that it could get some bonuses somewhere else. So it gets a weaker early resting influence, and a stronger late-game influence matching the 500 max from original proposal.
VP Congress: Session 5, Proposal 25d
Proposer: @DoveCDog
Discussion Thread: (5-30d) Counterproposal Austria UA Change
Current Austria UA:
+50% rewards from City-State quests. May arrange Marriages with allied City-States using gold (not explicitly noted, cost: 500 gold, +100 per previous marriage). While at peace with the City-State, Marriages increase resting influence by 200, boost Great People generation in the capital by 15%, and grant 1 Extra World Congress Delegate.
Proposal:
+50% rewards from City-State quests. May arrange Marriages with allied City-States using gold (not explicitly noted, cost: [200 gold, +50 per previous marriage] scaling with era). While at peace with the City-State, Marriages increase resting influence by 200, boost Great People generation in the capital by 15%, and grant 1 Extra World Congress Delegate for Austrian embassies in the City-State.
Rationale:
Austria needs a nerf. Marriages are unnecessarily expensive in the early game, and far too cheap in the late game. By having the cost scale with era, we can resolve both the issues.
1 delegate per embassy (as suggested by u/Solic) will a) reduce the amount of votes Austria gets, b) force the player to decide between using their Great Diplomats to ally another City-State or get more votes, c) allow opponents to counter by creating their embassies first.
Players, please cast your votes in the poll above. Vote "Yea" for every proposal you'd be okay with if it were implemented. Vote "Nay" if you'd be okay if these proposals weren't implemented. You can vote for any number of options.
All votes are public. If you wish, you can discuss your choice(s) in the thread below. You can change your vote as many times as you want until the poll closes.
VP Congress: Session 5, Proposal 25
Proposer: @Stalker0
Current Austria UA
+50% bonus from CS quests. May arrange marriages with allied CS using gold (not explicitly noted, cost: 500 gold, +100 per previous marriage). While at peace with CS, marriages increasing resting CS influence by 200, grant 1 vote, and boost GP generation in the capital by 15%.
Proposal
Rationale
Austria is commonly cited as one of the most "oppresive" Civs, as her vote bonus from marriages can give her such an overwhelming WC advantage that the only way to stop her is extermination. This is further backed up by the AI results data, which shows Austria routinely in the top 3 civs version after version. Austria's need for a nerf is clear.
This proposal removes her vote bonus, the source of her oppression. Her quest bonus has been increased to make this the focus of her diplomatic playstyle. The bonus has now gone from a nice bonus to something that will help shape her play and so keeping the CS "happy" by completing quests will now be a core part of Austria's strength....rather than a sideshow. Her general GP bonus has been further weakened, to make her quest bonus more of the focus.
The change to her resting influence is meant to provide a strategic tradeoff between how fast she chooses to marry a civ. She can marry early at a lower influence rate, or push influence higher to get a really strong resting influence rate with the civ.
VP Congress: Session 5, Proposal 25a
Proposer: @Solic
Discussion Thread: (5-30a) Counterproposal Austria UA Change
Current Austria UA:
+50% bonus from CS quests. May arrange marriages with allied CS using gold (not explicitly noted, cost: 500 gold, +100 per previous marriage). While at peace with CS, marriages increasing resting CS influence by 200, grant 1 vote, and boost GP generation in the capital by 15%.
Proposal:
+50% bonus from CS quests. May arrange marriages with allied CS using gold (not explicitly noted, cost: 500 gold, +100 per previous marriage). While at peace with CS, marriages increasing resting CS influence by 200, grant 1 vote per 3 marriages, and boost GP generation in the capital by 15%.
Rationale:
It's agreed upon here that Austria requires a nerf based on player experience and a consistently highly placed spot in a set of AI only games (although I would say that humans would be able to more easily fight against a diplomatic victory threat as opposed to other victory pursuits, so results would not necessarily transfer to human games and could overstate Austria's dominance).
This nerf is straightforward and curbs one of the more oppressive visible components of the UA, while still giving a noticeable edge in the most important victory pursuit of Austria.
It differs in the original proposal by being more straightforward to implement and not altering the way Austria has played before. I would disagree with the original proposal that +50% bonus from CS quests is a sideshow. In fact it is already quite powerful and sufficiently nudges Austrian players to care more about quests and go more out of their way to try and complete them. The tauted "more strategic" choice in choosing when to marry and then decide what resting influence is kept on there overcomplicates an already complicated unique mechanic to this civ. I don't think that Austria needs to be shown to be even more diplomacy focused in gaining 1 diplomat point and losing 5% GP generation. Lastly, increasing WC votes in some manner is an unique mechanic that makes Austria stand out and frankly I'd say that at least one diplomatic civ should have such a kind of an ability.
VP Congress: Session 5, Proposal 25b
Proposer: @azum4roll
Discussion Thread: (5-30b) Counterproposal: Austria UA nerf
Current Austria UA:
+50% rewards from
City-State Quests. May arrange Marriages with Allied City-States using Gold. While at peace with the City-State, Marriages increase resting Influence by 200, grant 1 Extra World Congress Delegate, and boost Great People generation in the Capital by 15%.Marriage cost:
500
Gold + 100 per previous marriage (including dead CS), scaling with game speed.Proposed Austria UA:
+50% rewards from
City-State Quests. May arrange Marriages with Allied City-States using Gold. While at peace with the City-State, Marriages increase resting Influence by 200 and boost Great People generation in the Capital by 15%.Marriage cost:
200
Gold + 200 per previous marriage (including dead CS), scaling with game speed.The cost breaks even at 6 marriages.
Spoiler Cumulative gold cost for X marriages :
Rationale:
Austria only needs a nerf. Removing the extra vote and increasing the later marriage cost (so it costs more to marry later on) are the only things that need to be changed.
VP Congress: Session 5, Proposal 25c
Proposer: @Anarcomu
Discussion Thread: (5-30c) Counterproposal : Austria UA Change
Current Austria UA :
+50% rewards from
City-State Quests. May arrange Marriages with Allied City-States using Gold. While at peace with the City-State, Marriages increase resting Influence by 200, grant 1 Extra World Congress Delegate, and boost Great People generation in the Capital by 15%.Marriage cost : 500
Gold + 100 per previous marriage (including dead CS), scaling with game speed.Proposed Austria UA :
+50% rewards from
City-State Quests. May arrange Marriages with Allied City-States using Gold. While at peace with the City-State, Marriages increase resting Influence by 75, scaling with era, and boost Great People generation in the Capital by 15%.Marriage cost : 200
Gold + 200 per previous marriage (including dead CS), scaling with game speed.Rational:
There were complains about Austria having its influence slowly increasing back to 200 in the early game (well, no more) ; plus, the loss of that extra vote is strong enough that it could get some bonuses somewhere else. So it gets a weaker early resting influence, and a stronger late-game influence matching the 500 max from original proposal.
VP Congress: Session 5, Proposal 25d
Proposer: @DoveCDog
Discussion Thread: (5-30d) Counterproposal Austria UA Change
Current Austria UA:
+50% rewards from City-State quests. May arrange Marriages with allied City-States using gold (not explicitly noted, cost: 500 gold, +100 per previous marriage). While at peace with the City-State, Marriages increase resting influence by 200, boost Great People generation in the capital by 15%, and grant 1 Extra World Congress Delegate.
Proposal:
+50% rewards from City-State quests. May arrange Marriages with allied City-States using gold (not explicitly noted, cost: [200 gold, +50 per previous marriage] scaling with era). While at peace with the City-State, Marriages increase resting influence by 200, boost Great People generation in the capital by 15%, and grant 1 Extra World Congress Delegate for Austrian embassies in the City-State.
Rationale:
Austria needs a nerf. Marriages are unnecessarily expensive in the early game, and far too cheap in the late game. By having the cost scale with era, we can resolve both the issues.
1 delegate per embassy (as suggested by u/Solic) will a) reduce the amount of votes Austria gets, b) force the player to decide between using their Great Diplomats to ally another City-State or get more votes, c) allow opponents to counter by creating their embassies first.
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