A Challenge

[Sarisin]

OK, I am a few turns away from building the Form of the Titan in my capital city of Thariss. Out of the blue the Sidar builds it in Celo.

I challenge anyone to tell me how they did it without cheating.

Just hit ENTER in the save I have attached. You can open the World Builder before doing that and see Celo has 4 turns to build a Ghost. Also, I have placed one of my Workers there to show they do NOT have a Great Engineer to hurry production.

The next turn they build the wonder and I get the Gold.

If this isn't outright cheating by the AI in (a) knowing what you are building and (b) fabricating an impossible build, well, I'll eat an Orc.

Bah humbug, AI!

 

[Sephi]

I hope for you that you like Orc

In the save attached Celo already has build the Form of the Titan. You just get your money one turn later.

 

[Breez]

You don't get the gold on the same turn they finish, you get it a turn or 2 later

 

[sylvain5477]

Think I read some similar pb a while ago, but didn't know it waited several turns before saying the wonder was already built.

 

[Sarisin]

I don't know. I went back to Turn 198 when Celo started building the Wonder. It's pop. was 9 and it said 13 Turns.

It's pop in Turn 211 was also 9.

It seems that it should have been built on Turn 211, not Turn 210. How could it have been built the turn before?

1. Turn 199
2. Turn 200
3. Turn 201
4. Turn 202
5. Turn 203
6. Turn 204
7. Turn 205
8. Turn 206
9. Turn 207
10. Turn 208
11. Turn 209
12. Turn 210
13. Turn 211

Or is it just a delay in reporting when the Wonder (all Wonders for that matter) was built?

Maybe I just don't understand how the AI turns work, or they picked up a couple of extra hammers (without the pop. increasing), but I don't get them building it Turn 210.

Oh well, no big deal. I guess I had just better see if they have Orc filet at the Shop Rite....

 

[odalrick]

I don't know. I went back to Turn 198 when Celo started building the Wonder. It's pop. was 9 and it said 13 Turns.

1. Turn 198
2. Turn 199
3. Turn 200
4. Turn 201
5. Turn 202
6. Turn 203
7. Turn 204
8. Turn 205
9. Turn 206
10. Turn 207
11. Turn 208
12. Turn 209
13. Turn 210

You said it started turn 198, not 199. You have to start counting from the beginning...

 

[sylvain5477]

Maybe chopping forest can add hammers also ?

 

[Valkrionn]

I don't know. I went back to Turn 198 when Celo started building the Wonder. It's pop. was 9 and it said 13 Turns.

It's pop in Turn 211 was also 9.

It seems that it should have been built on Turn 211, not Turn 210. How could it have been built the turn before?

1. Turn 199
2. Turn 200
3. Turn 201
4. Turn 202
5. Turn 203
6. Turn 204
7. Turn 205
8. Turn 206
9. Turn 207
10. Turn 208
11. Turn 209
12. Turn 210
13. Turn 211

Or is it just a delay in reporting when the Wonder (all Wonders for that matter) was built?

Maybe I just don't understand how the AI turns work, or they picked up a couple of extra hammers (without the pop. increasing), but I don't get them building it Turn 210.

Oh well, no big deal. I guess I had just better see if they have Orc filet at the Shop Rite....

Like Odalrick said, production starts from the first turn. Turn 198's production went to the wonder. Also, it's quite easy to cut a turn or two off if you change a citizen's plot or add another specialist.

 

[Nadrak]

Orc lover!!!!

 

[Sarisin]

Like Odalrick said, production starts from the first turn. Turn 198's production went to the wonder. Also, it's quite easy to cut a turn or two off if you change a citizen's plot or add another specialist.

And, this is my main source of confusion. When my turn comes at Turn 198, I would say the AI has already used its turn. In other words, Turn 198 would not count, but Turn 199 would. Doesn't the AI 'move' before you do? This would be its turn and the next turn, Turn 199, would be the first towards building the Wonder.

I think the AI would have used its Turn 198 (before me) to complete the Ghost it was building. It then selected Form of the Titan to build starting the next turn, or Turn 199.

I'm pretty sure that's how it works for me. If I build something, I choose my next build, and with the next turn the build time is reduced by 1 turn.

Yes, it could be hammers were gained by chopping, but I don't think it is the AI's style to adjust production during a build...unless, of course, it knew SOMEHOW what you were building and how many turns it would take. Cheating again, dammit!

So, I don't have to eat that orc.

 

[lemonjelly]

AI move after you...
Turn 1, you have settler, scout, warrior.
You settle settler.

Then the AI move and settle, after you.

That's how it works for me...

 

[odalrick]

I think the AI would have used its Turn 198 (before me) to complete the Ghost it was building. It then selected Form of the Titan to build starting the next turn, or Turn 199.

I'm pretty sure that's how it works for me. If I build something, I choose my next build, and with the next turn the build time is reduced by 1 turn.

No, you set something to be built and when you end your turn the production is applied to the build. Then the computer moves, builds, ends turn et cetera.

Short answer, production happens at the end of the turn, not the beginning.

 

[Sarisin]

Thanks for trying to explain this to a dumb Orc-Eater.

So, you're saying then, when you build a unit, say a Warrior, the unit was actually built the turn before (using the hammers then), but you do not see the Warrior until the NEXT turn.

Then, after the Warrior appears, you decide to build a building, say a Granary, and those hammers would be applied to the building the turn you select to build it?

Make sense?

 

[Breez]

Correct.

As a matter of fact you can test this yourself.

In world builder set up a city that can make a unit in 1 turn but has NO defenders. Put a barb directly next to the city.

Your unit will be built before the barb moves and will defend the city after you end your turn.

 

[Sarisin]

OK, thanks.

Amazing that I have played countless games and never realized this was how it worked.

I guess it makes sense now and I'll think about these things during my next game.

I gotta find some sauce to make that Orc tasty.

 

[Deon]

Bon appetite .